Towing 4-wheels down.....braking required for vehicle?

[VA-Apraisr]

Bought a 2018 Jeep Wrangler and moving from a tow-dolly to this setup. Wondering if the auxiliary braking system is required. I didn't have anything other than emergency cable brake for trailer in case it came detached from the RV. I've bought a used Blue Ox towing bar and was looking at a Blue Ox braking unit that sits on floor of tow vehicle. Just seeing what the best setup is to be safe. Thanks!!

PS: Ok, I ordered the NSA Ready Brake receiver surge brake and one question: Do you guys just turn on running lights if driving at night, or did you run additional wiring?

[cbigham]

Perhaps best to visualize the situation as a series of speed bumps going around a corner or even around corner up or down hill. Either way, better to have towed brakes than not.

Good luck with your purchase,

Cb

[VA-Apraisr]

From what I've read, the surge brake has a shock-style cylinder that activates at 250lbs of pressure applied from the toad in a braking or shoving situation from the toad onto the RV via the surge brake tongue connection. Simple, straight-forward cable connection that if installed correctly, should work in those situation you describe in Alaska. Force is force regardless if its from braking/sliding/slipping/bucking.....too much pressure and the surge brake will pull on the toad brake pedal as needed. Obviously, if the toad goes sideways in a slide all bets are off (as in most all braking systems).

[cbigham]

No affiliation but have used https://www.demco-products.com/rv-towing/supplemental-brakes/stay-in-play-duo
For my hydraulic braked class c for many years, and before that their air brake system for my 40 ft diesel prior to the class c. Worked as it should, very reliably never an issue. We just completed Alaskan trip this summer. Nothing broke, no false braking incidents, no troubles in spite of the badly damaged roads, dirt sections, mud, occasional snow early in our departure.Both air and electric systems very robust. I couldn't imagine how the surge brake systems would perform with the bucking and bouncing, sections ornplaces an immediate stop on a curve section or detour where I had no towed brakes... jeep pushing the motorhome in such situations in mud, dirt,uneven pavement, mud, ice etc.

I think it a false economy debating whether you need this or not. Fwiw if I did it again I'd get the electrical version first. Will work on any towing vehicle. My jeep has the guts of the air brake system still in it, lights, wiring, but also the electrical. Had it 14 years. Electrical system would have worked just fine with the diesel had I known better back. In. The. Day.

[houstonstroker]

Texas law is 4500 pounds or more, auxiliary braking is required. Also get the wiring kit and fasten an outlet on the front of the Jeep somewhere. Then the cord plugs into the motorhome 7 way. I also take advantage of the charge wire, so the Jeep battery remains charged.

[VA-Apraisr]

Haha......saw the photo and thought you were serious!! 🙂 Yeah, trying to avoid the redneck fix-it-yourself-and-go process! I'll be using a 4" riser hook as well since my Jeep has a lift on it to ensure straight pulling and proper engagement of surge braking. Just waiting on the parts to be delivered and then wiring up the toad to the RV.

[klutchdust]

wolfe10 wrote:

klutchdust wrote:

VA-Apraisr wrote:
Thanks for all the info. Using the surge brake from NSA as well as breakaway cable in case the worst happens. Fortunately, the aftermarket metal front bumper with winch and D-hooks can be used instead of a Blue Ox mounting bracket which saves some $$. All in all, converting to 4-down isn't costing me the price I received selling my tow dolly.

My 08 Jk had an aftermarket bumper. I removed the D rings and fabricated a hitch point for the tow bar. i hard wired the brake lights and mounted a plug on the front of the jeep. Using the NSA braking system i was ready to go in a short time. Sold the C and the Jeep. I miss the jeep.



Of course then you see this.......

WOW, your REALLY need a "rise hitch" on the tow vehicle.

Tow vehicle to toad should be pretty close to horizontal.

When I pulled alongside I was amused. No baseplate, just the chains going around the bumper.

[wolfe10]

klutchdust wrote:

VA-Apraisr wrote:
Thanks for all the info. Using the surge brake from NSA as well as breakaway cable in case the worst happens. Fortunately, the aftermarket metal front bumper with winch and D-hooks can be used instead of a Blue Ox mounting bracket which saves some $$. All in all, converting to 4-down isn't costing me the price I received selling my tow dolly.

My 08 Jk had an aftermarket bumper. I removed the D rings and fabricated a hitch point for the tow bar. i hard wired the brake lights and mounted a plug on the front of the jeep. Using the NSA braking system i was ready to go in a short time. Sold the C and the Jeep. I miss the jeep.



Of course then you see this.......

WOW, your REALLY need a "rise hitch" on the tow vehicle.

Tow vehicle to toad should be pretty close to horizontal.

[bobndot]

Gen light and odometer info: :
In place of installing a light harness in the toad , I drilled two holes in my taillight housing to accept a 12v socket and bulb. I ran the wires to the front and tied them into the 7 way plug to pop into the rv’s socket. I added a 12v charge line in that line from the rv to charge the toad battery while towing.

BC i only have toad brake, directional and taillights visible from the rear , i manually turn on the toads running lights while towing in rain or at night to give me more sideview illumination.

On my toad , when i turn the toads ignition ‘on’ to tow , the first click to unlock the steering wheel is what i need. If i accidentally go to the second ignition position , the run position , the toads mileage will accumulate.

[klutchdust]

VA-Apraisr wrote:
Thanks for all the info. Using the surge brake from NSA as well as breakaway cable in case the worst happens. Fortunately, the aftermarket metal front bumper with winch and D-hooks can be used instead of a Blue Ox mounting bracket which saves some $$. All in all, converting to 4-down isn't costing me the price I received selling my tow dolly.

My 08 Jk had an aftermarket bumper. I removed the D rings and fabricated a hitch point for the tow bar. i hard wired the brake lights and mounted a plug on the front of the jeep. Using the NSA braking system i was ready to go in a short time. Sold the C and the Jeep. I miss the jeep.



Of course then you see this.......

[VA-Apraisr]

Thanks for all the info. Using the surge brake from NSA as well as breakaway cable in case the worst happens. Fortunately, the aftermarket metal front bumper with winch and D-hooks can be used instead of a Blue Ox mounting bracket which saves some $$. All in all, converting to 4-down isn't costing me the price I received selling my tow dolly.

[valhalla360]

enblethen wrote:
I am not saying that a person should or should not have an auxiliary braking system. Product information saying it is required is bad information.
Some toads need a braking device. Some MHs have barely enough braking to stop a loaded rig. Some large MHs with air brake style braking may not need a toad with auxiliary braking system.
Yes, I have a braking system!

Still doesn't provide a difference. Even the big diesel pushers with air brakes require trailer brakes for over 3k lb (most states).

Not saying people don't get away with things but if the investigator decides not having brakes was a proximate cause in an accident, you can expect them to cite it and I'm betting the citation would hold up in court.

[enblethen]

I am not saying that a person should or should not have an auxiliary braking system. Product information saying it is required is bad information.
Some toads need a braking device. Some MHs have barely enough braking to stop a loaded rig. Some large MHs with air brake style braking may not need a toad with auxiliary braking system.
Yes, I have a braking system!

[valhalla360]

enblethen wrote:
A towed motor vehicle is not a trailer!

Explain the physics of why stopping a 4500lb car is not the same as stopping a 4500lb trailer for us.

Unless there is a specific statement in the state vehicle code stating towed cars are exempt, you can expect them to treat it as a trailer.

[enblethen]

A towed motor vehicle is not a trailer!