Ford E350 - 460 "hiccup"

[LifeInsideJack]

UPDATE: Today I finally got to replacing the ICM. Boom. Fixed the problem. I found the replacement part at O'Rielly's and connected it, started the engine and within a few minutes knew the problem was resolved.

Thank you all for your responses and input.

Ok, I'm special (according to my mom) but I'm not that special. Who else has a 460 motor that hiccups?

The engine runs along fine then a momentary surge of "Go!" and then back to normal. This isn't crazy like I'm holding it back from running into things ... nope, just a quick rev up and then it settles back down.

The mechanic hasn't seen this before and it recently passed smog with super low numbers. There are 68k miles on the engine.

Anyone else have something like this and know where to start on trying to fix this?

Minus this strange quirk it runs like a banshee. Super strong and easily passes trucks when needed.

Thoughts?

[Biggyniner]

ernie1 wrote:
Biggyniner:
How and where did you get the specs for the proper capacitors? I like your approach to solving the problem. Some of my friends tell me I'm nuts to go to such lengths to correct a problem but I find self satisfaction to be rewarding and it pays off in the end.

I don't remember how I came across this Video, but this was the source I used...

In the video he shows which capacitors should be what uF...

[ernie1]

Biggyniner:
How and where did you get the specs for the proper capacitors? I like your approach to solving the problem. Some of my friends tell me I'm nuts to go to such lengths to correct a problem but I find self satisfaction to be rewarding and it pays off in the end.

[LifeInsideJack]

Wow, so today I bolted the part into place. I just let it hang around when I tried it. OK so you need really small hands for this job. After losing a 5/16" socket and Cat using her lady hands we were able to get the heat-sink off, removed the old part, bolt on the new part and replace the heat sink into the wheel well area. Then it was just a matter of bolting back on the small parts and battery that had to be removed.

This job is done.

Next week however is a different story. Monday we remove everything from the roof and pull the rubber roofing off. Once we see what we are up against then we can install the new roof. The coach is 27 feet long. I purchased 35 feet of roof material so we can exaggerate the front and rear roof lines. My hope is that the new roof will wrap all the way around the front as well as hang over the rear. This thing has leaked for too long and it's really making us frustrated.

That'll be a new thread with copious pictures. Look for that on Monday in the DIY thread.

[j-d]

Worth the wait! Thanks for the update!

We hate to "throw parts at it" when we aren't positive it's the root of a fault. Still, how long are we willing to tolerate poor running...?

Man on another forum has lost a full season trying to figure out why the engine turns up full RPM than loses 1000 RPM that won't come back. Has suspected the ECM, $400 part. Big gamble but what's a boating (camping) season worth?

[LifeInsideJack]

I posted this as an Update on the first thread and included it here at the end of the thread in case it was skimmed over.

UPDATE: Today I finally got to replacing the ICM. Boom. Fixed the problem. I found the replacement part at O'Rielly's and connected it, started the engine and within a few minutes knew the problem was resolved.

Thank you all for your responses and input.

[jimintomah]

I don't pretend to be a mechanic but your problem sounds like something we experienced a year ago with only 22,000 miles on the odometer. To make a long story short the dealer ran diagnostics and did not find anything. They thought it was fuel pump or filter related but unfortunately with our E450 that's all in the tank. Before spending big bucks I decided to run SeaFoam through. I added 3 cans to a half full tank of gas, let it sit for one day. After that I went for a 160 mile drive and it never missed a beat. We have put 4000 miles on since that with no problems. I usually treat the tank with SeaFoam in the fall when storing but now I carry it with me just in case.

[LifeInsideJack]

This has been an excellent set of replies. I'll start with the ignition control module and take it from there. The symptom we are having isn't a miss it's a surge. So, I'll go with that first.

Thank you cats for all your help with this issue. We're parked for a bit so it will be a little while before I get to this.

[Biggyniner]

Biggyniner wrote:

Biggyniner wrote:

fourthclassC wrote:
Howdy I want to reiterate my suggestions. The resolution for me was the ignition control module on the inner fender

I will be replacing mine this week. I will let all know of the results.

