Brake vibration / tugging

[docnascar]

Sadly , my 2012 Coachmen Apex 18bh has a vibration when I apply the brakes. The dealer told me that this was normal. Being new at travel trailers I took them for their word and brought the camper home (740+ miles away). Why did I do that? :h (I know why, just can't admit it.) We’ve only been on two camping trips and on our last camping trip we were going down some good grades and hitting the brakes did not make me feel comfortable. The camper is stopping and I can feel the brakes pulling to slow down, but the vibration and tugging (tug-release-tug-release, etc..) on my truck right before stopping drives me nuts. I have a feeling that maybe the drums are out of round. I've also read that the drums could get warped if the wheels are improperly over torqued during installation.

I do not want to drive 740+ miles back to the dealer and have to drop of my camper for repairs. I've called the dealer a few times but it has gone nowhere. I am going to try one more time and force the topic. My dealer has not asked me to bring my camper in, but if they do I would rather prefer to take my camper to a local shop and have them look at it and possibly repair it. Driving that 740+ miles is a major inconvenience and a major cost.

Worse case, if I can’ t get anyone to fix it for free what is the going rate to have the drums replaced? At least its only two wheels and not four.

Hopefully I can get this issue resolved and its covered under warranty and I'm praying my dealer works with me. I was wondering what others thought.

[docnascar]

I took the camper in for service and I believe this issue has been resolved. I wanted to post an update.

The shop mic'd out the drums and they were fine. After working with Lipert (which they said was a nightmare) they had to replace the electronics in the brakes. (They may have just replaced the entire assembly) The exact issue was unknown, but all seems well now.

Luckily it was covered under warranty.

[docnascar]

Ending up replace my brake controller (went to a P2) and checked the wiring. Still have the same issue. I guess I need to get a dealer to check this out. I'm still suspecting the drums are warped. Don't see how that can be a new a camper but I guess anything is possible.

[Almot]

If it's made same way as the one I've seen, operating the slide doesn't activate the trailer brakes. It only changes the max breaking power. To apply the brakes by hand, you need to push that big red "panic button" - and then, yes, the timing will be disabled and all the braking force will be applied instantly. Your controller instructions probably will tell about this, timed controllers are not all created equal.

[beemerphile1]

docnascar wrote:

...Does using the slide disable the timing feature?

What are the conclusions if:
Using the slide there is still tugging, what does this tell me? (guessing mechanical issue??)
Using the slide there is no tugging, what does this tell me? (guessing controller issue??)

Correct, the timer isn't working when using the slide.

You are likely correct on your hypothesis, although other than controller or mechanical there is also the possibility of an electrical issue between the controller and brake units.

[docnascar]

beemerphile1 wrote:

docnascar wrote:
I have the Hayes 81760 brake controller...

That is a time based controller.

You said that it jerks when you are almost stopped. If it was a problem with the brakes it would jerk all the time.

Lighten the setting on the controller and learn to keep your foot on the brake. Odds are you are unknowingly releasing and engaging the brakes over and over when you are almost stopped.

To test the theory use the manual slide and do not step on the TV brakes. Does it still jerk?

Lightening the settings makes no difference. Also, I have paid very close attention to not letting up on the brakes and reapplying so I get what you are saying but I get the same results.

Using just the manual slide to stop the entire rig I haven't really done at speed or distance. I have only used it to check the brakes are working and can bring the rig to a stop; and basically there was no distance to travel so I didn't pay attention to or realize any vibration/tugging.

Thanks for the idea. I can try the slide only again with more speed and some distance to stop. Trying this may take some time as my neighborhood is getting new gas mains and traveling with a TT and truck through my neighborhood will be tricky and/or impossible at times. You have me thinking though...

Does using the slide disable the timing feature?

What are the conclusions if:
Using the slide there is still tugging, what does this tell me? (guessing mechanical issue??)
Using the slide there is no tugging, what does this tell me? (guessing controller issue??)

[Almot]

Those don't show any "error code". Only the braking power (in some mysterious units of measure).

[beemerphile1]

docnascar wrote:
I have the Hayes 81760 brake controller...

That is a time based controller.

You said that it jerks when you are almost stopped. If it was a problem with the brakes it would jerk all the time.

Lighten the setting on the controller and learn to keep your foot on the brake. Odds are you are unknowingly releasing and engaging the brakes over and over when you are almost stopped.

To test the theory use the manual slide and do not step on the TV brakes. Does it still jerk?

[docnascar]

I have the Hayes 81760 brake controller. I did not install it, the dealer did.

I don't get any error codes.

The directions say for:
Intermittent or surging brakes - improperly grounded, out of round brake drums, worn wheel bearings.

[Sidney911]

Since they are electric. Make sure you have a good ground running from the truck to the trailer frame/brakes. If your ground wire is not getting a good connection, it will ground thru the hitch. That may be your problem.

Sid

[Lynnmor]

Take the drums to a local automotive machine shop or brake shop and have them turned. Call them first to make sure that they are equipped to handle trailer brake drums.
I have found that most trailer drums have too much runout even when new.

[SDcampowneroper]

If you are getting an OL code then momentary brake, then OL code again, you have a short. My prodigy controller showed this. Twice, 2 different wheels. Both times it was a wire come loose from its clips and rubbing on the drum Dexter axle was very good about sending new magnets and upgraded wire clips.
In the meantime, I just taped and rerouted the wires to continue our trip.
A compass is your simplest diagnostic tool, in an intermittent case like mine, you may have to pull wheels and hope the first is the culprit.

[Almot]

Chuck&Gail wrote:
If you have a Voyager brake controller, I'll bet that is the problem. I threw mine in the garbage after our first big trip. My Prodigy works great.

Jerking and tugging - my first suspect would be a controller, but who knows, could be something else...

It's not Voyager vs Prodigy, but about "timed" vs "inertial". Models under $80 are usually timed. Prodigy has one $80 timed model, and it's not any better than $40 no-name timed models. Meaning - not too good, though it's OK for a small trailer.

The problem with some timed models is that pulsating current from turn signals is making its way somehow into the controller circuit, causing the brake vibrate/tug when you turn. But if it's vibrating on straight sections, then I don't know. Timed models produce the power after half a second delay, quickly but gradually increasing breaking power from 0 to max setting of the controller. The higher the setting, the harder it will press the brake pads when it reaches the full power. You can also adjust the time setting (on all but very cheap timed models), i.e. how fast this max power is achieved after you've pressed the pedal.

[beemerphile1]

I'm guessing you have a timer based controller. When you activate the brake lights the trailer brakes come full on at whatever setting you are using. If you want to continue using that controller you need to learn to step on the brake pedal and stay on it. Every time you let up and then step on the brake pedal the controller starts over again.

An inertia controller like the Prodigy will make the jerking go away.

What brand and model brake controller do you have?

[Chuck_Gail]

If you have a Voyager brake controller, I'll bet that is the problem. I threw mine in the garbage after our first big trip. My Prodigy works great.