Happy medium between comfort and good gas mileage to haul?

[MookieKat]

Hi everyone! I just joined tonight, because we need your experience and wisdom! What would be your recommendation for the most practical size of TT for a couple in their early 60s who wants to travel around the country visiting national parks? We want something that would be good on gas mileage.

We saw a Fun Finder 18' with slide (around 3,100 lbs) on Craiglslist and it looked good, but then we saw a 21' with slide (around 4,200 lbs.) today and loved the layout and the roominess. However, we do not want something that is hard to maneuver around twisting mountain roads, nor do we want to have to buy a vehicle that is a gas guzzler, so we are torn... What is the happy medium between comfort and maneuverability? What is the sweet spot in comfort and decent gas mileage?

We need a newer vehicle anyway, so we will be buying a used SUV that can tow a trailer and will be great to use as an everyday vehicle, since we do not plan (at this juncture), to go full-time....most likely, we will only be traveling 1-2 months out of the year.

We had considered the Toyota Highlander, which tows 5,000 lbs., but we are not married to that idea. Any advice on a vehicle purchase would be appreciated as well! Thanks in advance for your help!

[MookieKat]

MookieKat wrote:

MookieKat wrote:
GMW Photo, Wow! Gas guzzlers, indeed!! I guess there's no getting around it!! What about the Chevy Traverse or the Tahoe? Will either of those work?

My friend has a Ford Aerostar that they are using to haul an 18' (3,000 lb) Fun Finder.

Correction: Chevy Astro Van.

They say they get 19 mpg driving at 50-55 mph.

[MookieKat]

GeoBoy wrote:
You can also look at Taylor Coach in Canada. they make a nice lightweight stick and tin TT in a variety of floor plans. The Toyota Highlander has a 3500 lb. tow capacity and the Honda Pilot with tow package has a 4500 lb. tow capacity. I believe the Chevy Traverse has a 5500 lb. with tow package.
Good luck.

Highlander prior to 2009 were 3,500 lbs. In 2009, they upped it to tow 5,000 lbs.

[MookieKat]

MookieKat wrote:
GMW Photo, Wow! Gas guzzlers, indeed!! I guess there's no getting around it!! What about the Chevy Traverse or the Tahoe? Will either of those work?

My friend has a Ford Aerostar that they are using to haul an 18' (3,000 lb) Fun Finder.

Correction: Chevy Astro Van.

[GeoBoy]

You can also look at Taylor Coach in Ontario Canada. they make a nice lightweight stick and tin TT in a variety of floor plans. The Toyota Highlander has a 3500 lb. tow capacity and the Honda Pilot with tow package has a 4500 lb. tow capacity. I believe the Chevy Traverse has a 5500 lb. with tow package.
Good luck.

[gmw_photos]

MookieKat wrote:
GMW Photo, Wow! Gas guzzlers, indeed!! I guess there's no getting around it!! What about the Chevy Traverse or the Tahoe? Will either of those work?

My friend has a Ford Aerostar that they are using to haul an 18' (3,000 lb) Fun Finder.

Well, and that is part of why some of the early responders to this thread asked what your budget is for this whole project. It's a lot easier to make good recommendations when we know what you are allotting to be spent. Obviously, there is a relationship between the tow vehicle and the trailer that has to be considered. So for instance if a person said they are willing to spend a total of $50K, but they want a trailer with a lot of room, and it has to be new, then folks might say ok.....that is going to dictate buying a used, large tow vehicle. Etc.

[Francesca_Knowl]

MookieKat wrote:

A Toyota Highlander is considered a full-size SUV, I thought.....am I wrong in this? What are you calling a full-size SUV?

A question that once mystified me, too....Turns out that there are two kinds of "UV"'s: the "SUV" (Sport utility vehicle), which is usually based on a truck chassis, and the "CUV" (Crossover utility vehicle), which is a sort of ground-up hybrid between a truck and a car. SUV's tend to be beefier and will haul bigger loads than will CUV's.

The Toyota Highlander is a mid-size CUV...Toyota's full sized SUV's are the Sequoia and the Landcruiser.

Here's a link to a chart that shows type/class of most S/CUV's sold in North America.

[rexlion]

A Highlander is more of a mid-size.

Just a thought here... are you going to feel up to hooking and unhooking a trailer? Have you considered a motor home? There's a 10 year old, 24' Class C with 40K miles, Ford V10, for sale an hour from me for under $25,000. Seems like with that much depreciation out of a unit by that time, they can be pretty affordable. And no unhooking, other than your water hose and electric cord.

