Generator sizing issues?

[95jersey]

I have a 2017 Jayco 273 Toy Hauler (30 amp) with a single 13,500 BTU AC (according to their website). It has gas/electric water heater and fridge, micro, 2 (TV's), digital antenna, stereo and LED lights.

I occasionally dry camp and use my Harbor Freight Generator (4000/3200) to run the AC and assorted electronics (water pump, TV, stereo). I try to run the water heater and fridge on gas during these trips. Please no inverter recommendations, not interested in spending the money at this point.

I have run the generator right from the RV power cord as well as tried extension cords (10 guage) to run the generator further from the camper, with mixed success.

With the extension cord, the generator will overload occasionally and "pop the breaker" with the AC on. I have to go outside and reset the fuse. Sometimes this rarely happens and sometimes it happens frequently. I don't get why its so haphazard.

If I don't run an extension cord, it is more reliable, but will still occasionally "pop the breaker". I try to only run the minimal while running the AC such as (lights, water pump, maybe stereo/tv).

The manual says 13,500 BTU AC, but there was an optional 15,000 BTU available from the factory. I bought mine used so not sure which one it has. Also, it never "pops" at start up, it is usually when it has been running for a bit. So it seems the generator has enough power to get the AC going without issue. It is just a random breaker pop for no reason. It never pop's the camper fuse, just the generator.

So few questions...

1)why is the fuse popping more often with an extension cord? how long can you run an extension cord and what size to prevent this?

2)do I need to up size my generator to prevent further overloads? or do I have another issue with the RV?

Harbor Freight has a 4250/3500 and 6500/5500 in my budget. I would rather get the 4250/3500 as it is cheaper/smaller and more quiet, but I don't want to buy it and just have the same issue. They have a 6500/5500 for another $90, but it is another 40lbs heavier and 4db louder.

[Gdetrailer]

wa8yxm wrote:

1)why is the fuse popping more often with an extension cord? how long can you run an extension cord and what size to prevent this?

The extension cord adds two things. Additional resistance, = more voltage drop this can cause the A/C to take just a fraction longer to start and trip goes the breaker. IT ALSO ADDS A VERY SMALL LOAD yes. a cord even with nothing plugged in presents a very tiny load to the generator.

2)do I need to up size my generator to prevent further overloads? or do I have another issue with the RV?

I think you are good. just need earplugs for that generator.. Since it's not trippign the breaker when you don't extend the cord you should be good.

One other thing are you using a 30 amp extension cord or a 16 Ga Outdoor "15 amp".. Upping to a 12 ga cord may help or better yet a 30 amp extension cord. I have one of those cause from time to time.. I need it.

OPs current HF gen is barely able to supply the RUNNING current of a 13.5K A/C unit, it is so on the edge of not working I have serious doubts that it would work in the heat of summer.. Let alone anything else in the RV running without totally rewiring the entire RV to 120/240 then splitting the entire RV loads between the two 120V feeds of the gen.

Has NOTHING to do with extension cords, voltage drop, resistance or the position of the sun, moon and stars but has everything to do with the gen simply not having quite enough wattage capacity on the ONE out of two 120V windings..

OR they could do a TOTAL rewire of the gen head in order to get full rated gen wattage on one 120V output.

Rewiring the HF gen without a proper wiring diagram is "sketchy" at best, at worst risking a totally fried gen head. Not for the faint of heart and if I remember correctly there was a RV.net member a few years back that attempted a rewire of the same HF gen with zero success.. Couldn't get the gen to produce more than a few volts after rewiring..

OR, seems to me the BETTER "idea" is toto scrap the current HF 240/120V gen and go get a gen which is ALREADY WIRED AS 120V ONLY as the OP HAS decided.

OP IS making a WISE decision in ditching the HF 240/120V gen and buying a factory prewired 120V ONLY gen..

[95jersey]

Home Depot had a new years eve sale for $229...amazing. 30 Amp single phase RV outlet and 69db. Sold, got it coming in a couple weeks.

