40 mph uphill? Other Armada or Titan TVs?

[PaulandAnn]

I’ve been trolling this site for a year. There’s so much info I that haven’t needed to ask a question until now!


Tv: 2006 Armada LE 5.6L DOHC V8 with factory tow package. Tow rating 9000lbs. 305/385 hp/tq
105K miles, added external trans cooler, bypassing in-radiator cooler. Andersen WD hitch which I’m very happy with.

The Armada handles the trailer nicely, it’s the lack of power on the hills that makes the drive so stressful. I chill out once we're through all the hills.

Trailer: 21 ft Jayco. Factory weight with propane: 4385lbs estimate another 350lbs water, a couple hundred lbs food and whatnot. Lets say 5000lbs. (I've weighed the loaded tongue, but not the entire trailer)

(TV cargo: only 2 people and dog)

Driving up out of Phoenix to higher cooler elevations there are several hills/ridges on our way to 7000ft elevation. On every one, I eventually slow to 40mph. Is this normal? Neither trans or engine overheat. I have learned to ignore the “Tow Mode” and just downshift manually to get higher (3000-4000) rpms, for more power and lighter load on torque converter (keeping the trans temp down).

But meanwhile, monster 5th wheel “houses” fly by at 65mph on the same hill towed by their Cummins powered or whatever pickup trucks.

I don’t want a pickup truck. I don’t need one. In our SUV at all times, we have 2 child seats and a large dog crate.

I see the 2018 Ford Explorer with 6 cyl turbo Ecoboost has nearly 100lbs more torque and a 10 speed auto trans. Sounds nice, maybe what I need, but still too pricey.

Are other Nissan owners faring any better than me?

[jerem0621]

Nice! Glad we could help come up with a solution that may work for you.

Please report back how you feel about those hills after your next trip.

Thanks!

Jeremiah

[PaulandAnn]

Since another 6 pages of responses came in after my last post, I thought I'd update.

jerem0621 wrote:
Change the exhaust on the Armada and make it sound better.... :B

Haha! Well Jeremy got me thinking... I had already decided, based on all the feedback, that I need not shy away from the higher RPMs.

The Armada now has a JBA catback $454 and a K&N CAI $ 320 replaces the factory air filter box. (Nothing like an impact wrench to get those old rusty exhaust bolts off!)

Anyway, at least it will sound better revved up. And driving around town I can definitely feel better throttle response and torque.

We'll be heading up to Payson at 5000ft in a few weeks before the Forest service campgrounds close for the season. I'm looking forward to the hills 🙂

Oh and I ordered a Stillen all aluminum (no plastic) 3 core radiator so that I can put the tranny cooling loop back through the engine radiator.

[All_I_could_aff]

Sometimes I’m envious of the guys going 40 MPH...as I putter along in my 180 horsepower Nissan.

[gmw_photos]

To try to bring this back a little more relevant to the OP, if the Armada meets let's say 80% of your driving needs, then stick with it. If you look at the total number of miles you are climbing a steep hill with trailer in tow, it's likely very few in the overall use of the truck.

Even if it does wear some parts out a little more quickly than otherwise, just fix it when needed.
Just the sales tax alone on a new truck to replace it would likely be more than the cost of an accelerated repair on a potential failed component.

Put yer foot in it....let 'er downshift and rev. It's all good.

[marcsbigfoot20b]

My 7.3 no psssng required.

[badsix]

Jay Coe wrote:
I'll never buy a diesel cuz I'd never own something you need a tank of piss in to meet emissions.

THATS FUNNY RIGHT THERE. :B
Jay D.

[Jay_Coe]

I'll never buy a diesel cuz I'd never own something you need a tank of piss in to meet emissions.

[marcsbigfoot20b]

Gdetrailer wrote:

marcsbigfoot20b27 wrote:

I was just talking an extra 100 hp/tq to make it easier to drive and not break anything, not a top fuel dragster engine.

That is nearly 1/3 MORE HP and torque than what the OPs vehicle was designed for.

OPs vehicle as they posted is "Tv: 2006 Armada LE 5.6L DOHC V8 with factory tow package. Tow rating 9000lbs. 305/385 hp/tq"

Adding 100 HP to that IS the same as building a "top fuel dragster" as you say.

I would seriously doubt that the OPs engine and drive train will be able to support this kind of increase without coming apart. Manufacturers tend to NOT "overbuild" by much margin, they build to handle the HP and torque that the weakest link can handle and give the longest longevity.

One would have to really beef up many of the potential weak components starting with the engine, moving to the transmission and back to the drive line.

As I mentioned, I have dealt with this mentality with my Dad for many years, he took a 1980 Ford 400 Cid engine rated at a sickly factory 120 HP (yeah, the 1980s was not kind to engines for power) and when he was done it was belting out 420 HP at the wheels dyno'd.