Why are some folks high on pickups? I think mostly because they have a longer wheelbase, which makes towing more stable and secure than a shorter wheelbase, full size SUV. But a midsize unibody SUV like the HL actually tows very well in terms of handling and maneuverability. They are low to the ground and not tippy, so you can swerve to avoid things more readily. But I would not want to tow more trailer than what I have now with my HL.

[MookieKat]

GMW Photo, Wow! Gas guzzlers, indeed!! I guess there's no getting around it!! What about the Chevy Traverse or the Tahoe? Will either of those work?

My friend has a Ford Aerostar that they are using to haul an 18' (3,000 lb) Fun Finder.

[MookieKat]

gmw photos wrote:
The best thing I did for me personally when shopping, was to go and just sit in a lot of different campers....for literally about five minutes, and tried to imagine myself in there for days at time, like maybe and extended rainy or cold period of time. There were a lot of designs that I said to myself, "I would not want to be in here for an extended stay".

I also looked at mine and knew right away that I was going to change a few things. For instance, I changed out from a 17" TV to a 32"HDTV, and swapped where it is in my trailer. So now I have a comfortable place to have a good, comfy folding chair ( I can sit for hours in it ) and a much bigger television to look at. This was important to me, but to the next person, it may mean little. It sounds like you are well on your way to understanding what features are important to you. Have fun shopping !

Yes! That is another thing that I was wondering about...if I could just rip out the included furniture and add my own comfortable furniture, like our favorite chairs from home! I have not found any of the included furniture to be comfortable! They are all too long in the seat, as I am a short person....and either too firm or too soft!!

[gmw_photos]

MookieKat wrote:

rfryer wrote:

MookieKat wrote:
Wow!!!! You you people are awesome!! Thank you so much for all the wonderful and quick responses to my query!!

Here's a new development: There is a chance that we may wind up living in it for 6 months or so....as a transition to see if we like the new area that we are considering moving to.

Well, you’re going to be faced with some conflicting desires you’re going to have to work out. If you’re going to live in it for extended periods of time you’ll appreciate more room, i.e., a bigger TT. If you want to visit the parks and do a lot of mountain driving the smaller and lighter the better. You’ll find more campgrounds you can get into and have more available sites. And small is an easier tow in the mountains.

Forget good gas mileage, air resistance of a TT is such that you’re probably in the 10 to 11MPG area. Weight is a small factor on the flats, but it becomes much bigger when you’re trying to drag it up the mountains. You’d have to go really small to do better, I pull a 16’ 3000# loaded TT with an F150 5.4 and spend a lot of time mountain driving. Overall, I get 14, but I get less on long climbs, in the 9 to 11 area. If I were pulling 5000 to 6000# I’m pretty sure I’d be much closer to the 10 to 11 mpg range overall. I also agree with Terryallan, go for the full size SUV.

My thought if I were in your position would be that most of my use is camping and the extended living would be an aberration. So I’d opt for a TT in the roughly 20’ range. But I’d prefer a ½ ton truck with a cap to an SUV, too. I doubt if there’s a sweet spot between comfort and gas mileage though there likely is between comfort and accessibility to off the beaten path camping. Good luck on your decision.

Yes...these are conflicting desires, indeed!! I was really feeling turmoil over this, but you have helped clarify the dilemma, so thank you! I guess we will have to lean toward the travel part and rough it out for the living segment, and if it become absolutely intolerable, just rent an apartment for 6 months.

A Toyota Highlander is considered a full-size SUV, I thought.....am I wrong in this? What are you calling a full-size SUV?

My bet is you are likely going to end up with a larger, heavier trailer than you think. A Toyota Highlander is probably going to be hard pressed to meet those sorts of tow needs. When folks talk of full size SUV's it's more like Armada, Sequoia, Suburban, Expedition.

[gmw_photos]

The best thing I did for me personally when shopping, was to go and just sit in a lot of different campers....for literally about five minutes, and tried to imagine myself in there for days at time, like maybe and extended rainy or cold period of time. There were a lot of designs that I said to myself, "I would not want to be in here for an extended stay".

I also looked at mine and knew right away that I was going to change a few things. For instance, I changed out from a 17" TV to a 32"HDTV, and swapped where it is in my trailer. So now I have a comfortable place to have a good, comfy folding chair ( I can sit for hours in it ) and a much bigger television to look at. This was important to me, but to the next person, it may mean little. It sounds like you are well on your way to understanding what features are important to you. Have fun shopping !

[MookieKat]

rfryer wrote:

MookieKat wrote:
Wow!!!! You you people are awesome!! Thank you so much for all the wonderful and quick responses to my query!!

