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100 watt Solar decision

Brettmm92
Explorer
Explorer
I'm planning on Boondocking for a few months, plan to run my phone, some lights and hopefully my refrigerator on a 100 watt solar panel charging the Travel Trailer Battery for a short time job.

After looking around I really like the harbor freight setup how it comes with lights and the charge controller has usb ports directly on it which makes me think that for my use, I wouldn't even need a power inverter. But I am pressed for time and don't have access to a harbor freight. I am going to rely on amazon shipping.

https://www.harborfreight.com/100-watt-solar-panel-kit-63585.html

But I see this on amazon and think it would be better cause of timely shipping but also I feel it would be more expandable in the future if I get serious about upgrading.


Amazon link renogy 100 watt Solar panel startup kit


I wish it was more like the Harbor freight where it came with lights and had usb ports on the charge controller as that's really all I need.

I was wondering if anyone had any insight on advice or maybe knows of a power inverter that would work for my situation.

I was also wondering if anyone knows if the harbor freight charge controller usb ports run directly from the panels or do they draw power from the battery or a mix of both. Specifically wondering when I could use lights from that. I could make a drive to a Harbor Freight but it really wouldn't be a cost effective or fun trip and it would suck if they didn't even have what I was looking for.

But I always appreciate y'alls input
89 REPLIES 89

opnspaces
Navigator II
Navigator II
I realize I'm coming in late to this string but wanted to add my thoughts.

First thought and only because it's your last post. Can you go to the local dump and grab a battery out of the recycle bin to save on the core charge?

Yes definitely add a fuse or circuit breaker to every wire that comes off the positive side of the battery. The fuse is to protect the wiring and trailer from burning up.

I know you want to add the inverter to power things. Inverters are cheap and work well. But you should also consider adding a USB outlet near your bed for charging the phone overnight. It sounds like you are familiar with crimp connectors so I would go this route. You will need an interior cabinet or maybe the base of the bed to mount to and drill one maybe two holes to do this.

This plug uses crimp connectors. You can wire positive and negative straight to the batteries. You can also do as I did and wire to an existing 12v wire like the overhead lights. the plug I linked is about $5 more than other plugs. But that is because it was the only one I could find that was non illuminated as in no LED constantly drawing power.
Plug on Amazon

You will probably also need a 1" hole saw.
Hole saw on Amazon

Run some 16 gauge wire and if going to the battery put in a 10A fuse.
10 pack fuse holders

All in all under $30 to be able to plug your phone in next to your bed at night with no inverter.
.
2001 Suburban 4x4. 6.0L, 4.10 3/4 ton **** 2005 Jayco Jay Flight 27BH **** 1986 Coleman Columbia Popup

Brettmm92
Explorer
Explorer
I'm afraid I don't. I actually haven't had one for like 2 years. And I just put it in the battery bin at the local dump. I now know that there will be a core charge. Just when I accepted planning to pay 160$ for each of the interstate GC battery I chose, I learned that I had to suck it up and pay 25$ more a piece... Oh well.
And that's good to know about the core exchange. I live at a park where it's more likely than average to find someone willing to give away an old battery.
But I can't complain about the money, because I do have it available, I just would rather not spend so much. And being able to have lights and possibly other things like fridge everywhere I go, even at truck stops on the way is a very exciting prospect worth money

Gdetrailer
Explorer III
Explorer III
Brettmm92 wrote:
And I actually don't have an RV battery because I junked it (recycled) after realizing it was dead.


You do not have the RV battery at all?

Hope you got something back when you "recycled" it.

You do realize that when you buy new batteries you WILL be charged a "core charge" if you do not have a battery to exchange?

ANY lead acid battery can be used for a core exchange from motorcycle to the largest lead acid battery that you cannot pick up.

Right now, my states mandated core charge is $18 per lead acid battery which if you are buying 2 GC2 batteries is gonna cost you $30-$40 on top of your purchase if you do not have any cores depending on your states core charge..

