Hi, all - Newbie with a bunch of questions

[karyj]

Hi, everybody,

I've been lurking for a couple of months and finally decided to register and post.

We're tent campers who are toying with the idea of a small MH, so I'd like to tap your collective wisdom to help us avoid some of the common newbie mistakes.

We're a family of two adults, a young teen and two cats. One of the cats recently developed a medical issue that means we have to take him with us if we travel. He's not old or frail, he just pines himself near to death (literally) if we leave him behind. The teen is almost 5'10" at age 13, so we're not sure a dinette bed will cut it for him.

Our budget is pretty small. We're looking at stuff that's 10 to 20 years old. On the one hand, we're worried about buying someone else's headache. On the other, we've read about folks going through two or three MHs before they find the right fit, so we'd like to make our first 'mistake' as cheaply as possible. 🙂

Our existing vehicles are a Toyota Prius and a Hyundai Sonata, so towing a TT isn't really an option.

We're looking at 21 - 24 foot Class Cs from manufacturers such as Chinook and Lazy Daze. We've pretty much ruled out Phoenix, Coach House, Born Free, etc. because we can't afford them.

We camp three or four times a year. One trip is always to someplace like Tahoe or Yellowstone, but the rest are within 1-4 hours of home. The hubs loves camping but hates packing, set-up and takedown, so I bet we'd travel more if leaving meant hopping in the rig and stopping for groceries on the way.

Here are the questions:

1) How do we spot evidence of leaks or dry rot?

2) What's the driving and gas mileage difference between something like a Chinook (no cabover bed) and a Lazy Daze with cabover?

3) Is a small Class C really not that different from driving a car? What do I need to know about backing or corners? I've driven a minivan before, and a smallish cabover style Uhaul w/o freaking out. 🙂

4) We're trying to limit our choices to the Ford 350/450 chassis. My understanding is worse mileage but far better reliability and cheaper repair costs, right? And they'll last well past 100k miles if well maintained?

5) Are we shooting ourselves in any necessary appendages by starting out with a +/-15 year old rig? In terms of mileage, the stuff we're finding tends to have 40-70k on it. We're ruling out the rigs with 90,000 miles or more.

6) Given the above, what should we be aware of in terms of expected maintenance, chance of breaking down in the middle of nowhere, etc.

7) Our driveway is not level. Is that a problem when the RV is parked between trips? (If so, we've got street parking.)

😎 Asking price vs. selling price - how flexible are most of the prices we're seeing? Would anyone like to opine on whether it's better to go with a dealer or a private seller?

Sample low end of our price range: http://www.rvtrader.com/listing/1989-Lazy-Daze-23.5-Front-Lounge-110537531 (yeah, I know - no interior pics, but it's just an example.)

Sample high end of our price range: http://www.rvtrader.com/listing/2000-Chinook-Concourse-Xl-110799013

Happy travels, and many, many thanks!

Kary

[snowdance]

karyj wrote:
Thank you, Snowdance.

I have to say, I'm really loving looking at everyone's pics of their rigs, pets and travel adventures. It's giving me a serious case of wanderlust, but I'm enjoying the heck out of it. 🙂

For my wife and I it as always been about the travels and our rigs were what worked best for us at the time. While the had our Airstream we wore out a Popup and a tent. We just love to travel..

[karyj]

Thank you, Snowdance.

I have to say, I'm really loving looking at everyone's pics of their rigs, pets and travel adventures. It's giving me a serious case of wanderlust, but I'm enjoying the heck out of it. 🙂

[snowdance]

karyj wrote:


Looks like insurance is less with a TV+TT vs. a Class C, though. Is that correct?

Thanks!

Kary

We bought our C and decided to sell our 2nd vehicle. The ins on our C was with in a couple bucks of the vehicle we sold. We get along fine with one car.

However a TT is covered by your house ins when setting at home in your yard, in most cases. It is also covered by your car/truck ins when towing as a towed trailer, in most cases. So TT ins is really incase its taken or damaged when setting away from home and not hooked to the tow vehicle, in most cases. So usaly does not cost much. However you also need to have some thing to tow with.

In our case we went with a C because we no longer needed a 2nd vehicle and ours needed replacing so selling was best for us. Did get most of the price of the used C.

[karyj]

Thanks, again everyone. 🙂

I've spent the last few days reading RVSue's blog. We're no closer to buying (and that's OK), but dang her pics up in the mountains have me wanting to be there.