Here's a new development: There is a chance that we may wind up living in it for 6 months or so....as a transition to see if we like the new area that we are considering moving to.

Well, you’re going to be faced with some conflicting desires you’re going to have to work out. If you’re going to live in it for extended periods of time you’ll appreciate more room, i.e., a bigger TT. If you want to visit the parks and do a lot of mountain driving the smaller and lighter the better. You’ll find more campgrounds you can get into and have more available sites. And small is an easier tow in the mountains.

Forget good gas mileage, air resistance of a TT is such that you’re probably in the 10 to 11MPG area. Weight is a small factor on the flats, but it becomes much bigger when you’re trying to drag it up the mountains. You’d have to go really small to do better, I pull a 16’ 3000# loaded TT with an F150 5.4 and spend a lot of time mountain driving. Overall, I get 14, but I get less on long climbs, in the 9 to 11 area. If I were pulling 5000 to 6000# I’m pretty sure I’d be much closer to the 10 to 11 mpg range overall. I also agree with Terryallan, go for the full size SUV.

My thought if I were in your position would be that most of my use is camping and the extended living would be an aberration. So I’d opt for a TT in the roughly 20’ range. But I’d prefer a ½ ton truck with a cap to an SUV, too. I doubt if there’s a sweet spot between comfort and gas mileage though there likely is between comfort and accessibility to off the beaten path camping. Good luck on your decision.

Yes...these are conflicting desires, indeed!! I was really feeling turmoil over this, but you have helped clarify the dilemma, so thank you! I guess we will have to lean toward the travel part and rough it out for the living segment, and if it become absolutely intolerable, just rent an apartment for 6 months.

A Toyota Highlander is considered a full-size SUV, I thought.....am I wrong in this? What are you calling a full-size SUV?

[rexlion]

It's all about wind resistance. The two ways to improve fuel economay with a TT are to choose a TT that catches less wind, and/or to drive more slowly.

Let's say you plan to drive 60 mph. From what I've experienced and read, most boxy trailers seem to typically result in 10-11 mpg. 8' wide TTs probably 10, and 7' wide about 11. Going to a very rounded trailer (molded fiberglass like Scamp, Casita, Escape or aluminum like Airstream) are likely to give a boost to about 14-16 mpg. Going to a popup (including non-tent popups like Aliner, Chalet, Hi-Lo, Trailmanor) could yield a bit more, perhaps 16-18 mpg, because they sit lower and catch less wind.

Going longer or heavier generally have less effect than going larger on frontal area.

Escape Trailers of Chilliwack BC are very high quality, with a 19' and soon a 21' model. Oliver Trailers in TN is starting back up with a 22' molded FG trailer, and they are also known for top quality with plenty of bells and whistles. Li'l Snoozy in SC makes a 17' trailer that looks like a clam shell and tows easily. Airstream has a name for beautiful, luxurious trailers, although some feel their quality is not what it used to be... and they have all those joints and rivets on the outer surface. If your goal is to optimize fuel economy but you don't want a folding trailer, these are some of the best options.

If you did spend 6 months in the unit, I doubt you'd want a popup; you'd lose the upper storage cabinets on almost any of them, and they would tend to be more drafty.

I tow all the time with my Highlander for both work and play. Usually about 11 mpg. Lately I have been wishing for either less frontal area or more engine, as it seemed to struggle more this summer through the mountains and the transmission was getting hotter than I like. In my experience the HL will handle a TT of 3000-3500 lbs or so, and 16' or 17', but you have to figure on about 60 mph tops and a fair bit slower (with upshifts) on the hills. I'm dreaming of a Grand Cherokee diesel or maybe an Explorer 3.5 ecoboost.

[MookieKat]

EarthboundTC wrote:
Take a good look at the newer Ford F150 with the EcoBoost engine and tow haul mode. I get 12.5 avg mpgs towing and around 21-22 without the trailer. The new tow haul mode is so incredible. The way it changes the dynamics of the truck really brings the two together as one.
I couldn't be happier with my truck choice.

Thank you! I am wondering why most are recommending a truck over an SUV? I thought that with an SUV, you could store more in the vehicle in terms of hang-up clothes, etc. We will also be traveling with a cat.

[MookieKat]

Yes, GMW photos. I am seeing that there are nuances that can only be discovered when you actually see, feel, and touch these TTs. Just from one visit, I was able to narrow down our likes and dislikes.

That is a good point, about the bathrooms accessibility! Had not thought of that one at all!! That is why it is so good to talk to all of you experienced folks on this forum!!