PI EMS-PT30C paid off a couple of days ago.

[Atlee]

We went to a fairly new campground. I've had my PI EMS-PT30 for almost three years now. Made sure I had it before my cross country jaunt in Feb 2014.

Wednesday, I plugged it in the post, but got a E 2 message which meant there was an open ground.

Fortunately, I have a quality 50 amp to 30 amp pig tail. Used it on the 50 amp slot, then hooked the PI to the pig tail, and got no error messages. We were good for the next two days.

I would recommend having a PI EMS-PT30C and a 50 amp to 30 amp pigtail adapter.

[eb145]

myredracer wrote:

Has anyone ever accomplished anything by reporting pedestal problems to the CG?

I was at Claytor Lake State Park in Virginia when my PI EMS would not let the 30 Amp power in to my RV due to hot and neutral being reversed. I told the camp host and 10 minutes later the ranger was at my site fixing it.

The Ranger had a great attitude and stated they did lots of work recently fixing open grounds all over the place. I helped him figure out the hot and neutral wires were wired wrong and he fixed it right there.

Ed

[firestorm79]

We stayed at a campground just outside Zion National Park last year and the 30amp outlet was burnt. I walked over to the office and notified them and within 20 minutes the maintenance guy replaced the outlet/breaker and had it working.

myredracer wrote:

Has anyone ever accomplished anything by reporting pedestal problems to the CG?

We were at a Thousand Trails CG last year and our EMS shut down on low voltage AND open ground at the same time. Their general purpose handyman got his voltmeter out and insisted nothing was wrong. He said he had replaced the receptacle recently and it couldn't possibly be a problem. Here I am an EE (retired) trying to explain how and why it was a problem. I went to the office and the manager she said she saw some electrical work being done and saw them put bare wires in a trench. She said head office simply won't approve money to fix things.

CGs all too often don't have licensed electricians doing the work. The next time it happens, I might advise the local AHJ or state chief electrical inspector and see what happens.

[SoundGuy]

Bumpyroad wrote:
... one thing not mentioned is that mine also has a restart delay so that when the juice goes out and the AC shuts off, when the electricity quickly comes back on that it protects the aC units.

All current EMS units from TRC and Progressive that include low/high voltage detection have delay for this exact reason. I chose the Progressive hard wire version over the portable because my EMS-HW30C can be internally reset for a 15" or 136" delay whereas the portable EMS-PT30C is fixed at 136". We don't run A/C that often so I normally leave it set for the shorter delay but because I added a switch in place of the internal delay jumper I can switch the delay in an instant to 136" when we do plan to use the A/C.

[Bumpyroad]

one thing not mentioned is that mine also has a restart delay so that when the juice goes out and the AC shuts off, when the electricity quickly comes back on that it protects the aC units.
bumpy

[SoundGuy]

djousma wrote:
So it's very similar to this: http://www.precisioncircuitsinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/00-10024-000-Power-Control-System-Min...

As I suspected, an entirely different animal than a surge protector / EMS like those offered by TRC, Progressive Industries, etc. Yours is designed to actively manage loads within the rig so you don't exceed the service you're using ... a surge protector / EMS has no functionality in this regard but is designed to protect your rig's electrical system from potential power line source errors, from surges to spikes to pedestal wiring errors to what I believe is most important - low and high voltage situations, particularly the former which is so common during the hot summer months and all your neighbours are also running their A/C units to the max. :E

[djousma]

SoundGuy wrote:

djousma wrote:
I have a 2017 Cardinal with 3A/C's and I have a "energy management" panel on my control panel. I have no idea what it does, other than do load balancing when plugged into something less than 50AMP? Do I get the protection already? Or do I still need this unit?

Just the other day I read another forum discussion about this but failed to bookmark it :S ... unfortunate because the details clearly detailed why these included factory installed "energy management systems" are a completely different animal from the surge protector / EMS units we're talking about here in this discussion. Without specifics about your particular system I'd say yes, you want an external EMS such as the Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C or EMS-HW50C.

So it's very similar to this: http://www.precisioncircuitsinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/00-10024-000-Power-Control-System-Min...

Except mine is W/H, A/C RR, A/C-FRT, and A/C-MID. I'm pretty confident that the EMS that came with my cardinal is to manage the high draw items when running on less than 50A service.

EDIT: I've sent Progressive support some email, and we'll see what they say. I suspect it will still be a good thing to have, just want to make sure there will be no issues with both coexisting, and no overlap in function.

[SoundGuy]

djousma wrote:
I have a 2017 Cardinal with 3A/C's and I have a "energy management" panel on my control panel. I have no idea what it does, other than do load balancing when plugged into something less than 50AMP? Do I get the protection already? Or do I still need this unit?

Just the other day I read another forum discussion about this but failed to bookmark it :S ... unfortunate because the details clearly detailed why these included factory installed "energy management systems" are a completely different animal from the surge protector / EMS units we're talking about here in this discussion. Without specifics about your particular system I'd say yes, you want an external EMS such as the Progressive Industries EMS-PT50C or EMS-HW50C.

