Help me understand

[Tom_Diane]

I don't have a slider hitch in my 08 6.5 ft. box. For those that do have them, what is the advantage other than then if you have a flat cap on your 5er? I could see the need for one. However, it seems that the round caps seem to compensate for the need for a slider and this is why they came up with the design. These configurations are designed so that you can turn 80 or 90 degrees. My point is, that when you get turned that much, you have lost control of the R.V. no matter your situation. You are now dragging the tires and twisting the frame of you unit. Backing up, you have the same thing except you are pushing hard on your pin, extra hard. You are stuck in that position until you make the reverse move that got you there! So what is the advantage of a slider hitch if you have a configuration that allows you to turn sufficiently in so far that you either have a flat cap with an 8ft box or you have a round cap with a 6.5 ft. box, which it seems in both cases negates the need for a slider hitch? I have used a slider on big trucks but they are designed to distribute weight on the axles of the tractor. I realize the flat cap and a short box a slider would be handy with out a doubt. Given the configurations I mentioned, and the slider is in the forward position while towing, considering that it is the same position of a fixed hitch, What is the advantage to the turn if the slider is supposed to go back to allow a turn with out damage to your TV? I personally prefer to have the towed unit to be as close to me as possible when making turns and if I have to turn that sharp that have no control over the tire slide and frame twist, then I'm in a place I shouldn't be! In which case a slider is of no use. I have no problem with anything some one want to purchase. I just haven't seen the advantage. I don't intend for this to be a bashing post but would like other opinions as to why they are helpful. Just asking. Thanks

[blkdodge]

Old truck was a short bed, old trailer said it could make 88 degree turns. Well I know it would not go 89 degrees. JUST SAYIN. :h

[DSteiner51]

TakingThe5th wrote:


Those dual-engine things are impossible to back up. The wings get in the way, there's no rear view mirrors - you don't even HAVE a back window. The good news is that it's almost impossible to grind the reverse gear-if you can find it. but when you do get to the campsite all you have to do is drop in :B

I've backed them up several times. One just needs a spotter off the left side as a rear view mirror. :B

Oh, and always, always take it out of reverse before hitting the brakes. 😮

[TakingThe5th]

DSteiner51 wrote:

Tom_Diane wrote:

You must have been an over the road driver.

I had a classmate who drove over the road for over 30 years and he could not back a rig to save his life. I never understood how he did it. He got a local job to save his 4th marriage and lasted less then two weeks till he got fired. Of course I only lasted approx 6 months on that job until another aviation job opened up driving a little shorter, much wider, more powerful, dual engine, busses at 5 times the speed. :B

Those dual-engine things are impossible to back up. The wings get in the way, there's no rear view mirrors - you don't even HAVE a back window. The good news is that it's almost impossible to grind the reverse gear-if you can find it. but when you do get to the campsite all you have to do is drop in :B

[valhalla360]

Beyond 90 is rather pointless.

70-80 degrees to get into a tight spot isn't uncommon. You over turn and then pull ahead a little to straighten out. Do that a couple times and then you can back all the way in.

We avoid those spots if we can but sometimes you deal with it. If you can turn 70-80 degrees without the slider, you are probably fine just keep an eye on it.

[MFL]

I can see Tom's point, on the 90 degree backing. At that angle, you are no longer backing, only pushing, and twisting. You can not back a bumper pull trailer at that angle either.

I've pulled FWs with 4 different trucks, 2 8', and 2 6.75' beds. I have never had a slider. One of my earlier FWs would come close to hitting, and would require a slight pull forward, before backing again.

I don't know if I could back my current FW into a 90 degree angle without hitting the cab, but I would not twist it like that, even if I could.

Jimnlin is correct, that rigs do vary, and some will require a slider, or even a sidewinder style hitch. One size does not fit all.

Center of my pin, over the axle center is about 41"s from the back of my cab. My hitch has 4"s of fore & aft adj. I have good clearance with current rig.

Under extreme conditions, I think extra caution, getting out more to look, etc, is the key, no matter what you are backing.

Jerry

[DSteiner51]

Tom_Diane wrote:

I dont claim to be an "expert" but I have a lot of trailering experience and have never put the trailer in a position that I would take out a back window.
This is not to say it doesn't happen, it just seems so easy to avoid this happening.
The CDL test books show no instance when you make a move to turn that sharp, going forward or reverse. I am not trying to knock anyone who has a slider hitch.
I just wanted to know what the reason for a slider was besides having a short box or flat cap.

You must have been an over the road driver.

The CDL test doesn't mirror all the real life situations. It is obvious that you never went to the truck depot near Cleveland Hopkins Airport. Shortly after I got my CDL being the new guy, I got sent there and I waited in line, and waited, and waited. Finally a lady showed up at the drivers window and said, "you look like you know what you are doing, take slot **" (don't remember the number) I didn't then have the guts to tell her I was new with less then a month of towing 53 ft trailers so I tried to reason with her stating that I was number 6 in line so they should come first.

