75mph ST tire

[gmw_photos]

I offer this only as info for the always entertaining and ongoing argument....ooops, I mean "discussion" regarding tires. I was out this morning shopping for a new horse trailer, so of course I looked down at the Chinese ST tire, and saw "75mph" on the sidewall.
I know nothing at all about these tires other than they were round and black, so this is neither a recommendation nor an indictment of them.

"Castle Rock". These were 15" load range D.

[Community Alumni]

The standards for choosing an appropriate tire are located in the FMVSS. Well I should say minimum standards.

FMVSS 109

and

FMVSS 119

[gmw_photos]

This whole discussion makes me think also of how a manufacturer, either the tire company, or the vehicle ( or trailer ) might consider what tire is appropriate. For instance, many if not most 150 series "light trucks" come from the factory fitted with "P" tires. At first glance a person might think that doesn't sound right....P is for passenger, I bought a truck, so why does it have those tires ? But obviously, they are a correct fitment when used within their load limits.

[CapriRacer]

Perhaps I need to step in here to clarify some items:

First, read my write up on Tire Standardizing Organizations: Barry's Tire Tech - Tire Standardizing Organizations

Then understand that the US Federal government ACCEPTS those standards, but doesn't REQUIRE a tire comply with those standards. It does require the tire to comply with certain marking and testing regulations, but a tire manufacturer is not obligated to follow those standards - although why anyone wouldn't is beyond me.

The Kumho Radial 857 is a tire line designed to ETRTO standards and for use on utility vehicles commonly used in Europe, but rare in the US. The VW EuroVan and the Ford Transit are probably the only vehicles that the US folks would be familiar with. These vehicles are smaller than what is commonly used in the US for the same purpose.

The line carries the "C" designation (for Commercial), which is printed AFTER the tire size. This an ETRTO designation.

Because of that, the US arm of Kumho obviously sees this line of tires as having only usage on trailers - as the vehicles this line fits on basically don't exist in the US - and only lists 3 sizes, all 14".

Some LT tires CAN be used on trailers, but some are just not suitable - BUT - ST's are specifically designated by the US tire standardizing organization, The Tire and Rim Association, as trailer tires. That's what the letters ST mean - Special Trailer. This designation is a US only designation. It does not appear in ETRTO, nor JATMA yearbooks.

But be very careful interpreting what is published by the tire manufacturers. The wording becomes very important. For example, if a tire manufacturer is asked if an LT tire can be used in place of an ST tire, the answer will be "no" - because an LT tire of the same size will have a lower published load carrying capacity. No tire manufacturer will want to be in the position to defend that in a court of law.

However, if you ask if an LT tire is suitable for use on a trailer, the answer might be "Yes" - as the question asker hasn't defined the loading and there are situations where an LT can be used on a trailer. Just be aware that the tire manufacturer might not agree that their LT tires SHOULD be used on trailers - and say "No".

[Huntindog]

RinconVTR wrote:

Huntindog wrote:
No excuses needed. You need to read it again.

I will help you:
If we look on the kumho usa site, we see they call it a tire "for light trucks, vans and transporters"....but here in north america, they also call it a "trailer tire".

No sir. YOU look again. Light trucks, vans and transporters are listed under "special feature". That doesn't make anyone suspect eh? Come on now...get back to reality.

Do you believe the marketing hype or not? Which is it?

Cant have it BOTH ways silly wabbit...twicks are for kids.

You CAN have it both ways if the tire meets the govt. required testing for LT tires... You CANNOT have it both ways if the tire is only tested to the Govt. required testing testing for ST tires.

The LT designation is NOT marketing hype. An LT tire sold in the USA must pass the GOVT. required Testing for LT tires. Any such tire is then suitable for either type of service. The manufacturer does not dictate the LT or ST testing standards... So it is not hype. It is a designation that must be earned, not bestowed by a manufacturer.
Earn a higher designation, and more uses for the tire are possible.

This why you cannot find ANY auto manufacturer that specs. an ST tire on a truck, but it is easy to find manufacturers that spec LT tires for trailers.

Being an engineer, this concept should be easy for you to understand.

[westend]

RinconVTR wrote:

westend wrote:
The tire designation letters are mandated by the US DOT. It's as American as you can get.

Mandated? For imports? Oh, ok.

Let me get this right...you say our government DIRECTS the OEM's what to etch in their mold tools, what you see on your tires?

As an OEM engineer for a large manufacture of product customers demand (many!) third party certifications...I highly disagree. Sir.

I'm saying a tire mfg. can't just pick out the designation on the sidewall because the DOT requires the tires to be tested and marked correctly. This is in order to be sold and used in the USA. AFAIK, most tires are imported from country of mfg.

If you are an engineer, this should all be understandable.

[gmw_photos]

RinconVTR wrote:


No sir. YOU look again. Light trucks, vans and transporters are listed under "special feature". That doesn't make anyone suspect eh? Come on now...get back to reality.

