Open diff or limited slip

[okan-star]

Im changing the rear axle on my 99 4x4 2500 Dodge to a dually Dana 80
I can get an open differential or a factory limited slip
Ive had a 03 4x4 Dodge dually with open diff and my SRW truck now has an open diff
Anyone like to have a limited slip posi type for camper and towing ? Reasons?
Ive heard some pros and cons
Im giving up some snow ability changing to duals , wondering if trackloc might help there
Also doing arrowcraft spacers and spyntec hubs on the front ,new leafs and mega cab type fenders,17 " dually rims , there wont be any other difference between my truck and a 3500 of that year , except doortag and my lower registration
Dont want to buy another truck
Thanks

[trail-explorer]

okan-star wrote:
...Had to order the new Rieco Titan EZ Swings...

http://www.riecotitan.com/accessories/swingawayez.php

[trail-explorer]

Limited slip at a minimum.

All my recent trucks have had the G80 option (GM RPO code for Locking Rear Differential)

[okan-star]

PRodacy wrote:
Make sure you know the difference between an open diff, a limited slip, and a locker. Open diff = one wheel slips, all the power goes to it and the vehicle won't move. Limited slip = one wheel slips, power goes to the non-slipping wheel and you get moving again. Locker = both wheels are virtually locked together. Lockers are almost never used on the street, regardless of the conditions. They're common on off-road vehicles where you want to keep moving in very rough terrain or even if one or more wheels are off the ground. On ice or very slippery conditions, lockers are often a more squirrely if the road slopes to the side since both wheels are turning at the same speed. A LSD is better in these conditions as the one wheel that isn't driving tends to hold the vehicle a bit better. I'd definitely go with a LSD, not open and not locked unless you're really into off-roading in severe terrain.

Question was towing with open vs LS

I know the difference between a LS and a locker , would`nt tow with a locker

Picked up the axle today from West Coast Diff , they inspected and it is all good ,back lash is what its supposed to be . The LS is a powrloc , still in good shape . If it goes out about 1100.00 to install a detroit truetrac, parts + labor
Waiting for parts to arrive now
Had to order the new Rieco Titan EZ Swings for the camper last nite Since the truck will have duals soon . EZ Swing is a new design for Riecos and Attooods , like Happi Jac flip outs , they have a button on the bottom to disengage ,
they add 9 1/4 " in width

[BradW]

PRodacy wrote:
Limited slip = one wheel slips, power goes to the non-slipping wheel and you get moving again.

Unfortunately some torque is applied to both axles and there in lies the problem driving a high torque, heavily loaded front axle and lightly loaded rear axle vehicle on ice like a turbo diesel pick up.

[Bedlam]

PRodacy wrote:
Make sure you know the difference between an open diff, a limited slip, and a locker. Open diff = one wheel slips, all the power goes to it and the vehicle won't move. Limited slip = one wheel slips, power goes to the non-slipping wheel and you get moving again. Locker = both wheels are virtually locked together. Lockers are almost never used on the street, regardless of the conditions. They're common on off-road vehicles where you want to keep moving in very rough terrain or even if one or more wheels are off the ground. On ice or very slippery conditions, lockers are often a more squirrely if the road slopes to the side since both wheels are turning at the same speed. A LSD is better in these conditions as the one wheel that isn't driving tends to hold the vehicle a bit better. I'd definitely go with a LSD, not open and not locked unless you're really into off-roading in severe terrain.

x2

[PRodacy]

Make sure you know the difference between an open diff, a limited slip, and a locker. Open diff = one wheel slips, all the power goes to it and the vehicle won't move. Limited slip = one wheel slips, power goes to the non-slipping wheel and you get moving again. Locker = both wheels are virtually locked together. Lockers are almost never used on the street, regardless of the conditions. They're common on off-road vehicles where you want to keep moving in very rough terrain or even if one or more wheels are off the ground. On ice or very slippery conditions, lockers are often a more squirrely if the road slopes to the side since both wheels are turning at the same speed. A LSD is better in these conditions as the one wheel that isn't driving tends to hold the vehicle a bit better. I'd definitely go with a LSD, not open and not locked unless you're really into off-roading in severe terrain.

[joeshmoe]

If you ever get stuck due to a one legged diff., you'll swear that you will never own an open rear-end again.

An air or electric locker would be nice if you have the dough and desire. Depends on what you're using it for, I suppose. Probably not worth the extra money if you're simply looking for a little extra traction on pavement.

[Handbasket]

I don't have a clue as to how good or reliable the ARB AirLocker is in bigger pickups, but mine in my early-'95 Toyota 4x4 pickup is still trouble free after over 15 years. I've had four rear LSD/lockers since '72... two OEM clutch-type in Scouts years ago, a Downey in my '80 Toyota 4x4, and the ARB. The too-tight Downey was a nightmare-in-waiting on anything but dry pavement... low-speed sliding sideways on uphill packed re-frozen snow or flat curvy ice. I'll take a driver-controlled locker, thank you berry much.

Jim, "Still plays with trucks."

[magic43]

Rexsname wrote:
Jefe,
What is your opinion of the Tru-Trac LSD? It is an all gear (no clutches) LSD. REX

I added a Tru-Trac on an '02 Tundra 4X4. It performed wonderful.