Her blog was interesting to me because she's fulltiming with two dogs in a small trailer / large van combo. I've also read extensively through the Pets forum, so I won't ask pet questions, here.

Looks like insurance is less with a TV+TT vs. a Class C, though. Is that correct?

Thanks!

Kary

[Bordercollie]

Tires are damaged just sitting parked with weight of RV, they can develop sidewall cracks and other internal problems in 4-6 years. Frequent driving and covering of tires from sun and weather can extend useful life. Our roof AC lasted 9 years but was used a lot during a home remodel. Our fridge died at about the same time, was used a lot slightly off level. There is hearsay that current fridge cooling units don't last as long. RV fridges are not robust like home fridges with compressors, etc. Strong sun is tough on awning fabric, expect 10 year life. Engines, transmissions and engine cooling systems on Ford E450 V10's are pretty trouble free. Brake fluid needs changing and brakes should be inspected and serviced as needed for safety. Keep an eye out for evidence of roof and window casing leaks and take action to prevent expensive damage. Most RV brands use the same brands of appliances, AC's, generators and awnings. Some brands use better fastening methods, materials and quality control during assembly. I would recommend buying a 3 year old rig with no serious problems and setting aside money for eventual repairs, upgrades and replacements in a pearl harbor bank account.Be aware of other recurring costs of ownership.

[PghBob]

Hi Karyj:

I will provide my opinion on several of your questions and raise a topic that you might not have made aware of on the forum.

Question 2 Mileage. It will depend on where and how you drive. I tend to drive the speed limit, and my mileage has ranged from a lowly 7.5 mpg to a max of 10.9 in our 27 foot RV.

Question 3 Driving. Having had vans also, I will tell you that it NOT the same as driving cars or vans. It requires a bit more work at the wheel. Also, the driver(s) will need to become adept at using and having confidence in the rear view mirrors on your rig. This is important not only for backing up, but also when switching lanes on the highway. Finally, you will need to learn to adjust for "tail swing". Because most Class Cs have considerable length beyond the rear wheels, when you turn the front of the rig in one direction, the rear of the rig moves in the opposite direction. This is important, not only when parking, but also in gas stations. Pick your gas pump carefully!

Question 4 Engine. I know you are looking at older rigs. Make every attempt to get an engine with fuel injection verses carb. The fuel injected models reportedly get improved fuel mileage and are easier to repair.

The one issue you did not ask about but is very important is the Occupant and Cargo Carrying Capacity of the rig. This is the max weight any chassis can carry when loaded with fuel, propane, food, water, gray and black tanks, and people. Basically, you and your stuff. Different chassis have different limits. And, options on the rig, like slideouts or leveling systems, add weight to the chassis which effectively reduces the amount of people and stuff you can carry. An overloaded chassis is dangerous and can lead to tire and suspension failures. It has been reported that over 50% of RVs on the road are overloaded. Try to determine the OCCC of the rig you are interested in before you buy to make sure it can carry the people and stuff you need on your trips.

Best wishes,

Bob

[Mich_F]

karyj wrote:
Yikes! But hey, I bet they'd give us a good deal on that one. Open floor plan with lots of natural light. Air cooled, great ventilation, panoramic views. 😉

They might charge extra for all those "options". :B

[karyj]

Yikes! But hey, I bet they'd give us a good deal on that one. Open floor plan with lots of natural light. Air cooled, great ventilation, panoramic views. 😉

[Mich_F]

As many have already stated, checking for water leaks is extremely important. Here's an example of what the result is of not properly sealing the cab over section of a class C.

[ol__yeller]

I have been looking for the perfect Class C since May and still haven't found it. The market here in the Northwet is still very hot and everything is way overpriced. The only RVs that don't sell are those with big problems and even those are overpriced. A good one disappears very quickly. My plan is to wait until the season is over and then restart my search. Besides leaks, check for DLAM. I have seen several units with that problem and it isn't cheap to fix. I have come to the decision to buy newer rather than the price range you are in because it is very rare to find a well kept older RV. I would rather pay for a higher mileage RV that is well kept than a low mileage unit that has been neglected.

The advice given here has been good so far. The only thing I'd add is given that your drive is not level, make sure that the overhang behind the rear wheels won't drag as you come into or out of your driveway.

I'd hold no fear about a Ford V10. I had one in my '99 F250 and found it to be very reliable and powerful. Mileage in an RV will be realistically 7-8 MPG with some exceptions on both ends. Happy hunting!