Do you believe the marketing hype or not? Which is it?

Cant have it BOTH ways silly wabbit...twicks are for kids.

Ok, so let me get this right Rincon....you say that "it ain't so" because it's listed under "special features".

I just went to the Kumho USA site, and looked at the descriptions of five different random tires in their lineup. In every single one of those descriptions, they list "special features" for that tire.
Perhaps you should take this discussion up with the marketing folks that take care of this for Kumho. Because by your standards, they sure are saying a lot of stuff that just ain't so.

[RinconVTR]

westend wrote:
The tire designation letters are mandated by the US DOT. It's as American as you can get.

Mandated? For imports? Oh, ok.

Let me get this right...you say our government DIRECTS the OEM's what to etch in their mold tools, what you see on your tires?

As an OEM engineer for a large manufacture of product customers demand (many!) third party certifications...I highly disagree. Sir.

[westend]

The tire designation letters are mandated by the US DOT. It's as American as you can get.

[RinconVTR]

Huntindog wrote:
No excuses needed. You need to read it again.

I will help you:
If we look on the kumho usa site, we see they call it a tire "for light trucks, vans and transporters"....but here in north america, they also call it a "trailer tire".

No sir. YOU look again. Light trucks, vans and transporters are listed under "special feature". That doesn't make anyone suspect eh? Come on now...get back to reality.

Do you believe the marketing hype or not? Which is it?

Cant have it BOTH ways silly wabbit...twicks are for kids.

[gmw_photos]

The Kumho 857's mounted on my trailer have the following molded into the rubber of the side wall: LT Radial

EDIT: Many consumers understand there are a myriad of products that are sold on various global markets. Build the item to meet the applicable standards and needs of different markets, and make more money. What a concept.

[Huntindog]

RinconVTR wrote:

gmw photos wrote:
For those that find it interesting reading about tires and how they are marketed in differing global markets, the Kumho 857 is illustrative of how a given product may be promoted/sold in different regions.

If we look on the kumho usa site, we see they call it a tire "for light trucks, vans and transporters"....but here in north america, they also call it a "trailer tire". Sizes are limited here to just three sizes in 14" rim dia.

If we look though at kumho australia, we see it is simply marketed as a "light truck/commercial usage". There it is available in rim diameters of 12 through 16", in various widths.

Same with some other markets such as the United Kingdom, and various pacific rim countries. More info is on their worldwide site as well.

It could be if a person did some digging on other manufacturers websites, you might find similar info on specific tires within their product lines.

This is the USA last I checked.

Why-o-why would this little tire be an "LT" but not suitable for actual truck use in the USA. Lets here the excuses.

No excuses needed. You need to read it again.

I will help you:
If we look on the kumho usa site, we see they call it a tire "for light trucks, vans and transporters"....but here in north america, they also call it a "trailer tire".

[RinconVTR]

gmw photos wrote:
For those that find it interesting reading about tires and how they are marketed in differing global markets, the Kumho 857 is illustrative of how a given product may be promoted/sold in different regions.

If we look on the kumho usa site, we see they call it a tire "for light trucks, vans and transporters"....but here in north america, they also call it a "trailer tire". Sizes are limited here to just three sizes in 14" rim dia.

If we look though at kumho australia, we see it is simply marketed as a "light truck/commercial usage". There it is available in rim diameters of 12 through 16", in various widths.

Same with some other markets such as the United Kingdom, and various pacific rim countries. More info is on their worldwide site as well.

It could be if a person did some digging on other manufacturers websites, you might find similar info on specific tires within their product lines.

This is the USA last I checked.

Why-o-why would this little tire be an "LT" but not suitable for actual truck use in the USA. Lets here the excuses.

[gmw_photos]

Since this discussion ( as always ) has taken the turn towards LT in addition to ST, here's a couple more tires I found as potential 15".

Kumho Crugan HT51, LT235/75-15 1985 pounds at 50psi
Kumho Road Venture APT, LT235/75-15 1985 pounds at 50psi

....just a couple more to consider in the USA market.

[Huntindog]

RinconVTR wrote:




Those who think there is no difference between an LT for trucks and an LT for trailer are sadly mistaken. I continue to be misunderstood here because of this single fact.

Balderdash.
I run Michhelin LT tires on my truck AND my TT.
The same tires are sold as and used on both. Nothing different about them.

When they are mounted on my TT I guess they are an LT trailer tire... When mounted on my truck they are a truck tire..

Your misunderstanding is that ST tires are NOT to be used on a TV.. That would be illegal. It is molded right on the sidewall. STs are for trailer use only.

OTOH, LTs are suitable for either type of service.
It is not illegal, and there is no statement molded on the sidewall.

A TT manufacturer is free to spec either type of tire. Many of the higher end TT manufacturers do spec LT tires either standard or as an upgradeable option.

But you will NOT find any automobile manufacturer specing a ST tire on a truck.