3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[Old___Slow]

I have what must be the latest model c46540. It came from partsamerica.com and was delivered by UPS. In this thread a have read the stories of major damage to units shipped by various transport. When I first looked at the carton....panic struck me. Then the process of opening began. I soon discovered, there are two cartons, a forwarding one added by partsamerica and the factory one. The factory carton was over stuffed with plenty of added material, anyway the Champion genset carton was upside down in the one from partsamerica. As I opened the factory carton I found a well packed unit. Preformed styrofoam and the two RED metal braces which secured the engine to the frame and must be removed, did a great job. No damage to report. I have now placed it on the genset tray that came with the Itaska MH. I had previously done a retrofit with simple slide out rails. It has now been fired up and low and behold the a/c, electric refg. and MV along with TV will all operate at the same time. Volt meter reading 110+ Now I really am a CHAMP man. If they send me a flag I'll raise it.

[SonicLogic]

Old & Slow wrote:
Please tell us which on fits the champion (the drain tube from Northern Tool)

The 6.5 HP engine on the Champion is a clone of the Honda GX-200. Therefore you need the 10mm drain hose Model #HON1010.

[MrWizard]

well i just changed the oil 2 days ago, the old fashion way, i wasn't thinking about measuring the drain plug & hole, how about the next guy that changes oil measure it and post it.

I just measure the size of the bolt head of the plug and it is 12mm, i would say the drain hole is 10mm, so i don't know which one to order

[Old___Slow]

Please tell us which on fits the champion (the drain tube from Northern Tool)

[bugdude]

So which one fits the Champion?

This

or

This

[Old___Slow]

Where can we find heavy duty 24" slide rails for genset compartments?

[Old___Slow]

slick, Thanks' I'll drive all the way (it's far) to Northern to get the Ext. oil drain to save all the mess. This is a great find for me.

[donandmax]

I bought a hitch haul plugged it in to my trailer hitch and carry it on the back of my MH. Don't know what to say if your towing a TT.
The hitch haul is rated for 500 pounds. My Champion is around 100 lbs. I would suspect

[MrWizard]

the champion doesn't have have the big shrouded blower of the ONAN, it needs to be out in the open for proper ventilation, keeping it in the compartment, with only an open bottom with the 3 sides and the top sealed off, is going to present a real cooling challenge, those attempting to build standalone sound encloseures at least have access to all sides to work out the ventilation problems

I don't advise leaving it boxed in, even with fans blowing & sucking, you will have reflective radiant heat staying in the compartment

as for the sliding tray, the heavy duty sliding rails can be purcahsed for less than a complete system, mount them on top od the exsiting tray and add a new plate to them for mounting the generator, you may need to modify any portion of the exterior wall that would block the slide this can be done by cutting it and then using a piano style hinge to turn it it into a drop down door to open out of the way, 2 sliding dead bolt cabinet latches on the inside to keep it closed, only acessiable after you open the main compartment door

I did something simialr for the battery comart door on the front of the MH, open the main hatch, then relaes the catches for the drop down to make access for the bigger batteries ( 2 trojan t-125's )

[Yoslick]

Here's an extension drain for the gen set I got from Northern Tool

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200311061_200311061&issearch=7011...



Slick!

[bugdude]

Here You Go!

[Old___Slow]

Mr Wizard,

I also ask for any input from other folks on the subject of using the genset tray that came with your RV from the factory. My Itaska came with a Onan. I have a long story about the process I went through to try getting it repaired. I spent about $700.00 on parts only to find out after taking it to a Onan repair place, the cost to fix it would be apx. $1600.00. I trashed it and began my search for a replacement. That brought me to RV.Net and what a great service to all us folks. You Mr. Wizard I thank for all this free info. To all the others, thanks.

Now I'll get on subject. Your picture posted using the sliding tray reinforced my thinking that this space was useable. It's my honest feeling the RV dealers are not the right people to sell the Electric Start Champ. It seems to me they keep there doors open from CHUMPS like me who need Genset repair. I want to be a CHAMP. Their priceing the Electric Start units high like everthing else they sell. So maybe the CHUMP croud (and it's a crouded field) will just suffer any go there way. Anyway I might some day post my design for the retrofit sliding tray. Please some one give us your possible design in print or thought. The idea of leaving the door open is a good one however it is my hope to use this space to help lower the sound. Please, every one, give us your findings.

[MrWizard]

Old & Slow wrote:
Mr. wizard:

Re: Sliding tray

I checked PPL and their price for a 36" is $349.95. This is way far out of my league. I am now in the process of replacing my old Onan ($2000.00 est for repairs) with a 46540 from CKS @ 340.97 to my door with tax and shipping. The 10% discount is still good. Code GEICOTEN I like the idea of having the Electric Start but the Local RV Dealer is pricing it @ $678.00 so there again, out of my league. Back to the Genset tray, I have designed a retrofit slider perhaps to be marketed at some future time. I want to see the temps with the 46540 in place. The local Onan dealer told me using the tray from the Onan is not going to work. We will see. Maybe you can give a report on this subject. I will use a small fan blowing on the unit. There seems to be plenty of ventilation area. Here is hoping I will be another (Champ) guy. All because of the need to save the $$$'s

good luck, i hope your design works

I always pull the slide out to run the generator, this means I cannot use it while driving.

the door can be used as a 'roof' if its raining

[racefan1965]

I have a old half pallet and use the bottom of milk jug. I place the jug inside the pallet, loosen and remove the drain plug and let the oil drain through the pallet slat into the jug bottom. I then use a long funnel to refill. It only hold .63 quarts so it doesn't take long to drain or fill.

Rick

[Oldfordman]

freeatlast wrote:
While we're at it, I have only used my gen for 1-2 hours total so far (in between the 2 replacement AVR's:)). What is the easiest way to change the oil?

I put mine up on a Black and Decker Workmate (fancy name for a complicated saw-horse) and drain the oil into a pan set on the floor. Another way if you don't want to lift too high is to put a couple of blocks under the frame and drain into a cake pan (crankcase holds only part of a quart). Then fill using the funnel that came with it.

Northern Tool also sells a drain hose that fits the Honda series like this engine. Someone posted a picture about 150 or so pages back:W