It however came at the cost of LONGEVITY, he built and rebuilt the engine over and over, built and rebuilt the transmission over and over.. Resulted in getting towed multiple times, tearing down and rebuilding in campgrounds, roadside pull offs, store parking lots and the worst time was on his way home from VT where he was only 1 hr in the trip home and burnt through two pistons, bent pushrods and burned a handful of valves, cracked one head.. He paid a hauler $1000 (AAA wouldn't tow the trailer) to have the 5th wheel towed back to my brothers in VT, spent 5 weeks in VT digging up parts..

It was the LAST trip that he hauled that trailer, my Mom was a total nervous wreck after that one and put her foot down that he was NEVER towing again. He didn't, that trailer sat in his back yard for nearly 10 yrs before giving it to another brother of mine..

OP just needs to suck it up and live with what they got OR trade the thing in and get something that DOES have what it takes to do the job easier.

It is what I did with a 97 truck that had a wimpy 235 HP 5.4, with 4,000 lb 20 ft trailer I was down to 40 MPH on 7%-8% grades.. after two trips we traded it for a 2003 with 265 HP 5.4 and the difference was night and day. The 2003 handled those grades much easier often topping at 55 MPH with a little go pedal left. Over the years we moved up to a bit bigger trailer and moved up to 2006 300 HP 3V 5.4, then to a 2013 6.2 with 385 HP.. Each time we moved up to a newer vehicle the tow was even more remarkably easier.

Newer vehicles have vastly improved engines with much more HP and torque than a 2006 vehicle, with that, that OEMs have made their drive trains to handle that increase.

Throwing money at it to build it up is the same thing as throwing the money down the toilet.. NO ONE will be willing to pay for those mods so zero resale value is added.. In fact, it most likely will severely DROP any resale value.. I personally walk away from ANYTHING that has been highly modified, just to much can go wrong and you do not know if ALL the items as a whole can take the extra stress.

Sorry man, I didn’t realize (how could I ? ) that this is such a sore personal subject for you. I guess I’ll switch to “buy a diesel” instead.

[Gdetrailer]

marcsbigfoot20b27 wrote:

I was just talking an extra 100 hp/tq to make it easier to drive and not break anything, not a top fuel dragster engine.

That is nearly 1/3 MORE HP and torque than what the OPs vehicle was designed for.

OPs vehicle as they posted is "Tv: 2006 Armada LE 5.6L DOHC V8 with factory tow package. Tow rating 9000lbs. 305/385 hp/tq"

Adding 100 HP to that IS the same as building a "top fuel dragster" as you say.

I would seriously doubt that the OPs engine and drive train will be able to support this kind of increase without coming apart. Manufacturers tend to NOT "overbuild" by much margin, they build to handle the HP and torque that the weakest link can handle and give the longest longevity.

One would have to really beef up many of the potential weak components starting with the engine, moving to the transmission and back to the drive line.

As I mentioned, I have dealt with this mentality with my Dad for many years, he took a 1980 Ford 400 Cid engine rated at a sickly factory 120 HP (yeah, the 1980s was not kind to engines for power) and when he was done it was belting out 420 HP at the wheels dyno'd.

It however came at the cost of LONGEVITY, he built and rebuilt the engine over and over, built and rebuilt the transmission over and over.. Resulted in getting towed multiple times, tearing down and rebuilding in campgrounds, roadside pull offs, store parking lots and the worst time was on his way home from VT where he was only 1 hr in the trip home and burnt through two pistons, bent pushrods and burned a handful of valves, cracked one head.. He paid a hauler $1000 (AAA wouldn't tow the trailer) to have the 5th wheel towed back to my brothers in VT, spent 5 weeks in VT digging up parts..

It was the LAST trip that he hauled that trailer, my Mom was a total nervous wreck after that one and put her foot down that he was NEVER towing again. He didn't, that trailer sat in his back yard for nearly 10 yrs before giving it to another brother of mine..

OP just needs to suck it up and live with what they got OR trade the thing in and get something that DOES have what it takes to do the job easier.

It is what I did with a 97 truck that had a wimpy 235 HP 5.4, with 4,000 lb 20 ft trailer I was down to 40 MPH on 7%-8% grades.. after two trips we traded it for a 2003 with 265 HP 5.4 and the difference was night and day. The 2003 handled those grades much easier often topping at 55 MPH with a little go pedal left. Over the years we moved up to a bit bigger trailer and moved up to 2006 300 HP 3V 5.4, then to a 2013 6.2 with 385 HP.. Each time we moved up to a newer vehicle the tow was even more remarkably easier.

Newer vehicles have vastly improved engines with much more HP and torque than a 2006 vehicle, with that, that OEMs have made their drive trains to handle that increase.

Throwing money at it to build it up is the same thing as throwing the money down the toilet.. NO ONE will be willing to pay for those mods so zero resale value is added.. In fact, it most likely will severely DROP any resale value.. I personally walk away from ANYTHING that has been highly modified, just to much can go wrong and you do not know if ALL the items as a whole can take the extra stress.