[okan-star]

jefe 4x4 wrote:
okan,
Good job on the find. Make sure to count the splines once they open up the pig in Sacto.
With only 16K miles, the Trac lok should be O.K. Just keep the oil and additive up to date.
The AAM look-similar rr diff to the D80 has only a 30 spline outer, not something to write home about.
jefe

Im 99% sure its 35 spline , Im not sure what LS is in it , it could have been replaced , you never know.West Coast Diff hopefully will ID it for me , the tag on it does say LS
I found six 2x4 dana 80`s around here, but this is the only LS
Also this one is the best price @ 950.00, seams like a lot to me but better that the highest @ 1200.00
I plan to do the axle seals and the brakes so I`ll have the axles out at home later, I will check the splines count
FYI I did go through the parts lists on Summits site and the only diffrence btwn the 80 SRW &DRW axles is the brakes , hubs and inner bearing and race, the outer bearings and races are the same
heresthe detroit truetrac

[jefe_4x4]

okan,
Good job on the find. Make sure to count the splines once they open up the pig in Sacto.
With only 16K miles, the Trac lok should be O.K. Just keep the oil and additive up to date.
The AAM look-similar rr diff to the D80 has only a 30 spline outer, not something to write home about.
jefe

[okan-star]

I went to pick up a dually Dana 80 axle with 16000 miles on it at a recycler today , supposed to be a open diff , was going to add a detroit truetrac sometime later .We pulled the diff cover and it was a limited slip , looks as what had been described to me as a tracloc . I decided to take it anyway as I had already set up to take it to West Coast Differentials in Sac. area to have whatever I bought given a once over, check backlash and visually inspected before I put it in. Whatever kind of LS it is, if this axle checks out I`ll run it until its no good and put in a truetrac later , The truetrac is not as I have been told a full locker its more progressive and has been recomended to me as a good one to tow with and as a traction aid.
I`m certainly not " afraid " to drive with a LS ,Ive had 3 trucks with LS before just not to haul heavy loads , and I have had my 69 power wagon 4x4 big block come around on me on wet pavement when I hit the gas a bit much in a corner, eye opening

Spent a bit of $ today ,ordered dually mega cab type fenders , front wheel adaptors - spyntec will follow , ordered Cooper St max 255/80/r17 33" tires for the stock used 17" rims I found on craigslist for 300.00 . Also picked up some cab and chas progressive leafs at the yard .
One hitch is I could only find rear ends out of 2x4 trucks and the shock - anti sway mts are at opposing angles on them instead of flat on a 4x4 , will have to cut them off and re weld them on flat

I better go buy some more hand cleaner

[jefe_4x4]

I did a lot wading thru mountains of posts on LSD vs. Lockers vs. Open and found there is a lot of misinformation out there. I zeroed in on the Eaton/Detroit True trac differential to see what the applications were and what the user reports had to say. I have no experience with it. I found that the True trac is indeed a gear/worm or planetary limited slip that senses the difference in torque bias and applies more torque to the wheel with the most traction, by degrees. No clutch plates to wear out. Surprisingly, they have applications for Dana axles, at least the D-60, all spline counts, and front and rear apps, and D-80 w/35 and 37 splines. After searching all the Dodge Truck sites i could find no one who has the True trac in their pig. Whats more, Chevy has made available some of these as a factory item on bigger pickups. I found AAM aftermarket apps for all the AAM (American Axle Manufacturing) used in virtually everyone's 250/2500, 350/3500 pickup variously from the early 2000's. It does not stop there, however, as there are 3 different AAM TracRite traction devices: TracRite GT (a helical gear LSD, no clutches), the TracRite EL (electronic open to full lock), and the TracRite GTL (a combination of the two allowing open to torque biasing LSD to full locking with a switch). The thing about AAM axles vs. Dana's is how the AAM's are slightly heavier and bigger model for model. AAM took over the light truck axle market when Dana's management was on the skids for too long.
You have only to live in icy conditions with a pickup to KNOW how awful the traction is on slippery roads. This is why I cannot recommend a full, automatic locker for unloaded/icy road truck use (unless you increase the ground pressure over your rear axle with say, 600 pounds of cement blocks in the winter or have a TC back there). Most of the autos i see in the ditch during ice storms are pickup trucks.
My wife's 2011 Cherokee has what is called a vari-trac or vari-loc diff. Fairly transparent, but if you are stopped and try to go, nothing happens. While moving and one wheel slips, you get this ratcheting sound and you can feel the torque switch to the wheel with the most traction.
Truth be told, I am well out of the loop now on traction devices relying on older more proven technology to get me out of the ditch. If any of you have more experience to divulge, feel free. As TC-er's we have a different nitch than trailer pullers or empty truckers do.
regards, as always, jefe

[skyhammer]

I completely disagree about lockers and their drive-ability on pavement. for example, I Detroit Lockers in my 95 F-350 and my 85 Toyota. It is nearly impossible to drive these on pavement unless it is straight.
When I had the locker put in I had to drive 30 miles home and barely made it. On every turn, the lockers would chatter like hell and the rear tires lock up. I nearly wore out my rear tires in 30 miles.Many times I nearly ended up in a ditch because the truck would not turn.
There is a reason that these types on lockers are for off road use only. Even I hard dirt the locker make it hard to turn.
They work great on the ranch, but we rarely exceed 10MPH and have no pavement.
Most rear end shops will not put in a Detroit locker on a vehicle that will see pavement.
If you want a real locker(not the ones Ford etc. puts in their SRW trucks), ARB is the way to go.That way you can disengage the locker on pavement, you don't want a full time locker on your everyday driver.
On the subject of LSD's, besides tru-trac, there is Gleason Torsen and Auburn Gear.
A lot of Tundra's are using the Auburn Gear with great results.
I have Gleason Torsen in the front of my 85 Toyota and it works very well, you just have t hold onto the wheel when it kicks in, especially with the locker in the rear.