Trying the Hugh’s Autoformer...

[3_tons]

The problem I’ve looooong been trying to overcome is to be able to get the Coleman Mach 1-P.S. 11kbtu AC to run while the honda genny is operating in the ‘eco’ mode, but always without any luck...The genny runs it just fine when NOT in the eco mode - but at much higher RPM, higher noise levels and fuel greater consumption.

I also have a powerful pass-thru inverter-charger that (when desert dry camping) I often keep in the standby mode...I have tried to run the air with genny in the ‘eco mode’, but to no avail - each time I’ve attempted this the inverter picks-up the entire air conditioner load then tries unsuccessfully to hand the load back to the genny, but the genny (in eco) struggles and is never able to resolve this sudden increased load - so the inverter takes the entire air conditioner load and happily carries on until I switch the genny off of eco...

So I swapped out the OME start cap with a electronic wiz-bang soft start, but with still no luck at this scenario while in eco mode...Then thinking I may need more power, I traded up from the trusty Honda 2000 to a Honda 2200, yet still no dang luck (Ugg!)...

So yesterday I pulled the cover off the Coleman and did a Ohm winding test and a continuity test, but found all to be within Coleman specs, including the running amps...I had tried this last summer but got higher numbers, so this time I used two different meters and both meters validated what the other read...

Still looking for an elusive answer, about a week ago I decided to take the ‘sage advice’ of Pianotuna and pulled the trigger on Hughes 30a Autoformer (delivered to my door), and placed it between the genny and the camper...

BRAVO!! After several test trials, what actually happens now is that with the Honda running uber quietly at near idle in eco mode, when the AC compressor ‘kicks on’ (with the inverter in standby), the inverter kicks in momentarily (3-4 sec) to allow the paired autoformer-genny ‘duo’ a moment to recognize and overcome (slightly rev) this SUDDEN, higher amperage load, whereby the genny (while still in eco mode...) happily assumes the entire air conditioner load, with only the slightest increase in RPMs!!...Granted, ambient temps today were only at about 57degF, but it seems that FINALLY all is now well in the high Nevada desert! Many Thanks to Pianotuna!!

3 tons

Sent from my iPad

[3_tons]

I’ll be happy to update if we can ever get past all this high Nevada desert global cooling - lol...

3 tons

[3_tons]

pianotuna wrote:
Thanks for the numbers.

No problemo Sir...

[pianotuna]

Thanks for the numbers.

[3_tons]

MrWizard wrote:
hope your luck is just as good, when the weather gets hotter

Exactly, fingers crossed!

[MrWizard]

hope your luck is just as good, when the weather gets hotter

[3_tons]

Per Pianotuna’s request, here’s the readings he earlier asked for with the Air conditioner running:

All readings taken via Kill-a-Watt, ambient temp was at 63degF...

Honda, no load = 127v
With air cond load, but before Autoformer = 125v, 7.0 running amps, 803w
With air cond load, but after Autoformer = 127v, 6.9 running amps, 806w

Not a whole lot of apparent difference, but these were all running measurements versus locked rotor surge measurements...Surge intervals are too momentary to obtain a reliable measurement...

I think it’s ALL about the surge and voltage sag...JMO...

Tested three more times while in the Eco mode, and the genny recovered each time without a hitch...

Hope this helps,

3 tons

[MEXICOWANDERER]

This is a great tip. IMO

[3_tons]

pianotuna wrote:
Here is a summary of 3 tons results.

2200 inverter genny in eco-->RV with prosine off-->air conditioner won't start

2200 inverter genny in eco-->RV with prosine on-->air conditioner won't transfer from prosine unless the genny is switched to full speed.


2200 inverter genny in eco-->autoformer-->RV with prosine on--air conditioner moves smoothing to genny, after starting on prosine.
--

Though the ‘advertised use’ of the autoformer is at the CG pedestal, about 90% of our camping is dry and off grid, and to be able to run the air cond with the Honda 2200 (a surrogate pedestal) while loafing along in the Eco mode shows that the autoformer is a very worthy addition, and that now ‘the system’ has finally been optimized...

This exercise also motivated me to preform a windings Ohm and ground check of the AC compressor motor, which now at 10 yrs old, and lots of inverter only operation, it’s good to know ‘first hand’ that it’s still within spec’s, and not the true cause (a false-flag - lol) of all my angst !!

I’ve also concluded that ‘IF’ (or when...) my pass-thru ProSine 2.0 inverter/charger decides to ‘bite the dust’ my next choice will be a true Load Sharing (synchronized) hybrid type...To this end, the Victron Multiplus has drawn my attention...

3 tons

[pianotuna]

Here is a summary of 3 tons results.

2200 inverter genny in eco-->RV with prosine off-->air conditioner won't start

2200 inverter genny in eco-->RV with prosine on-->air conditioner won't transfer from prosine unless the genny is switched to full speed.


2200 inverter genny in eco-->autoformer-->RV with prosine on--air conditioner moves smoothing to genny, after starting on prosine.
--

[Retired_JSO]

I’ll believe what I have with my autoformer.
The legendary, original, and patented RV voltage booster, now with the world’s most advanced surge protection.

The all new Hughes Autoformer 30 amp power boosting autoformer (RV2130SP) has the same performance and reliability of the RV2130 but now has advanced surge protection built in! The unit offers 2,400 Joules of surge protection. As an added feature, the surge / spike protection module is also replaceable. In the event of a massive spike, the surge unit will take the hit ensuring your booster and more importantly, your RV is not damaged.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

• The problem with terminology is there are no fixed regulations definitions for "spike" "surge" "sag"
• And for spike >10 ms there is a definite response curves for MOV components versus TVS transient voltage suppressors
• I parallel several 20mm MOV devices and parallel several TVS devices for AC then add a couple of avalanche rectifiers when dealing with direct current
• They are impractical cost wise, but full isolation transformers are superb for filtering transients up to perhaps 100ms
• To correct voltage a costly and heavy ferroresonant correction device is used. But by itself a "line tamer" does not possess transformer isolation
• No free lunches my Sola 3Kw ferroresonant unit eats a crippling amount of idle current
• Perhaps a UPS type circuit would be advantageous? With a PSW output?

[pianotuna]

Low voltage is far more of an issue than all forms of surge. I can't wait to try my autoformer with the generator to see if I can get rid of the red fault light on the hybrid Magnum when operating in load support mode.

[Lynnmor]

MrWizard wrote:
An autoformer
Does NOT offer surge (sudden high voltage) protection
It DOES give some "voltage lag" protection
Where voltage drops under heavy startup loads
This is what the op is seeing, the autoformer boost/surges the voltage,
So there is less voltage drop/lag

That is NOT surge protection
That is low voltage protection

Perhaps many didn't get the memo. Autoformer with surge protection.

[MrWizard]

MOV's (metal oxide varistor) protect against 'transient spikes'

that is a very split second high voltage spike,
consider it like an airbag in your car against sudden impact of an accident

a surge while not usually as high a voltage as a spike
is more like a title wave and it can last minutes even hours, and will burn out motors , transformers, any thing with a voltage operated coil

although low voltage brownouts happen more often sustained higher than normal voltage surges

you want to suppress a surge (lower the voltage) or disconnect aka go offline
you want to Boost low voltage if possible

i think saying the hughs has surge protection is a stretch of marketing speak
the expendable replaceable MOV's are Transient spike protection