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New Water heater Brings out Converter Issues?

_MacGyver_
Explorer
Explorer
I’ve been having a lot of trouble with the latest upgrade to our main trailer. I installed a Girard on-demand water heater to allow all of us to shower quickly and comfortably, but our trailer seems to strongly dislike the electrical side of it.

After much confusion, I’ve been able to pick out these issues so far:
when the battery is unplugged and the water heater is on, the fridge freaks out, and all lights blink
when the battery is plugged in, the fridge works, but blinks the AC and Battery lights. The water heater control panel flashes off and on over and over
If I turn on the bathroom fan, the panel stays on and detects water flow but the water heater wont fire
If the trailer is unplugged from shore power and running on 12 volt only, the water heater functions perfectly
When the old water heater was in, there was no problem with the fridge or heater even if the battery was off and the fridge never flashed.
I’ve had a couple people suggest the converter in our RV might be bad, but we never had trouble with it before this new installation. The technical manual for this water heater notes that older trailers may need to bypass the converter and wire through the battery to use it as a capacitor, but gives no instructions regarding how to do this.
I didn’t think that would be necessary as this trailer is a 1997 Dutchmen. I was wondering if, since the trailer seems OK as long as the water heater isn’t conn acted to the trailers power system, if I could connect the water heater directly to a 12 volt battery and connect the battery to a solar trickle charger so it has its own power system. Or, is rewiring the water heater through the battery would be best, or if our converter is in fact bad. It seems as if the 110 volt and 12 volt systems are crossing, since at times even the air conditioner will make the water heater control panel respond for a few seconds when its turned on.

My specialty is carpentry, and the only thing I know even less about than plumbing is electrical.

Any of you here who know more about power in RVs and their systems, I would really appreciate any thoughts you have. I haven't heard any reports of things this weird happening over the many videos I've seen regarding installing this unit.

Thanks again!
15 REPLIES 15

westend
Explorer
Explorer
When you are trying to ask complex questions about systems that are failing, it behooves the inquirer to list even information that he takes for granted that should be known. Example: Is that Girard water heater powered by 12v only, or also by 120V?

In any event, your Magnatek converter is probably at the center of your problems. It may only output 13V or so and leaves the battery constantly undercharged. If you have enough 12V battery capacity and it is all charged, you don't need a converter to make the 12V systems work. Eventually, you would use up that capacity and the batteries would need recharging.

I don't know if your Magnatek is a deck mount model (not inside a multi-function load center) but I'm guessing it is. Bestconverter.com, among other vendors, does sell deck mount converters.

The A/C influencing the heater control panel may be indicative of poor or corroded connections. Without being next to your wiring efforts and circuitry, it's hard to make electrical diagnoses. I'd suggest to get a tradesman with electrical skill to overlook and inspect your trailer and the work you've done. "Neighbor" is not a certification of competence.
'03 F-250 4x4 CC
'71 Starcraft Wanderstar -- The Cowboy/Hilton

joshuajim
Explorer II
Explorer II
*MacGyver* wrote:
Hello again!
. I have a neighbor who is very knowledgeable about wiring check my work, and they said is was done properly (Yay!). I will have that person check my wiring of the converter before connecting power as well, if it weren't for them I wouldn't have gotten this far at all. !


First, is your neighbor a residential/commercial “expert” or is he familiar with RV wiring? RV wiring color codes vary greatly, and if he only used wire color to determine that the wiring was correct it may be reversed. Did he use a meter to determine polarity?
RVing since 1995.

_MacGyver_
Explorer
Explorer
Hello again!

The old water heater was a gas electric model. I installed the new water heater. According to a tutorial from an rv dealership, they said if you were replacing a gas electric model with a Girard, to cap off the 110 supply line and tuck it away, then connect the water heater to the 12V power the old water heater used to ignite. I have a neighbor who is very knowledgeable about wiring check my work, and they said is was done properly (Yay!). I will have that person check my wiring of the converter before connecting power as well, if it weren't for them I wouldn't have gotten this far at all. They also suggested the converter being an issue, as they've done work on rvs for years and recently replaced theirs due to odd behavior (followed by smoke). Our issues are more bizarre it would seem, but the issue of a converter is coming up a lot.

