generator damages AC, other electornics

[Timeking]

I have a Champion dual-fuel 3400 gen. I contacted the manufacturer and asked what happens when/if it runs out of fuel. Answer was that both the gen and everything electronic connected could/would be damaged.

Huh?!?

If this is so, I intend to sell the gen and get something that has 'intelligent' shut-down, i.e., if is is going to run out of fuel or turn off because of low oil, shut down the power BEFORE the motor shuts down.

Duh!!

Is any of this nonsense accurate?

[valhalla360]

Timeking wrote:
That is what I am thinking, that the Champions are poor copies, and I should have gotten a Honda or Yamaha. ??? Seems stupid that the same technologies used in one unit would not be used in another. Perhaps I was fooled by the cheaper price?

Did you even read the responses? Honda & Yamaha have the same warnings. It's all a CYA that they know you will never follow.

For startup, it's good to have the heavy loads turned off (same plugging into shore power).

For shutdown, if you are manually shutting it down, good practice to turn off the major loads.

But from a practical point of view, you are going to run out of fuel and it will shut down while under load. I've been doing it for years and I've never heard of anyone having any issues as a result.

First Generator....Yamaha 2400. Current generator....Champion 4500 dual fuel.

[theoldwizard1]

way2roll wrote:
How would anything be damaged? It would be no different than a power outage. Sounds like a CYA response.

Concur !

Timeking wrote:

If this is so, I intend to sell the gen and get something that has 'intelligent' shut-down, i.e., if is is going to run out of fuel or turn off because of low oil, shut down the power BEFORE the motor shuts down.

I have NEVER heard of a generator that has that feature !

[wa8yxm]

way2roll wrote:
How would anything be damaged? It would be no different than a power outage. Sounds like a CYA response.

Though inclined to agree there are a few things that can happen on a traditional generator (NOT on an Inverter generator) So I will describe fuel fail on both.

An inverter generator uses an alternator to make DC which it then converts electronically to AC if the engine stops.. The output stops "CLICK" style (like the breaker tripped or you turned off a switch) No harm.

On the "Traditional" The generator runs at a constant speed and makes 120V 60HZ or whatever (Different standards elsewhere this is USA/NA standard) but when it runs out of fuel the speed and thus HZ drops.. this can. in theory. bother some stuff.. In practice.. Never seen it happen... also it can sputter. surge a time or two and the voltage may fluculate.. Again... I've never seen damage from "out of gas" fluculations.

Now PORTABLE generators.. Like open frame contractors... Well some years back the American Radio Relay League put 'em on a scope.. Some of those were downright scary and may damage electronics (You need to be a member and good at searching to find the article.. it's in the QST Archives) Inverter generators.. Clean and sweet.

(NOTE not all.. I used to have a 1,000 Generac (Forget who made it... Oh. Briggs & Stratton I think) that I scoped.. Looked good after the first tank of Gas.. Not so good on first (New out of box) Start.

I do know why.

[jkwilson]

Nothing special about the Champions. Every manufacturer has a similar warning and similar risk of damage.

How exactly would a generator know it was getting ready to run out of fuel until the instant there was no fuel? And how would the generator do a “smart shutdown”? It’s the equipment that needs to be turned off.

The answer is simple: Pay attention to how much fuel you have and shut equipment off to refuel before the tank is empty.

[Timeking]

That is what I am thinking, that the Champions are poor copies, and I should have gotten a Honda or Yamaha. ??? Seems stupid that the same technologies used in one unit would not be used in another. Perhaps I was fooled by the cheaper price?

Not really sure how to test the Champion, to see whether the manufacturer 'knows' what they are talking about, or perhaps risking $$$ to find out they were correct. I hate this stuff. Many things to worry about rather than the gen, believe me.

[ktmrfs]

at least with my honda 2000 and honda 2200 I've had them run out of fuel and shut down dozens and dozens of times while powering the trailer. Never been an issue.

And I don't think I've EVER disconnected the power before turning them off. Hundreds and hundreds of times. Just hit the power switch.

And unless it is very cold out I usually start it with the power cord plugged in.

Never been anything I worried about.

Fellow campers with the "blue one" (Yamaha) have done the same.

[BB_TX]

Honda manual has similar statements about turning off all devices before starting or stopping their generator. But no caution or warning about potential damage.

Oops. I was 2 minutes too late.

[opnspaces]

My Honda eu2000i inverter generator also says to turn off and unplug all loads before turning it off. It's run out of gas and regularly been turned off without unplugging the loads first with no damage.

I second this is just nothing more than a CYA from the manufacturer.

[Timeking]

It is an inverter gen. It even says in the owner's manual "Turn off and unplug all electrical loads. Never start or stop the generator with electrical devices plugged in or turned on."

It is not possible, or feasible, to check on fuel/oil level when running to make sure stuff doesn't get damaged. It is hard for me to believe that the thing does not (or maybe does) have a 'smart' disconnect feature.

I posted this because I figure someone had a gen run out of fuel/oil and stop with the AC running ... and can provide assurance that this is all BS.

[bgum]

I understood that was true for a generator that used rpm to determine voltage but not true for modern inverter generators.

[way2roll]

How would anything be damaged? It would be no different than a power outage. Sounds like a CYA response.