[wa8yxm]

1)why is the fuse popping more often with an extension cord? how long can you run an extension cord and what size to prevent this?

The extension cord adds two things. Additional resistance, = more voltage drop this can cause the A/C to take just a fraction longer to start and trip goes the breaker. IT ALSO ADDS A VERY SMALL LOAD yes. a cord even with nothing plugged in presents a very tiny load to the generator.

2)do I need to up size my generator to prevent further overloads? or do I have another issue with the RV?

I think you are good. just need earplugs for that generator.. Since it's not trippign the breaker when you don't extend the cord you should be good.

One other thing are you using a 30 amp extension cord or a 16 Ga Outdoor "15 amp".. Upping to a 12 ga cord may help or better yet a 30 amp extension cord. I have one of those cause from time to time.. I need it.

[2oldman]

95jersey wrote:
my HF4000 is 71dB and it is fine. 69 is just icing on the cake

Then I guess you're all set.

[95jersey]

2oldman wrote:

95jersey wrote:
it is Decibel Rating < 69 db. That is pretty **** good for the money.

If you can stand it, fine. "<69 db" is loud for any amount of money...and that's probably a very optimistic rating. Hope you have a strong back.

I'd see if you can get that $100 first.

my HF4000 is 71dB and it is fine. 69 is just icing on the cake

[Gdetrailer]

95jersey..

By the way, I remembered that I also have a video of my 8750W gen. I made the video to show the difference with the sound level with a shelter and non shelter and also the actual sound level of mainly just the exhaust.

Typically a lot of folks think that a better muffler can fix the noise of the gen when in reality the exhaust is actually the lesser of the evils..

You really didn't want to bump up to a larger gen..

Gen video link

Nuts, stupid Google drive now no longer supports MP4 format, you will have to download then play it..

[MrWizard]

Because they are designed as job site generators
Where there will be several extension cords plugged into several outlets, and several heavy power tools being used by different workers
Drills and saws

The power is divided so each 10-12 amp tool has power

Power rating is total power, not all power at one outlet

[Gdetrailer]

2oldman wrote:

95jersey wrote:
it is Decibel Rating < 69 db. That is pretty **** good for the money.

If you can stand it, fine. "<69 db" is loud for any amount of money...and that's probably a very optimistic rating. Hope you have a strong back.

I'd see if you can get that $100 first.

Acutally 69DB is LESS than any builtin RV gen like Onans and a heck of a lot less cost..

And yes, 69 DB is a pretty accurate measurement for any Chinese clone engine in that size. My 10 yr old Buffalo Tools 4Kw gen I measured it at 67 DB which by the way IS quieter than even a gas engine pickup truck with stock factory pipes parked and at idle at 50ft (YES, I MEASURED BOTH)..

So, please, "noise police" bug off..

[2oldman]

95jersey wrote:
it is Decibel Rating < 69 db. That is pretty **** good for the money.

If you can stand it, fine. "<69 db" is loud for any amount of money...and that's probably a very optimistic rating. Hope you have a strong back.

I'd see if you can get that $100 first.

[95jersey]

2oldman wrote:
90lb and loud, but at least it has the RV outlet, which I assume will do the job. I think you'd be much happier with the inverter model.

according to buffalo tools, it is Decibel Rating < 69 db. That is pretty **** good for the money. Sell mine for $100 and for another $130 I am all set.

http://www.buffalotools.com/gen4000.html

[2oldman]

90lb and loud, but at least it has the RV outlet, which I assume will do the job. I think you'd be much happier with the inverter model.

[Gdetrailer]

95jersey wrote:
How does this one look? Has an RV plug and 120volt.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsman-4-000-3-500-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-Portable-Generator-with-RV-Outlet-801187/206403560

Yes, that lists 120V ONLY operation.

Direct 30A 120V RV plugin is an nice additional feature.

[95jersey]

How does this one look? Has an RV plug and 120volt.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsman-4-000-3-500-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-Portable-Generator-with-RV-O...

and this one...

