Buying/evaluating a used Harbor Freight hydraulic crimper?

[Naio]

Somebody has one for sale for half price in the town that I'm in, says it was only used a couple times. time2roll,I see from a search here that you bought one. Do you still like it?

Reading the reviews, I see that people complain about the dies wearing out quickly. Will I be able to tell if the ones I want to use are worn? What should I look for?

I'm not going into business crimping cables, just need to do a few to connect up my batteries and charging system. So Harbor Freight quality seems like it might be potentially right for my purposes :B.

I've never used a hydraulic crimper, so I have no idea what I'm doing. I figure you guys are the experts!

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Naio, look at DMSO GEL on Ebay or Amazon



Use it as an ointment. This stuff is not some miracle sucker bait. Low priced and it actually works. Made from wood processing. I live with pain 24/7 not a little pain -- enough to awaken me at 0300 and only allow me to sleep in fits of a couple of hours. Bad enough that 10 milligrams of oxycodone plus 30 milligrams of oral morphine make me feel merely normal and greatly reduces my computation error when working with electronics. BUT the DEA today makes it almost impossible to get. Last dose for me was 2012. The reins have been turned over to pain doctors who milk the system like a state champion Jersey Cow.

[Gdetrailer]

Naio wrote:
I have some nerve damage in my hands, that makes soldering really difficult for me. It's certainly possible that I could get better at it than I am, with some thought into technique!

And the right tools. I have a big heavy vise that I never use. I found a small lightweight one at a garage sale. I didn't know they made small lightweight ones :-). I expect it will help a lot.

And the mini torch sounds like it has a lot of potential. The problem I have is that the soldering iron or torch, and the terminal, and the wire are all shaking in my shaky hands. Plus I can't see for sh*t.

For big jobs like say 2 ga or heavier wire, a propane torch is the tool for the job..

The one I used in my how to document is like this one..



Which is a torch on a hose, pricy but very light weight since the propane can fits in a holster and the holster has a belt loop.

For very small soldering jobs, I use a soldering station and basically you have a very light weight pencil tip soldering iron with all the heavy parts in the base that sits on your desk.

The part you hold weighs about the same as a pencil!

Looks like this..



I recently had to repair my DDs $180 10" tablet, some how, she managed to break the USB port which doubles as the charging port..

Takes a micro USB connector..

I was able to take an old cellphone, unsolder the USB jack from the cellphone, remove the broken tablet USB jack and solder the replacement USB jack in.. And it passed the smoke test!

That was all surface mount stuff, I had to modify one of my soldering station tips by grinding it down to nearly a needle point tip..

Told my DD that it WAS the smallest items I have ever worked with.. Lets not break it again, please?

One of the issues that can affect a solder joint is movement when cooling.

Movement while cooling tends to "crystallize" the solder, this changes the alloy structure which affects the overall strength and even resistance.. This is often called a "cold solder joint" and has a dull almost aluminum look to it.

To reduce the chance of movement you can get little "vices" with "gator clips" called "helping hands" to put the wires into for the soldering operation.

Looks like this..


Allow to cool then cover with heat shrink tubing (they do make a glue filled heat shrink tubing which works great for outdoor exposures)..

[MrWizard]

'Lead Sled' is a common term for Hot Rods and chopped lowered cars from the 30s to 50s
I think....Bondo came into use some time in the 60s

lower the roof of the car.. think "rebel without a cause" , fill everything in with lead solder, sand and paint

[fj12ryder]

Gdetrailer wrote:

fj12ryder wrote:
"Mere oxygen turns copper dark over time." But doesn't that "patina" actually protect the underlying copper? As opposed to iron oxide, rust, which just flakes off. There are other issues involved I'm sure, but the fact that copper turns dark doesn't indicate the copper is damaged.

Sort of, the problem is that there is not only Oxygen in the air, there is MOISTURE in that same air (it IS the same air that we breathe).

Oxygen and moisture together create a thin oxidation layer on the surface of the copper wire. That in it's self isn't a big issue, the problem is that oxidized layer has considerable resistance. Not to mention, that layer does not stop at the point the wire is covered, it keeps CREEPING, right under the cover.. Partly due to the moisture in the air which gets wicked up the wire strands..

Oxidization of copper also severely weakens the copper, basically over time as it oxidizes the strands get weak and start breaking.

Now, for adding insult to injury, toss some road salt or salt water spray into the mix and watch that unprotected copper wire rot before your eyes!

That is one of the reasons marine grade wire is pretinned..

Yes, crimping "packs" the wires together tightly, but often not enough to prevent moisture and oxygen from creeping into the crimp.

There is also an issue with over crimping and under crimping. It is extremely easy to crush the wires making the wire BRITTLE just before the crimp and that results in strands simply breaking off all on their own, add in vibration and that crimp will fail..