She told me that they had all refused to accept the slot so since I was the last in line that could get to it, it was mine and she expected me to use it. It wasn't as hard as I thot it would be and there were a bunch of drivers watching how I'd do. By sliding the trailer axles and jackknifing it I got it in within 15 minutes and other drivers walked over and complimented me on good quick job "and it was obvious you have done this numerous times." I didn't tell them it was my first time and only been pulling 53 footers for less then a month. In real trucking on local delivery and pickups, jackknifing is required around here. Over the road maybe never.

I had a classmate who drove over the road for over 30 years and he could not back a rig to save his life. I never understood how he did it. He got a local job to save his 4th marriage and lasted less then two weeks till he got fired. Of course I only lasted approx 6 months on that job until another aviation job opened up driving a little shorter, much wider, more powerful, dual engine, busses at 5 times the speed. :B

[Old-Biscuit]

I have been in CGs where sites were perpendicular to road and road was narrow.
Jack knifing rig was only way to get into site.........but I have long bed with an extended pin box and can't hit back of cab unless I jack rig way past 90*

Short bed without slider......hitting back of cab is a possibility.

Just like whether to have a 'bed saver' or not........depends on IF you drop 5vr whether it pays for itself or not.

Slider, bed saver, king pin tripod, surge guard, etc. depends on whether one thinks they are needed or not.

I could only justify cost/risk/benefit with the surge guard.

[Tom_Diane]

pando2 wrote:

edhensley wrote:
At some point you will take out the back window of your truck

Then you will have full understanding. It only ever gets used in very tight RV parks

Been there, done that. I thought I was an expert and would never do it, but guess what, I did and broke my back window.:o

I dont claim to be an "expert" but I have a lot of trailering experience and have never put the trailer in a position that I would take out a back window.
This is not to say it doesn't happen, it just seems so easy to avoid this happening.
The CDL test books show no instance when you make a move to turn that sharp, going forward or reverse. I am not trying to knock anyone who has a slider hitch.
I guess I understand the short box and the need for a slider, but if you have the clearance in the box and an 8 ft box would be a must for me if I had a flat cap on my RV and I would have to know the clearance from the cab and maybe then I would still opt for one so I could make corners while traveling to avoid hitting the cab with the corner of the trailer.
My curiosity arises from those that have an 6.5 ft box or bigger, if it is really worth the extra money if I thought I could justify needing one.
My moves are all made with me in control of the trailer and I can imagine the ways to break a window and only 3 trains of thought come to mind. I am complacent or I have lost control of my trailer because I failed to stay within my limits of turning radius. A slider just allows you more room to get into a tight spot before the window gets broke out. I wont say it will never happen to me, I just wanted to know what the reason for a slider was besides having a short box or flat cap.

[happycamper1942]

edhensley wrote:
At some point you will take out the back window of your truck

Then you will have full understanding. It only ever gets used in very tight RV parks

Been there, done that. I thought I was an expert and would never do it, but guess what, I did and broke my back window.:o

[Bluhorn]

I have often wondered the same as the OP. My dealer recommended a standard hitch stating that I would never use a slider.I used it very rarely. With the pin pushed back it does improve maneuverability in tight places. But as others have said, if you turn so tightly your worried about your back window, you have gotten yourself in such a bind your not going anywhere anyhow.

[Tom_Diane]

AUWing, Yours is the best response that I can understand, quicker response time.
That make perfect sense. I am not trying to start anything here but I cant understand how a person would put themselves in a jack knifed position and expect to have control of the trailers movement at that point!
I've been in a few places that I call tight but never tried to push it back while the tires aren't rolling ,but sliding sideways.
That would seem to be the cause of knocking out a rear window!
Its just that I have lot of years in trucks and pulling trailers and have never put my 5er in that predicament. Especially while trying to get into a tight of a camp site. Its now my intention to ruffle feathers here and I now it comes down to what you are comfy with. Apparently these things happen but seems avoidable to me with out the extra expense of a slider hitch, thanks for the responses.

[AUWing]

Tom_Diane wrote:

AUWing wrote:
Aside from preventing unplanned rear window replacement, a slider can improve maneuverability in tight places. I get more use from mine when I remember that sliding it back improves response time when backing into something tight

Sorry, I didn't know I was being graded on my use of punctuations, sentences and such. I posted in the 5th wheel forum. Again My apologies.

Like good ole days at home, blamed for something a sibling did . . .

[Tom_Diane]

AUWing wrote:
Aside from preventing unplanned rear window replacement, a slider can improve maneuverability in tight places. I get more use from mine when I remember that sliding it back improves response time when backing into something tight

Sorry, I didn't know I was being graded on my use of punctuations, sentences and such. I posted in the 5th wheel forum. Again My apologies.

[Tom_Diane]

edhensley wrote:
At some point you will take out the back window of your truck

Then you will have full understanding. It only ever gets used in very tight RV parks

But this is the reason for my inquiry! If I have to turn that sharp, then I shouldn't be in that spot and at the sharp angle, you no longer can maneuver the rv. And this is how window get broke out. I drove the big rigs at one time and never put a trailer in that kind of a position. And yes there were tight spots I hauled heavy construction equipment. As some one replied, that if you have the 5 ft box like Fords have Im told, A slider is required.