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsman-3-000-2-800-Watt-Gasoline-Powered-Digital-Inverter-Generator-8...

[95jersey]

George3037 wrote:

95jersey wrote:

If I get the 6500/5500 unit would I get 2750 (5500/2)? That may be all I need, and it is 1/2 the price of the inverter.

As mentioned before, you don't need a 6500W generator. Way too heavy, noisy, and fuel thirsty to be hauling to the campsite. Also not allowed in many campgrounds due to the noise.
I have 2 generators to choose from for my camping needs. First is the Predator 3500W inverter generator (shown in the above post) and 2nd is a Champion #76533 dual fuel generator rated at 4750/3800W on gas and slightly less on propane. Both are 120V and have a trailer ready TT-30R plug on them. Either will run my TT but of course you have to watch what you turn on as to NOT exceed a 30amp or higher draw for any length of time. The Champ noise level is 68db @ 23' (I measured mine at 62db@ 25') and the Predator noise level is 57db @ 23' (mine measured 54db@25')

I don't need a 6500, but it is 1/2 the price and I would never use one at a campground, as I would just plug into their power. JI would only use it boondocking and can run an extension cable to get it away from the RV. However the HF3500 is the way to go if I can swing it.

[Gdetrailer]

95jersey wrote:
So just to be clear, the limit is the 13.3 amp per outlet, so moving to even 6500/5500 will be the same issue as the outlet does not exceed 13.3 amp? If this is the case why do they even sell these at higher wattage ratings...confused!?!

If I get the 6500/5500 unit would I get 2750 (5500/2)? That may be all I need, and it is 1/2 the price of the inverter.

5500W gen will get you 2750W or 22.9A on EACH of the Duplex outlets which IS still going to be the SAME ISSUE YOU ALREADY HAVE WITH YOUR CURRENT GEN.

A 13.5K BTU A/C is going to draw a min of 12A (1440W) when RUNNING, however the START UP SURGE of the compressor can easily exceed 20A when HOT. Add in any other loads and you are bound to come up short and having random gen breaker trips.

Something else to take into consideration is the AVR (automatic voltage regulator) which samples ONLY ONE of the 120V windings.. Plug into the side which is not sampled and you will have larger voltage swings..

So far by being cheap it IS costing you a lot of money in randomly buying undersized and wrongly wire gens.

Your HF 3200W gen right now is $339 and a 5500W gen is $489 for a grand total of $828 plus tax you have potentially wasted..

Sure, you CAN try to sell that 3200W HF gen, but, you ARE going to have a difficult time selling it AND you are going to have one heck of a time getting even $150 out of it..

People who buy used, buy it for CHEAP.

Put it another way, I HAD a 2000W Chinese built gen which I paid on sale for $175, it was too small for my camping, only had 120V so wouldn't help for home backup. I ran it for less than 5 hrs and it sat in my garage for 5 yrs unused..

I decided to sell it, placed ad on Craigslist for $125, months go by and not one call..

Sat it at the curb with for sale sign for several weeks, fellow stopped by and we agreed on $75..

Do yourself a huge favor, just go buy the HF inverter gen and be done with it..

If you not willing to spend for tan inverter gen you WILL need to look elsewhere for a gen which is 120V ONLY..

I have a Buffalo Tools 4Kw gen which is 120V ONLY that I use for my camping.. Not sure if they sell under that name anymore, seems to me they changed to "Sportsman" brand..

Looks like this..



Found that pix HERE but they are out of stock.. Too bad, cost is $293

There ARE other "brands" of the Chinese clone gens that are 120V only in non inverter setup, you simply NEED to do some detective work.

READ the information carefully, if it says 240/120 you NEED to stay clear of that one.

If it says 120V ONLY then you have a winner..

Just be aware, many of these Chinese Clones have very little warranty/parts support (same with HF, they don't carry or sell repair parts). You will be on your own if it breaks.