Under crimped and the wires tend to simply pull loose and you will also have a very high resistance connection..

Name of the game is making a very low resistance connection which is also mechanically strong and well protected from air and moisture in the air.. Solder CAN do all of that, but it has been maligned by those that really don't understand how to properly solder..

By the way, ALL of the components like resistors, transitors, ICs, capacitors and such in "Avionics" equipment are ALL SOLDERED to the circuit boards, those parts are not "crimped" to the boards..

So, if "vibration" is the supposed reason as to why crimps are used in connectors perhaps you could explain why important electronic parts in airplane radios and systems are only soldered to the board and not crimped?

Thanks for the education about the patina, nice to know. Beats the heck out of "I know, don't question me" attitude.

[Naio]

I have some nerve damage in my hands, that makes soldering really difficult for me. It's certainly possible that I could get better at it than I am, with some thought into technique!

And the right tools. I have a big heavy vise that I never use. I found a small lightweight one at a garage sale. I didn't know they made small lightweight ones :-). I expect it will help a lot.

And the mini torch sounds like it has a lot of potential. The problem I have is that the soldering iron or torch, and the terminal, and the wire are all shaking in my shaky hands. Plus I can't see for sh*t.

[Gdetrailer]

fj12ryder wrote:
"Mere oxygen turns copper dark over time." But doesn't that "patina" actually protect the underlying copper? As opposed to iron oxide, rust, which just flakes off. There are other issues involved I'm sure, but the fact that copper turns dark doesn't indicate the copper is damaged.

Sort of, the problem is that there is not only Oxygen in the air, there is MOISTURE in that same air (it IS the same air that we breathe).

Oxygen and moisture together create a thin oxidation layer on the surface of the copper wire. That in it's self isn't a big issue, the problem is that oxidized layer has considerable resistance. Not to mention, that layer does not stop at the point the wire is covered, it keeps CREEPING, right under the cover.. Partly due to the moisture in the air which gets wicked up the wire strands..

Oxidization of copper also severely weakens the copper, basically over time as it oxidizes the strands get weak and start breaking.

Now, for adding insult to injury, toss some road salt or salt water spray into the mix and watch that unprotected copper wire rot before your eyes!

That is one of the reasons marine grade wire is pretinned..

Yes, crimping "packs" the wires together tightly, but often not enough to prevent moisture and oxygen from creeping into the crimp.

There is also an issue with over crimping and under crimping. It is extremely easy to crush the wires making the wire BRITTLE just before the crimp and that results in strands simply breaking off all on their own, add in vibration and that crimp will fail..

Under crimped and the wires tend to simply pull loose and you will also have a very high resistance connection..

Name of the game is making a very low resistance connection which is also mechanically strong and well protected from air and moisture in the air.. Solder CAN do all of that, but it has been maligned by those that really don't understand how to properly solder..

By the way, ALL of the components like resistors, transitors, ICs, capacitors and such in "Avionics" equipment are ALL SOLDERED to the circuit boards, those parts are not "crimped" to the boards..

So, if "vibration" is the supposed reason as to why crimps are used in connectors perhaps you could explain why important electronic parts in airplane radios and systems are only soldered to the board and not crimped?

[Gdetrailer]

Naio wrote:
Wow! never heard of that. It sounds like it would be a lot easier on the old cars that are made of thicker steel 🙂

Autobody lead solder is 30% tin/70% lead, has working temp from 361 F- 489 F so you can work with rather thin body steel. Actually ideal for working with tin that has considerable thinning due to rust.

Low working temp means much less chance of warping the panel.

Just have to make darn sure ALL the rust has been removed before attempting to tin the material.

Once Tinned, moisture can no longer get to the steel below and the tin layer acts a bit like rust proofing.

One of my biggest gripes with plastic fillers is they often absorb and trap moisture, this leads to the filler cracking, popping and or the steel under the filler rusting out..

Watched my Dad Autobody solder once many years ago and amazed just how well it can work.. Of course, he was an amazing at autobody work, enjoyed watching him weld body panels with Oxy/Ace torch and a coat hanger and never warp the panel..

My point is soldering is not hard, nor a mystery, anyone can learn to do it, just takes some basic understanding and knowledge..

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Wouldn't it be great if it didn't affect resistance? And even greater if the "patina" continue to develop and degrade? The warmer it gets the faster the deterioration. The only true deterioration proof coating is certainly not tin or silver -- it is gold. Scuff the gold and well, too bad.

Answers should read

"BLAH BLAH is good FOR ME"

I have soldered well over a million times and some stuff was twice the size of 4/0 cable. I have made a lot of money repairing or replacing non soldered terminations. I have not made much money repairing correctly soldered joints.

Not solder a termination connected to a flooded battery? Allow me to re-groove your tires and pulse desulfate your batteries. Competitive pricing.