Brettmm92
Explorer
Explorer
Whats the math on the fuse? I can actually change my order. I was going on 30A fuse based from the charge controller being 30 amps.

I got a really cheap cobra 400 watt modified sine inverter and want to use it safely.

Maybe I will keep the solar, but I'm thinking about enjoying the solar setup until late in the year. Without it the solar and my current plans I just wouldn't have electricity but me needing to be accessed by phone provoked the whole solar thing. And I actually don't have an RV battery because I junked it (recycled) after realizing it was dead.

pianotuna
Nomad III
Nomad III
A 30 amp fuse @ 12 volts = 360 watts

Such a fuse for an inverter may be fairly useless.

You could, in theory, wire several in parallel, but I DO NOT recommend it and it is NOT best practise. (written when I thought it was a 2000 watt inverter).

It is much better to have one fuse that covers the size of wire you are using for the inverter. Carry one or two spares.

If you are selling the RV why are you getting new batteries at all? Use up what you have already. Set up the solar on the ground--and keep it for the next RV.
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

Brettmm92
Explorer
Explorer
Gdetrailer, you have a good point about sams club. Unofrtunately it just wouldn't work in my situation as getting to one isn't an option. But I did find a great groupon for sams club that makes it only 35 dollars a year and comes with 30$ worth of "egift cards!"

groupon sams club memebership

But if napa or the interstate dealer wasnt so close, my other options would be to go with 12 volt batteries or just do without. And I did get one of the higher end deep cell "they call it extreme cycle" batteries and the 400$ includes the core charge which seems to be hidden or not shown in advertising.

And I do the "workamping" thing so I'm kind of all in on using my trailer. The other option would to be without electricity, but now that I am really getting a feel for everything I'm pretty excited to set this stuff up.

Pianotuna, I can definitely see situations where I wouldn't want to get on the roof especially since I dont have a ladder and have to get creative to get up there. And another thing is that I can see situations where the parking won't cooperate with the angle of the panels.

Maybe I would consider the SiO2 batteries. But I do know that I'm selling my camper eventually so i's just not worth it to me. But the golf cart batteries seem to be a good fit.

And after looking for a fuse or breaker solution, I decided to buy these things, 17$ for 12 inline car like fuses that just need to be "butt crimped" to existing wires. Seemed like a cheap and easy solution that will enable me to put them on whatever I want and have a stash of leftover fuses if they do blow. Seems to be a pretty good deal. Don't I just need to put them on the positive end of things? Wouldn't putting one on a ground and one on a positive of something (like an inverter) be a waste?

inline fuses

pianotuna
Nomad III
Nomad III
Brettmm92 wrote:
Are you saying that welders used to run off batteries?


Welders as we know them today did not exist. So folks who wished to weld would use batteries to do so.

Brettmm92 wrote:
there's a potential risk of batteries malfunctioning and expelling that much energy?


yes--but more of a chance that wires might wear through the insulation and "short out". That is why fuses and circuit breakers are used. What I am saying is there is a LOT of potential energy and it needs to be treated with care and respect.

Brettmm92 wrote:

Is there an easy fuse or breaker setup that won't take any cutting up a wire? Like one that goes from the end of the charge controller wire and bolts to the battery? I'm wanting to not splice or cut up wires if theres another way.


There may be such devices. My catastrophic failure fuse(s) are fastened to the battery and then wired to the house is connected. My system has two battery banks, so I can do either/or/both/none

Brettmm92 wrote:


And I was thinking having a setup of panels that lay flat on the roof but could be adjusted to around 45 degrees when no longer traveling to get better direct hit of sunlight would be superior even though it adds an extra thing to set up.


Studies have been done. The average RV'er who installs tilting panels gives up on doing so after seven times. Imagine a high wind, and rain. Are you prepared to climb on the roof to prevent the panels from being ripped off?

It is far easier, and much less expensive to simply add an extra panel with a fixed flat install. (And no roof climbing needed).