[richclover]

gmw photos wrote:

“...Truth is, the Armada was really intended as a luxo people hauler. Towing was a secondary consideration...”

Bingo!

[marcsbigfoot20b]

Gdetrailer wrote:

marcsbigfoot20b27 wrote:

...If I had the OP's truck I would slap a supercharger on it for 6K and be done.

That is the equivalent to "putting lipstick on a pig".

Supercharging WILL add considerable STRESS to not only the engine but transmission, entire drive train and even the vehicle it's self.

The extra power boost may even make the vehicle difficult to absolutely dangerous to drive IN ALL driving conditions (dry, wet, snow, Ice, and towing)..

"Too much" is not "always" a good thing.

There is no "free lunch" here.

I have dealt with this with my Dad, he kept adding and adding more mods to one of his trucks.. He did so until the point that EVERY trip he took pulling his 11K lbs 5th wheel he was catastrophically breaking his engine, transmission..

He was burning up plugs, burning holes in pistons, bending pushrods, damaging cams, breaking heads, burning valves..

All of that just so he could say he "beat" all other folks towing up steep grades.

Lost track of all the times he got stranded hundreds and even a thousand miles from home..

His truck was nearly undriveable when empty, even a light feather hitting the go pedal could spin the tires and break traction.

Then there was the money he spent on ONE truck that was totally stupid.. He could have easily bought FOUR brand new fully loaded trucks from 1980-2000 (20 yrs).. Yeah, somewhere north of $100,000 burned up in parts, repairs..

If I was in the OPs shoes (and I was at one time), SIT BACK, RELAX and allow the engine do what it is designed to do.

Yes, that may mean you will not "win" any races to the top of the hill but at least you WILL get there without blowing something up in the process.

I was just talking an extra 100 hp/tq to make it easier to drive and not break anything, not a top fuel dragster engine.

[Huntindog]

gmw photos wrote:


EDIT, ps, sorry 'dog, I usually agree with you, but I have to disagree with your comment that dropping a gear is a crutch. That is just not true. The reason we have a multiple speed transmission is so that we can "drop a gear" when needed to make more torque avail to pull a load. Try to tell a truck driver with an 18 speed transmission that dropping a gear is a crutch. He is going to look at you like you are nuts.

No worries. Of course I was refering standard automotive trannys with 5-6 gears. The big rigs with 18 speeds are a totally different animal, though I suspect that they are geared lower than what the OP has.... I was not aware of just how tall that the Armads is geared... Those are not towing gears... And since it appears that there is not a drop in solution, it is not a serious TV either. The OP wanted to know what he could do about it.
The answer appears to be not much other than get a vehicle more suited to what he wants it to do.

You go around once in life. If you don't like something..... Do something about it. That has always been my motto. From better TT tires to modifying my TTs cold weather capabilities... etc. I just don't like to take it cannot be done for an answer.

To the OP.... You have seen the options there are by now. Do what makes you happy.

[Gdetrailer]

marcsbigfoot20b27 wrote:

...If I had the OP's truck I would slap a supercharger on it for 6K and be done.

That is the equivalent to "putting lipstick on a pig".

Supercharging WILL add considerable STRESS to not only the engine but transmission, entire drive train and even the vehicle it's self.

The extra power boost may even make the vehicle difficult to absolutely dangerous to drive IN ALL driving conditions (dry, wet, snow, Ice, and towing)..

"Too much" is not "always" a good thing.

There is no "free lunch" here.

I have dealt with this with my Dad, he kept adding and adding more mods to one of his trucks.. He did so until the point that EVERY trip he took pulling his 11K lbs 5th wheel he was catastrophically breaking his engine, transmission..

He was burning up plugs, burning holes in pistons, bending pushrods, damaging cams, breaking heads, burning valves..

All of that just so he could say he "beat" all other folks towing up steep grades.

Lost track of all the times he got stranded hundreds and even a thousand miles from home..

His truck was nearly undriveable when empty, even a light feather hitting the go pedal could spin the tires and break traction.

Then there was the money he spent on ONE truck that was totally stupid.. He could have easily bought FOUR brand new fully loaded trucks from 1980-2000 (20 yrs).. Yeah, somewhere north of $100,000 burned up in parts, repairs..

If I was in the OPs shoes (and I was at one time), SIT BACK, RELAX and allow the engine do what it is designed to do.

Yes, that may mean you will not "win" any races to the top of the hill but at least you WILL get there without blowing something up in the process.

[marcsbigfoot20b]

Another good reason that car makers went from 3-4 speed autos to 6-8 or 10 speed transmissions. The more gears the better the selection to keep in the power band or for fuel mileage for a given circumstance.
Once you get over 8 speeds, the rear diff ratio probably has little to do with anything as long as the trans gears are spaced appropriately.

If I had the OP's truck I would slap a supercharger on it for 6K and be done.