Thanks again!

budwich
Explorer
Explorer
Although it is likely that your "old" converter may be bad, it is unusual that your new water heater is the cause as the draw from the heater (control board) as it operates on less than 3 amps.... which isn't alot.

You indicate that you know less about electricity but did you do the install or someone else. The old water heater (depending on the model), might have been both electric (120v) and gas (plus 12v). Without checking wiring, it might be possible that there is a "mixup" on the wiring with neutral being mistaken for ground.... which would be bad. Perhaps you should review your wiring and maybe check with a meter what's going on (or find someone who can check it for you).

one last thing, when you or whoever connected the heater, did that person check the wiring with a meter to confirm what was "in them" as opposed to just following the "wire colors" mentioned in any install manual?

Lastly, since you are thinking / leaning towards get an new converter and your knowledge of electricity is "limited", I would think that you will be getting someone to install it for you... right? Why not find that "someone" before you do this and have them check your wiring for the heater. Of course, a new converter is never a bad investment... 🙂

pianotuna
Nomad III
Nomad III
Best to do a search here on converter recommendations.

Iota, Boondocker, Powermax, Progressive Dynamics are a few that make excellent converters. Wire to the battery bank may need to be upgraded as the unit you have now may only do about 5 amps of charging.
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

_MacGyver_
Explorer
Explorer
I have a PD 4645VL 45 Amp Converter Upgrade marked, is this the correct upgrade for our system?

Farmboy666
Explorer
Explorer
Yea I find it hard to believe the 80's were 30 years ago

_MacGyver_
Explorer
Explorer
I just realized a Typo after reading your response. the word "Vac" Was left from an auto-fill typo. I'm not sure what type, I only know it's 12 V

Roadpilot
Explorer
Explorer
I think it runs on 12 volts DC which is battery voltage, not 12 volts AC.
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GrandpaKip
Explorer II
Explorer II
bestconverter.com
Kip
2015 Skyline Dart 214RB
2018 Silverado Double Cab 4x4
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_MacGyver_
Explorer
Explorer
Yep, it runs on 12 V.

The converter is a Magnetek Power Plus, 45 Amp.

I tried that already, but the paperclip wasn't a high enough gauge to handle the amperage and I didn't want to use my matches next to the propane lines 🙂

GSHW-2 Is the correct model, sorry for not posting that.

Good point, I've never considered a vehicle old unless it's from the 60's 🙂

I'll try connecting the water heater directly to the battery and post the results.

Where would the best place to purchase a smart converter be? Is there a model recommended for replacing ours?

Thanks everyone 🙂

Farmboy666
Explorer
Explorer
Since it says Older trailer need to bypass the converter and yours is 21 yrs old that's the way I would at least take a shot at or upgrade converter which might get rid of the problem and having a new converter is not a bad idea anyway.

Roadpilot
Explorer
Explorer
I'm assuming you have a propane fired heater that has a ciruit board powered by 12 Vdc. I found this one from ppl and designed for rv's. URL wont post but it's model GSHW-2.

The spec in it is less then 3 amps from 12 vdc. The output of the converter should be tied to the battery with fairly short wires. If it is there shouldn't be a huge difference between connecting it to the output of the converter or directly to the battery. It sounds to me like either the converter is bad and or your wiring is not correct. I would try disconnecting the electrical connections from the heater and connecting the 12 vdcd input directly to the battery.
Tiffin Wayfarer 25TW
15 Mini Cooper S

beemerphile1
Explorer
Explorer
First, I'm assuming the water heater operates on 12vdc, correct?

Sounds like the start up amperage is more than the converter's capability.

What is brand and model of converter?

With your screen name, can't you fix it with a paper clip, rubber band, and match?
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