Brettmm92 wrote:
And would the batteries I plan to buy between 300 and 400$ for two high quality GC 6 volts be worth all that money? They are still lead acid and need to have maintenance but I could get three 12 volt 27DC batteries from wally world for cheaper than that (slightly over 300 with core charge). But everything I read seems to point out GC batteries being superior.


I am not a fan of six volt batteries wired in series. However, if there is space for only two jars, it is often cheaper to use golf cart batteries than 12 volt deep cycle units. True deep cycle 12 volt are Expensive with a capital E.

The link you have is to Marine batteries. These are NOT deep cycle jars. It is quite possible to use them, if you are prepared to have many of them. In fact I did so--but I had 7 group 29 12 volt. There was one more for the engine. I chose them because I had a specific need for high amperage draws. They lasted nine years because I had solar and was willing to lay in the snow to service them.

My next batteries will be SiO2. If your pockets are deep enough go 2 of those which would give you 180 amp-hours of usable capacity compared to just 112.5 amp-hours from golf cart batteries.
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

Gdetrailer
Explorer III
Explorer III
Brettmm92 wrote:
Are you saying that welders used to run off batteries? And because batteries ran welders there's a potential risk of batteries malfunctioning and expelling that much energy? Is there an easy fuse or breaker setup that won't take any cutting up a wire? Like one that goes from the end of the charge controller wire and bolts to the battery? I'm wanting to not splice or cut up wires if theres another way.

And I was thinking having a setup of panels that lay flat on the roof but could be adjusted to around 45 degrees when no longer traveling to get better direct hit of sunlight would be superior even though it adds an extra thing to set up.

And would the batteries I plan to buy between 300 and 400$ for two high quality GC 6 volts be worth all that money? They are still lead acid and need to have maintenance but I could get three 12 volt 27DC batteries from wally world for cheaper than that (slightly over 300 with core charge). But everything I read seems to point out GC batteries being superior.

Walmart Battery


It IS possible to arc weld using nothing but "car" batteries, however, not a safe or recommended thing to do. Basically takes about 24V-36V open circuit voltage to get enough current to make a half decent field repair welding bead. Would I bet my life on it? No. But in a pinch it could be done..



Welding from battery comes with some inherent risks which could cause your battery to explode.. After all stick welding is nothing more than SHORTING the battery posts together if you think about it.

As far as the battery you linked, that is a "combo" RV/Marine battery, while it could be made to work, ONE pair of 6V GC batteries will supply the SAME capacity as three of those group 27 batteries.

You also DO NOT NEED to pay a premium price for supposed "HIGH QUALITY" GC2 batteries. That is plain foolish to spend anywhere near $400 for ONE PAIR of GC2 batteries. You get only 10Ahr-15Ahr more in the $400 set vs a $200 set. That is very little "gain" for a whole lot more money. That will net you maybe an additional 1 or 2 hrs of use.

The more expensive batteries you are typically prepaying for the additional warranty period and nothing more.

The other thing is since this is your first time camping and camping without commercial power, $400 is a lot of money on the line to waste if you kill the batteries on the first time out.. You may want to go with the lower cost GC2 batteries and see how well that works for you.

For $400 I would rather buy two sets of lower priced GC2 batteries and get a lot more capacity than one set of "high PRICED" GC2s.

In other words, the $90 Sams batteries I linked give about 215Ar, two pairs of those gives 430Ahr.

The $400 pair of "high quality" GC2s gives you 235Ahr..

Which setup do you think will last longer?

My bet is on the two sets of lower cost GC2s since you get more capacity which means you will draw down the batteries much less..

A lot of folks here push the expensive brands by saying they are better and will last longer. That is not always the case especially if you constantly over discharge and undercharge them.

I have been able to get 10yrs out of a set of low priced GC2 batteries, they could have gone another several yrs but I depend on them to power my home fridge conversion.