[SoundGuy]

jnharley wrote:
I must say he staff worked diligently trying to trouble shoot and correct the issue but were not electricians and one was going to have to be called.

Unfortunately this all too often true - the staff member who comes to your site to "fix" your electrical issue is also the same staff member who cleans the bath houses, cuts the grass, does general repairs around the property - and as such is likely to have little real electrical training or proper understanding of electrical wiring standards and related codes. 😞 Protect yourself from this foolishness - invest in an EMS! :B

[djousma]

I have a 2017 Cardinal with 3A/C's and I have a "energy management" panel on my control panel. I have no idea what it does, other than do load balancing when plugged into something less than 50AMP? Do I get the protection already? Or do I still need this unit?

[jnharley]

Our EMS has saved us several times. We were in a campground in Alberta in a new section and our EMS would not let power through because of an open ground. 30 amp was messed up too. Lots of people plugged in with no knowledge that there was a problem. The owner admitted that he had no idea why he could not get power when he parked his mh in one of the new sites and realized (because of us) that it was because he had an EMS. I must say he staff worked diligently trying to trouble shoot and correct the issue but were not electricians and one was going to have to be called. We just used our generator and inverter for our electrical needs. We have a hard wired unit and will not have an RV without some sort of power protection.

[wa8yxm]

Some short stories: Stayed at a moose lodge once and the Governor ask me if I'd tried plugging into the 60 amp outlet (Believe it or not it was a TT-30) I said "No, what is it 240 volt?" he admitted it was (i found said outlet later.. I had noticed that in teh circuit breaker box there were only 4 60 amp breakers, two pair of ganged. so I already knew it was a 240 out outlet for a fryer)

One (not Thousand Trailes) CG I was at the 50 amp breaker pair on my site was bad, and I mean B*A*D!! as little as 20 amps was tripping it.... The manager tried to tell me (Certified electronics tech, and trained in engineering) it was the fault of us 50 amp rigs trying to draw "Too much current" (most 50 amp RV's draw less than 30 amps per leg, unlike 30 amp Rv's which can draw more than 30 for brief preiods) The electrican who replaced it did a good job

I have seen cases where the ground wire was simply cut too short and did not reach the terminal

I have also watched (And very slightly assisted) the crew at one Thousand Trails fixing a wireing fault (cable fault) and these folks did a first class job.. That said. When I say "Slightly assisted" They put in a few new boxes.. I shoveled a bit of dirt and steadied the box while they finished the job, Nothing electrical (I am not licensed for that, so let them do it) but I am licensed to shovel dirt (no license required)

The fun part was a "neighbor" on a long term leased site, who was doing a bit of landscaping and drove a length of Rebar.... RIGHT THROUGH THE BRAND NEW CABLE.

[SoundGuy]

Like most I too camped for years without using any form of electrical protection for our trailer, 'though early on I did at least start checking the campsite source voltage with a DVM before plugging in and later invested in a Kill-a-Watt meter I would leave plugged in so I could monitor the voltage throughout our stay. I also eventually added a polarity checker to my kit which proved useful a couple of times when I did find a miswired campsite power post. As time went on and I began reading more and more on the forums about surge protector / EMS units it one day suddenly occurred to me that perhaps the reason the microwave oven in our KZ Spree had failed wasn't because it simply self destructed but because it had suffered some sort of error in the campsite source supply. :M Not long after I had the opportunity to buy a used TRC Surge Guard from an older fellow who was retiring from camping ... and in just the next few months was surprised at how many times it detected an error and shut off power to our camper. :E That confirmed it so a year later I sold the TRC to a friend and invested in a hard wire Progressive Industries EMS-HW30C which since then has also disconnected our trailer from campsite source power, 3 times last season and once this season already. During the season I keep our trailer parked here at the house, plugged in, and my EMS disconnected power to the trailer at least twice since I've had it ... seems source power line errors are much more common than one would think. :E I'm sold, and wouldn't ever plug into power from any source without protecting the trailer with some version of surge protector / EMS unit that includes low/high voltage protection. Considering the cost of repairing / replacing electrical devices in our camper the cost of one of these EMS units is a small price to pay for the protection it offers. :B

[time2roll]

Old-Biscuit wrote:
Did you let CG Staff know of the OPEN GROUND issue with that pedestal 30A receptacle???

Yes I let them know. Stared at me like a deer in headlights. Sorry no electrician on the weekend, would you like to move sites? :R

Later it dawned on me I had stayed in this site a couple years before with the same issue :S

Anyway like the OP I used my 50/30 adapter and just got on with my day.

[camperforlife]

Installed the hardwired PI 30a EMS to my new trailer this spring. I had one converter replaced in a previous trailer and don't plan on ever going through that again.