Locating Cell Phone Towers

[tkcas01]

I just recently purchased the Wilson SignalBoost DT for use in my rig. For what it is worth, I got it to replace the Digital Antenna PowerMax 4KMR-30U that never really seemed to help much. Maybe it was defective from the start - hard to know.

Anyway, so far I am impressed with the Wilson. I am in an area with a poor signal and it is definitely doing its job. Thing is, this Wilson has a directional antenna for outside and you are supposed to aim it toward the cell tower. I am wondering if anyone has found a reliable way to find the location of the nearest Verizon tower?

I found this site called Antenna Search. I was hoping to find a mapping application that would plot the towers, but what this does is let you download a spreadsheet with info on nearby towers. It's pretty easy to copy and paste the lat/long into Google Maps and see where they are in relation to you. For the one nearest me, when I zoomed in the satelitte image the location was spot on.

Anyone have a better way to locate nearby cell towers as you roam around the country? (And no, I don't mean by driving around and looking up!)

UPDATE FROM OP

Actually, Antenna Search does EXACTLY what I was looking for - the UI just leaves a bit to be desired and you have to know where to click. I must have clicked "Download Records" and that gives you the spreadsheet. Right above it is a button that will open a window with the locations plotted on Google Maps! Cool.

For example, here is the report on my current location. Still doesn't tell you which carrier uses the towers, but at least helps zero in on them.

On the Wilson, you also have to be careful that the inside antenna is NOT between the outside antenna and the tower. For example, if I mount the outside antenna on the rear ladder and the cell tower is to the front of the rig - that would be a problem. So, knowing the locations before getting set up will be a big help.

[pnichols]

This is the omni-directional Wilson antenna I have mounted up near the top of our RV's roof access ladder. No ground plane effect is in place with it mounted this way. With it and our 12 volt Wilson cellular amplifier, I can often get 2-3 bars showing on our phones when the phones by themselves show no bars at all.

Our setup also works great for surfing the NET when camping out in the middle of nowhere, too:

http://3gstore.com/product/2294_wilson-301133-rv-trucker-spring-mount-antenna.html

[tkcas01]

DiskDoctr wrote:
If you are having issues with the repeater being between the donor (outside) antenna and the cell tower, likely you don't have enough separation or a ground plane.

The diagonal separation (at least 3ft vertical and 3ft horizontal minimum) often helps.

Thanks. OK, ground plane = aluminum roof. I am not having an issue with the system. The model I got suggests 20' separation and I have that as the outside antenna is near the back and the inside is in the front "living area" of the coach. Right now it is just temporarily "stuck" to the upper side wall toward the rear of the coach using the suction cups they provided. I will eventually figure out a long term mounting solution - removable, of course.

As I mentioned above, the instructions say to NOT have the inside antenna BETWEEN the tower and the outside antenna. Makes sense. That means either I need to remain flexible in where I mount the outside antenna, or if I always want the antenna mounted at the rear (like on a pole attached to the ladder), I'd have to make sure I park in a site facing the correct direction.

Sounds like a hassle, but I seldom find myself in areas where I will need this, so it will not be an ongoing problem.

[DiskDoctr]

tkcas01 wrote:

DiskDoctr wrote:
Make sure you have a ground plane and vertical separation between inside and outside antennas! A diagonal separation seems to work best (outside antenna on top and not above your inside repeater)

What do you mean by ground plane?

A metal separation/reflector that prevents the signal from penetrating that lower "plane" Car roofs and mobile antennas often have an inbuilt ground plane. SOHO system antennas quite often do NOT have a ground plane and require a larger separation between the donor and repeater antennas.

If you are having issues with the repeater being between the donor (outside) antenna and the cell tower, likely you don't have enough separation or a ground plane.

The diagonal separation (at least 3ft vertical and 3ft horizontal minimum) often helps.

As an example, one of the very powerful systems I install does best with about 11ft or more vertical separation. But we are also dragging in 30-40 mile reflected signals (bounce one off the side of a mountain) in a "nobody has service here" area of rural WV 😉

Where are you putting your outside antenna and the inside antenna?

Most (all?) of these repeaters now have an auto adjust for the power (especially transmit) due to some FCC complaints a number of years ago.

In practical terms, that means if the antennas can interfere with each other, the system will REDUCE the power (and effectiveness) until they do not. If it is beyond a certain threshold, they have a Loop or Error or other warning light and turn off the boost.