[fj12ryder]

"Mere oxygen turns copper dark over time." But doesn't that "patina" actually protect the underlying copper? As opposed to iron oxide, rust, which just flakes off. There are other issues involved I'm sure, but the fact that copper turns dark doesn't indicate the copper is damaged.

[time2roll]

Naio wrote:
I'm happy to get professionally-made cables when I install my DC system! Are genuinedealz soldered or crimped? I don't see the answer on their website.

Crimped.

Crimp or solder is fine if done correctly. if done correctly.
I prefer crimp.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

LET's BLOW THE SNOT OUT FROM UNDER ANOTHER MYTH...

"Crimped Terminals Are Better"

Have you doubters any idea whatsoever what it takes a business to solder? None.

• Lead-free plumbers solder melts at a temperature that destroys electrical wire insulation. Toss that idea out the window
• Hot smoking lead and the EPA and OSHA. Wait! I forgot healthcare liability!
• Approved clothing?
• Suits?
• Air masks?
• Air scrubbers?
• OSHA and EPA paperwork?
• Battery manufacturing is strict and hideously expensive with hidden costs
• But cold Pb lead work is a freakin' joke compared to hot lead work.
• Wave soldering is done in a tiny confined space.

I had to pay seventy to ninety dollars 30-40 years ago to get voluntarily tested for toxic metals accumulation.


Just the fact that no one commented on the industry demand of using OEM style terminals for crimped joints told me a lot.

Mere oxygen turns copper dark over time. Insulation also enters into longevity. Insulation bearing any sulfur will turn copper black and blue over time. Strip a length of CROSS LINK POLYOLEFIN wire sometime. Is the copper new-penny-shiny? Crimp a bunch of these strands together and you will have oxidation resting against oxidation after a time even starting out with shiny new copper. If that bundle is soldered it could care less because the bond from termination to core metal is permanent and absolute.

Life in O2 and seawater taught me a lot. It is the school of the very hardest of knocks.

It is perfectly fine to not give a **** about any of this, just don't represent it the wrong way to others.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

You cannot BELIEVE how fast pneumatic bench mounted cutters and crimpers are. They use dolly wheel carts with spools. Final measurements are done on the bench.

WHACK! 4/0 is cut with the push of a pedal

YANK! Cable is circular cut, then sliced to strip an end. The bumper stops the terminal and one hand holds the cable in place.

CRIMP! another pedal gets pushed.

The heat shrink is slipped over the end and the operator swivels his or her seat. The assembled end is stuck in a chamber a timer switch is pressed and electric radiant heat shrinks the tubing. When the light goes off, the other end is done, the cable is thrown over the shoulder into a bin.

Elapsed time, forty seconds both ends.

[Naio]

Wow! never heard of that. It sounds like it would be a lot easier on the old cars that are made of thicker steel 🙂

[Gdetrailer]

Naio wrote:
I'm happy to get professionally-made cables when I install my DC system! Are genuinedealz soldered or crimped? I don't see the answer on their website.

But I'd also like to expand my options for when I need to do DIY fixes immediately, like while camping. Between the ice machine in the van, it happens a lot. And my hands are pretty messed up.

For those who use a mini torch, how large of wire can you do with that?

I would expect Genuinedealz like most any other "professional" outfit WILL crimp only.

Not a slight against them or any others but it IS done because it is QUICK, FAST AND CHEAP.

Think about this, in the time it takes to make a proper solder connection you can easily crimp 20,30 perhaps even 40 crimp connections..

Soldering takes time to prep, MUST HAVE CLEAN EVERYTHING), takes time to HEAT the connection, takes time for the connection to cool.

Soldering is an "art" but once you learn the basics can be applied to many different situations.

My Dad, taught me how to solder wire when I was young and nearly 50 yrs later, I still am learning new applications..

Learning how to solder wire properly has served me well, was able to pickup sweating copper pipe very easily, very rarely have ever had pin holes and rework on plumbing..

Recently, I decided to try the old school autobody method of "leading" or "body soldering" as it is now called instead of using plastic body filler..

Clean the metal well, apply auto body tinning flux/solder, wipe off with clean cloth then lightly heat the steel until the body solder turns to a putty like consistency.. Push body lead around with wooden paddles to smooth out..

Make a mistake, reheat and do over again..

Not sure I would ever want to mess with the cheap plastic body filler that often breaks, cracks and fails after a few years any more..

[Naio]

I'm happy to get professionally-made cables when I install my DC system! Are genuinedealz soldered or crimped? I don't see the answer on their website.

But I'd also like to expand my options for when I need to do DIY fixes immediately, like while camping. Between the ice machine in the van, it happens a lot. And my hands are pretty messed up.

For those who use a mini torch, how large of wire can you do with that?