Well taken care of batteries typically can offer 9-12 yrs of service provided you do not deeply discharge and you immediately recharge them as soon as possible. Never leave them fully or partially discharged state.

On edit..

Have you considered trying a "test" camping experience in your backyard without power for the weekend or the time you expect to camp?

That would be best in order to see just how long you can camp without power before committing a large sum of money.. Your trailer should have come with a battery of some sort, it is required in order to have a working emergency breakaway brake system.. Or you could pull a battery out of your car for the weekend (provided it isn't your only form of transportation).

Brettmm92
Explorer
Explorer
Are you saying that welders used to run off batteries? And because batteries ran welders there's a potential risk of batteries malfunctioning and expelling that much energy? Is there an easy fuse or breaker setup that won't take any cutting up a wire? Like one that goes from the end of the charge controller wire and bolts to the battery? I'm wanting to not splice or cut up wires if theres another way.

And I was thinking having a setup of panels that lay flat on the roof but could be adjusted to around 45 degrees when no longer traveling to get better direct hit of sunlight would be superior even though it adds an extra thing to set up.

And would the batteries I plan to buy between 300 and 400$ for two high quality GC 6 volts be worth all that money? They are still lead acid and need to have maintenance but I could get three 12 volt 27DC batteries from wally world for cheaper than that (slightly over 300 with core charge). But everything I read seems to point out GC batteries being superior.

Walmart Battery

pianotuna
Nomad III
Nomad III
Brettmm92,

The fuse should be as near the battery bank as humanly possible. It is a catastrophic failure fuse.

Before welders were "plug in" devices, batteries were used for that purpose. You can imagine what dumping 2600 watt-hours of battery in two seconds would do to an RV.

It would be insanely hot, so the fuse is there to protect the wire from melting and catching everything around it on fire. Anyone who goes without a fuse invalidates their insurance, and is taking a HUGE risk.

I find it much better to be a live chicken, than a dead duck.

I am NOT a fan of panels that have to be set up and struck down every time the RV is moved. It is far better to simply add an additional panel to the roof. Then you even get charging while trundling down the road. Remember the panels are the cheapest part of all this tech.
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.

Brettmm92
Explorer
Explorer
Using a hinge a pvc for adjusting the solar mount is a really good idea. I've been thinking about what I would do for adjusting the panels at an angle at will. I might have to copy that, it's better than what I was thinking. A pvc pipe inside another PVC pipe, both with holes could easily make it adjustable

Would the fuse go between the battery and the charge controller? I'm thinking the fuse saves the batteries (the most expensive part) from accidental overcharge or something like that. Is that right?

And Jebby, your setups success makes me more optimistic about what mine will do. I wonder why an administrator/moderator edited your post

Jebby14
Explorer
Explorer
i have a single 100W and a group 24 battery. As long as its sunny (my panel is portable with 25' of cable so i can put it in the sun, i get a full charge. running the fridge, alarms water pump and minimal lights i can stay like that until i get a bad charging day. I would think a proper battery setup would serve me better than more solar though i wouldnt say no to either.
Q: Whats brown and sticky???

A: A Stick....

Boon_Docker
Explorer III
Explorer III
Brettmm92 wrote:
I didn't even think about putting in a switch But I think I see why one would be needed as instructional videos always seem to stress plugging in batteries first to charge controller or risk something "frying".

Is there a more affordable switch that you recommend other than the 100$ mc4 switches I found on amazon?


I use an inline circuit breaker with my system. It works just fine.

Skidus1
Explorer
Explorer
I bought a 200 watt panel kit made for the roof but added hinges to them so they fold up with a pl30 charge controller from Windy Nation and made a stand from pvc for the panels and got 2 6vโ€™s from Costco. Under 500 I think in total cost and have been using it since 2015.

pianotuna
Nomad III
Nomad III
Brettmm92,

Since both the voltage and amperage is low, pretty much any switch will work well.

I would certainly NOT bother with mc4 switches. For larger installations an "arc fault" design is a requirement.
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.