Keep in mind, there is ALWAYS RF leakage in directions other than the directional/designed area, including BACKWARDS. So just because your directional is pointed away, if in the same vertical plane, you can get interference between antennas.

In a pinch, you can try putting your outside antenna on top of your rooftop A/C, or on the opposite side of it from your inside antenna.

Another tip. Your inside area coverage is a factor of the outside signal strength (repeater is limited by donor + boost signal).

When camping, for WiFi, I use an elastic hairband to 'clamp' my MiFi directly to the donor antenna inside and then allow the WiFi strength to create my coverage footprint. After attaching and powering on the MiFi, power cycle the booster, as it will often increase its power in this configuration.

There are a lot of other things to increase RF coverage and rectification, these are just a few that are likely to be simplest and most helpful for you.

And, yes, I am a professional, authorized installer for these larger systems. In part because I needed to use them for connectivity for other work I did 😉

Hope this helps.

[tkcas01]

DiskDoctr wrote:
Make sure you have a ground plane and vertical separation between inside and outside antennas! A diagonal separation seems to work best (outside antenna on top and not above your inside repeater)

What do you mean by ground plane?

[camperpaul]

tkcas01 wrote:

I found this site called Antenna Search

UPDATE FROM OP

Actually, Antenna Search does EXACTLY what I was looking for - the UI just leaves a bit to be desired and you have to know where to click. I must have clicked "Download Records" and that gives you the spreadsheet. Right above it is a button that will open a window with the locations plotted on Google Maps! Cool.

For example, here is the report on my current location. Still doesn't tell you which carrier uses the towers, but at least helps zero in on them.

Not all of the towers are cell phone towers. Example

Some of the towers in the example are TV antenna towers at private homes.

Most of the cell towers do not have antennas aimed into the state park so coverage is spotty at best on the beach and in most of the campground.

[DiskDoctr]

You can get a signal meter that updates immediately as you move the antenna. It has a little stubby on top that you can use if you don't attach a cable. Mine doesn't do 4G, but mostly voice and 3G is needed. It was about $200 a while back.

Here's another tip. Make sure you have a ground plane and vertical separation between inside and outside antennas! A diagonal separation seems to work best (outside antenna on top and not above your inside repeater)

If you are trying to use your phone as a tester for signal strength, keep in mind they don't update signal levels constantly.

Directional antennas need to be 1) Pointed in the right direction, 2) Rotated properly, and 3) Horizontally aligned.

Granted, you likely are not using a 3' directional, so it won't be quite as sensitive 😉 The panels are easier than yagi's.

[AllegroD]

.

[tvman44]

Wilson offers both directional and omni-directional antennas. 🙂

[tkcas01]

pnichols wrote:
Interesting discussion!

FWIW, the Wilson antenna on the roof of our RV is omnidirectional, so no turning of it can help with it picking up a stronger signal from any given tower.

Sorry, that is incorrect for the model I have. Please see the link in the original post and you will see indeed that it is a directional antenna. Believe me - I have the manual! You point it toward the tower.

[pnichols]

Interesting discussion!

FWIW, the Wilson antenna on the roof of our RV is omnidirectional, so no turning of it can help with it picking up a stronger signal from any given tower. We have this antenna feeding a 12 volt Wilson cellular-band amplifier inside the coach.

[wa8yxm]

If you have a smart phone and it can get a connection at all.. There is an application I have on my 'drod called Network Signal Info.

It will ask the tower where it is and post the response.

NOTE: I have seen the towers up to a half mile from where it claims it is.

[tkcas01]

vermilye wrote:
if you use 4G data, this & most of the currently available models don't cover the 700Mhz LTE frequencies.

Yep, I can get by without 4G, but a phone that can't phone I cannot.

I thought about also getting a 700 Mhz booster, but I think I can make it without it.

[vermilye]

The repeater systems are handy since they allow you to move around inside the RV with your phone, but if you use 4G data, this & most of the currently available models don't cover the 700Mhz LTE frequencies.

I have the same problem with most of the tower locating programs - since most of the space on the towers is rented by the major cell providers, it is almost impossible to identify who is where.

[naturist]

Might be another way, but easiest/cheapest way would be to SLOWLY turn the directional antenna around the circle and watch the phone bar display. You will know you got it right whichever direction you get the most bars.