[F1bNorm]

You might consider other brands. We have a 24' Winn Aspect and it was quite a bit less $ than a comparable Chinook or Lazy Daze. My brother has a LD and has some goofy features (like the drivers seat reclines into the bathroom by way of a spring loaded hatch!).

CA state parks (and many others) often have size restrictions on the spaces and the first cut-off seems to be 24'. Meaning at 24' you can have access to almost any spot. If you have a 27' your choices will be fewer and so on.

With a teen I would get a cabover. We got through our teeners by having a van and trailer. The kids liked staying in the van away from mom and dad. TV could also be a PU w/shell. You might also think about in a few years Jr may be driving and how you're going to deal with that. A TV might be a third daily driver. Also a trailer is easy to level on a sloping driveway.

Having said this, a MH is easier to handle than a trailer and there isn't any hookup (until you get a towd).

Our MPG with a E350 V10 is 10-11, 9 when towing our Honda.

Check the age of the tires, they're good for about 6 or so years, no matter how much tread is left. That's about a $1000-$1600 hit. Figure that in your bargaining.

Some will not agree, but you can use the NADA RV price guide as a general reference.

That's my 2 cents!

Norm

[DaHose]

You have lots of good info., so I'll just add some personal experience.

My 26' Jamboree (1983) has the ideal floor plan you describe. It also has room for two captain chairs behind the passenger seat and a 3 person jackknife couch behind the driver. The dining stands on two posts in the floor, in front of the couch. The captain chairs have a fold out table in between. It's a TON of usable living and dining space. Pull the table and posts and you have open floor. I LOVE this floorplan and the cabover is a queen.

If you have an RV space, then 30+ isn't such a big deal, but if you have to street park some and visit friends in urban areas, you will REALLY appreciate being less than 30'.

If I were in your shoes, I would be looking for a newer 26' with this floor plan. They are hard to find, though.

Another thing I know about is water damage. The modern MH's with totally flat and smooth sides are made from the vacuum formed pieces mentioned earlier. Any delamination in that kind of body is cause to walk away. It is just too expensive to repair and affects the structural stability of the whole coach. The older MH's with corrugated FRP outer skins have wood and/or metal framing inside. Some buckling isn't so bad in that type, but it would indicate water leakage. Water leakage is a KILLER!!!! Look in every single corner and along every seam. If you see water staining or curling/crumpling of the veneer, that tells you water is leaking there. Un-noticed leaks are almost always on the roof. If you notice the water damage in the middle of the floor, check for overhead vents or leaky plumbing. Another thing you should just re-seal is all your windows. There is NO REASON for you NOT to just re-seal all the windows. It is cheap insurance and will last you many years.

Good luck and have fun searching.

Jose

[karyj]

Thanks, everyone! I knew this would be the right place to ask. 😄

I'm absorbing as much as I can, and coming back to re-read everything more than once.

Re: space - when we tent camp, we go in my Prius, so we're pretty good about not needing a lot of space or gear. We don't watch much TV, and a rainy day means books, tablets and Kindles. (Or cards, but I'm a transplanted Michigander and these California types have never even heard of Euchre. Can you imagine??)

We mostly stick to state / National parks and forest service places, so I guess I'm not too worried about year requirements on a potential RV purchase. As a girl, my family went from tents, to a popup, to a TT and then to Camp Hilton. My favorite of the lot was the 70s-era Apache popup. The smell of woodsmoke and wet canvas still makes my heart sing.

Can't really put a cat in a popup, though, plus my hunch is that I'll get the hubs on the road more with a comfy motorhome.

I've been dithering back and forth about the cabover, but you folks are right about the kid. He'll be pushing 6 feet soon enough, and I know he'll like the cabover bed as his own space.

My dream floorplan is a rear corner bed for us, plus a sofa bed or cabover for the kid. If he brings friends along, we'll toss 'em outside in a tent. Chinook has a very rare corner bed, and the Phoenix 2350 has one, too, but the former is darn near impossible to find, and the latter is daydream fodder because of the price.

Anyhow, thank you for all of the advice, and please keep it coming.

[eabc5454]

Keep in mind this:

Internal Revenue Service regulations allow you to deduct mortgage interest on your primary residence and a second home. A motorhome is a second home for tax purposes.

We found we could afford more than we thought we could once the tax deduction was figured into the equation. Get advice from your tax professional to figure out how much you'll save.

Whatever you end up with, enjoy!