3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[jayven]

Just use a larger pipe say 1 1/2 inch and seal it to the smaller pipe end with the high temp silicone and make the hole in the wall a little bigger than that pipe say 2" and use the high temp there too. then test it after it dries while your watching it.

[Ringo5000]

I have just purchased a Nikota 3500 at Costco for a mere $278. Its somewhere between quiet and loud. The muffler has about a one inch exhaust port. I want to use it in my non-connected garage (doors closed) if the power goes out. So I need to 'pipe' the exhaust fumes out. Any ideas for a conduit that will fit and take the heat. Back pressure shouldnt be an issue because it only needs to be about 6 feet long or so.
I dont know if its the long shipping from China or what, but my unit had a small amount of frame damage too. Probably from being dropped too hard. Its only on the very bottom and not enough to go through hauling it back for. Outside of that, I love this thing so far!

Ringo
Master of All Things not Nailed Down...

[MrWizard]

dacarter

yes, you can use both at the same time you are permantly wired

NO you cannot get full power from the 120 recepticle only 1/2 of the generator power is available at the recepticle,

UNless, they split the duplex, so each half is on a seperate circuit

this would give you (2) 120v legs/circuits but they could NOT be pigtailed because that would be a 240v dead short

if you have a volt meter , test the repcepticle top half to bottom half ( compare all slots to each other )

IF any PAIR/2 slots gives a meter reading of 220-240 then it has a split recpticle and CANNOT-MUST NOT be pigtailed , but you will have (2) different 120v cicruits to run (2) ext cords during an emergency

[dacarter]

I have read most of this thread but may have missed the answers to these questions (heck, who could remember it all).

I recently got the Wen PowerPro 3500 for general home use. It only has one 110 receptical so does that mean the full capacity can be used on that one plug or is it somehow shared with the 220 plug? Also, the older generators at PepBoys had a switch to go between 110 and 220, mine doesn't. Does that mean 110 and 220 can be used at the same time? That would be really handy for me during a power outage since I have a 220 well.

My unit started on the first pull, as other have said and runs really smoothly. It's definately quiter than most construction generators I've heard, but I would not want to be enjoying the great outdoors next to it.

Also, does anyone have a source for wheel kits that fit these generators? It really needs wheels.

[BlackMax]

FYI. I see the Costco here in So.Cal. has a $30 rebate on their Nikota. Good unit at a hard to beat price and return policy.

[mrfixit454]

Looks like my ELIM storm series has to go back. It appears to have been dropped during shipping. Origianlly There was minimal damage but as I was testing voltages later, I saw that one of the mounts on the generator body to frame was cracked off. This will probably take several weeks to resovle before I get another one.

[MrWizard]

professor95 wrote:

that drawing is the first one ( I've seen posted) that clearly shows (2) Zenier diodes and the capactior, which feed the coupling to the feild winding, I stand confirmed & exonerated..

George, I've been looking at the schematic for the past 10 minutes. I see a single PN Junction diode labeled D1 on the field coil and a full wave bridge labeled D2 on the DC output. I also see two connectors labeled Z1 and Z2. But I don't see any Zenier diodes nor do I see the circuitry that would even indicate one might be present. Maybe my eyes are getting too old, or my brain too numb. Please enlighten me as to where they are?

you could be right : it looks like my eyes are the ones that are getting old

but at least there is a clearly marked diode in the feild circuit winding NOT just a cap.

I guess I got zeiners stuck in my head.

[professor95]

that drawing is the first one ( I've seen posted) that clearly shows (2) Zenier diodes and the capactior, which feed the coupling to the feild winding, I stand confirmed & exonerated..

George, I've been looking at the schematic for the past 10 minutes. I see a single PN Junction diode labeled D1 on the field coil and a full wave bridge labeled D2 on the DC output. I also see two connectors labeled Z1 and Z2. But I don't see any Zenier diodes nor do I see the circuitry that would even indicate one might be present. Maybe my eyes are getting too old, or my brain too numb. Please enlighten me as to where they are?

[crunch1]

As so many others, I have tried to read all the pages. My questions are: what is the db on the power pro 3500, also is it necessary to separate the 2 wires, I think it is the red and white that is soldered together inside a sleave, when setting up to put total amps to either outlet?
Thanks for the help,crunch1

[Skibane]

feistycapn wrote:
I have one of the Jiangdong Nikotas. From the parts explode the "cylinder Assembly" is as far as they "disasemble" it for us. It looks like it is a cast aluminum block. If it has a cast iron liner it is part of the assembly and not replaceable. I doubt it has a liner but the only way to know is to disassemble it. I've been known to do this on occasion when something is still in warrantee :)but not this time.

I have never seen a liner that was replaceable (in an air-cooled small engine). It's usually an integral, permanent part of the block.

To determine if it's there, you could remove the spark plug, rotate the crankshaft until the piston is bottomed-out, and then drop a small magnet tied to a piece of thread down the spark plug hole. If the cylinder wall is cast iron (or some other ferrous metal), the magnet should stick to it.

[MrWizard]

mrfixit454 wrote:
Well I received my Storm Series ELIM 3000 today via UPS. It received a little damage from Shipping from NY to CA. A few plastic items were broken and a small dent is on the front panel. I have not started the unit yet as I am supposed to contact UPS within 3 days of receipt. I have a note into ELIM to see if they can do anything first. I hate to ship this back and get another one in worse shape. The packaging is not all that great which is probably why they recommend picking up from their warehouse.

All in all is seems like a nice unit. The schematic in the manual does not seem to match the unit. The manual covers many units. I am a Mech. Egr. so this is my take at first glance. I need to send the schematic picture to Professor if he has time to look at it. I have taken pictures of the Gen. plus damage, plus a few pages in the manual. I'll keep you posted.
I never posted images. Hope these are not too big.

Mine is the DY3000LX. It has 120/240 with (1) duplex and (1) 4 pin twist lock. It appears the schematic they give is for 110 only or one voltage only?? Again.. Maybe and EE can help me here.

thanks

that drawing is the first one ( i've seen posted) that clearly shows (2) Zenier diodes and the capactior, which feed the coupling to the feild winding, I stand confirmed & exonerated..

I don't why people thought a cap alone could be used as a regulator, without diodes blocking the reverse in current , it could not discharge

[feistycapn]

cmg3500 wrote:

Does anyone know if the Power Pro,or any of the other clones have a cast Iron sleeve?
Thanks

I have one of the Jiangdong Nikotas. From the parts explode the "cylinder Assembly" is as far as they "disasemble" it for us. It looks like it is a cast aluminum block. If it has a cast iron liner it is part of the assembly and not replaceable. I doubt it has a liner but the only way to know is to disassemble it. I've been known to do this on occasion when something is still in warrantee :)but not this time.

[cmg3500]

I have a Power Pro 3500 by Wen,that I purchased from Pep Boys a couple of months ago.I am looking at this forum,& see the onan that looks real simular,& it says that it has a "Cast Iron Cylinder Sleeve".
Does anyone know if the Power Pro,or any of the other clones have a cast Iron sleeve?
Thanks

[MrWizard]

well that's one way to try and beat the HEAT !

[Skibane]

Only loosly related to the thread topic, but entertaining nonetheless...



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