CN

So I replaced the ignition module... Did not fix my issue. I pulled the PCM/ECU and discovered I had a re-manufactured one! When I opened it I realized that whoever "refurbished" it did not put the correct capacitor in. There are supposed to be 2 47uF capacitors and 1 10uF capacitor. All 3 of mine were 47uF...

Pretty sure this is my issue. New capacitors are arriving from Amazon tomorrow and I will let you all know if this finally solves my issue. Video showing capacitor change.

Just so you know the ignition module may still fix your issue. O'Rilley had mine for ~40.00 bucks

So for me it was the ECU/PCM. I replaced the incorrect / damaged capacitors and my miss issue was resolved. If desoldering/soldering is too unnerving, rockauto has the ECU/PCM you can order and just replace the whole unit.

[Biggyniner]

Biggyniner wrote:

fourthclassC wrote:
Howdy I want to reiterate my suggestions. The resolution for me was the ignition control module on the inner fender

I will be replacing mine this week. I will let all know of the results.

CN

So I replaced the ignition module... Did not fix my issue. I pulled the PCM/ECU and discovered I had a re-manufactured one! When I opened it I realized that whoever "refurbished" it did not put the correct capacitor in. There are supposed to be 2 47uF capacitors and 1 10uF capacitor. All 3 of mine were 47uF...

Pretty sure this is my issue. New capacitors are arriving from Amazon tomorrow and I will let you all know if this finally solves my issue. Video showing capacitor change.

Just so you know the ignition module may still fix your issue. O'Rilley had mine for ~40.00 bucks

[Biggyniner]

fourthclassC wrote:
Howdy I want to reiterate my suggestions. The resolution for me was the ignition control module on the inner fender

I will be replacing mine this week. I will let all know of the results.

CN

[fourthclassC]

Howdy I want to reiterate my suggestions. The resolution for me was the ignition control module on the inner fender

[Biggyniner]

j-d wrote:
If this 460 has a Distributor, I think it has to come out of the Engine (watch TIMING!!!) then the Shaft has to come out to change that Module. Unlike GM, Ford drilled Gear and Shaft once assembled then drove the pin in. So, MARK the parts so you don't go together 180* out and have trouble lining the holes back up for the pin. Ford gears were hard to pull off, too. I found my Snap-On power steering pulley remover tool could do it. There's a fair-to-good chance the Gear will break, so have one or at least source it. I only broke a gear when I didn't have a new one nearby. I think the Old Gear knew it...

Nope, that's the PIP sensor on the distributor. Luckly the ignition control module is mounted on the driver side wheel well.. little bit of a pain to get to but not nearly as bad as the PIP.

[j-d]

If this 460 has a Distributor, I think it has to come out of the Engine (watch TIMING!!!) then the Shaft has to come out to change that Module. Unlike GM, Ford drilled Gear and Shaft once assembled then drove the pin in. So, MARK the parts so you don't go together 180* out and have trouble lining the holes back up for the pin. Ford gears were hard to pull off, too. I found my Snap-On power steering pulley remover tool could do it. There's a fair-to-good chance the Gear will break, so have one or at least source it. I only broke a gear when I didn't have a new one nearby. I think the Old Gear knew it...

[Biggyniner]

LifeInsideJack wrote:

Biggyniner wrote:
So... I have a 1994 Minnie Winnie with the 460 in it. I have an occasional miss at idle, not the same problem you have, but similar in nature. It's had the distributor changed, ford plugs and wires and fuel filter, yet it still persists. I have it in the shop now and I will let you know what they find...

Thank you !

So they have been looking at it for three days and they narrowed it down to two things. Either the ignition control module, or the PCM/ECU. They want a ridiculous amount of money to do the ignition control module. So I will probably start there and do it myself. I've also read that the capacitors, there are 3, can go bad in the PCM. I am going to check those as well (for swelling) and replace them if needed. Do a Google search on ford 460 pcm capacitor leakage for more info.

Hope this helps.