Manual transmission gasser

[buddyIam]

Any one remember when the last big cubic inch. Gas engine with a manual trans came out.
I bet they are rare if the owners are like me. Lol

The new autos just don't seem right for my mountain driving. Grades over 7% and many steep hairpin turns.

I would want as new as I could get.

I've got a old one I could throw a bucket of money at and be happy. 😉

[wintersun]

Most of my vehicles over the years have had a manual transmission, usually to have more gears than was possible with an automatic transmission. My current truck has the GM Grade Control and it has a 6-speed transmission. It works perfectly.

I have done descents of 10 miles on grades that went from 6% to 8% and kept the truck at 35 MPH without touching the brakes. Going into a section where I needed to go slower still all I have to do is tap the brake pedal and the transmission downshifts and maintains a slower speed. It ONLY works with the transmission in auto mode. Put it into manual selection and the grade control is disabled - which I would bet many owners do not realizing that they have disabled this function.

An automatic transmission can allow for some slipping and shock absorption that if done with a manual transmission would damage the synchro gears or the clutch or both. For offroad excursions I prefer a manual transmission and a clutch but for towing an automatic is the better choice.

A secondary consideration for people towing a camper is the power lost while shifting with a manual transmission. The newest tractor rigs are coming with a new type of transmission that allows for constant power during gear changes to avoid the loss of power and wasted fuel.

With my Chevy truck I have the Grade Control, an exhaust brake, and tow/haul mode and a trailer brake controller which can be used individually or together to provide a great deal more control when towing if used properly. These systems do still depend upon the person behind the steering wheel.

[blt2ski]

The 5.2L I4 IIRC is about a 200/400 motor. So ANY motor with those specs is going to be ok in town, on the freeway depending upon the what and where a bit sluggish. Mid to upper teens for fuel mileage is about right. These are city drivers, not geared for OTR work. Local work only. It would take some reworking of the drivetrain gears to make them true freeway drivers.

The I6 should work ok in the cab over or conventional cab class 6 and above trucks. Again, depending upon the HP/torque specs and gearing. Unlike the 4 banger where there is ONE power option, the I6 has aroudn a dozen HP/torque spec options depending upon the end users use of the truck OTR vs city use etc.

I've driven a number of the Class 4 cab overs since they first came out with a 3.9L 125/250 motor. The new ones are better on the power hopefully obviously, but if you want to keep up with one of the pickup diesels, never going to happen! That is not the design, nor has it ever been the design, nor would I imagine it to ever be the design of that truck.

Marty

[buddyIam]

I have always wondered about that Izuzu big 6.

Has anyone driven one of those Isuzu big 6's. I have known some with the 4500 cab overs. I think they were 4 cylinder diesels. They were great in town, but under powered on the road and very bad fuel mileage. I think they geared really low.

[blt2ski]

Buddy,

That would be in the late 70's to early 80's. Early 90's produced an "SD" model, that was a class 4 15K gvwr or there abouts truck with a pickup body. GM also did a 3500HD from about 92 to about 2000 with a body lifted truck that also was a class 4 15K gvwr rig. Ford IMHO hit the nail with the currect body style 450/550 setup. GM bit the big one with the 4500/5500 setup being more of an mdt style cab. I could see that with the 5500 as it was a 19500-26K gvwr rig. the 4500 was inline with the 450/550 in the 14-19500 gvwr range depending upon axels, springs etc chosen. Then the 6500 was inline with the 5500 gvwr wise, but the 5500 only had the 6.6td option from a diesel standpoint, the 6500 had Cat and an Isuzu inline 6 option, BOTH had the 8.1 V8 gas option! BUT, one could get GCWR's into the mid 40K range with a 6500 vs 30K with the 5500. SO a better trailer pulling option. Hence showing why initially the 6.6 dmax was designed for rigs to 26K max from the get go. Be it good or bad frankly.

I would have gotten a 4500 in 05 "IF" GM had had more of a 25-35 series cab and chassis setup like the 450 did. The 450 is a good rig, I just do not like the ford cab as well as GM's. Now you are into more personal opinion that is oen truly better than the other......

marty

[buddyIam]

What year did Ford switch to the current f450 name. Wasn't it f400 and f500 series at one time. A much larger cab than the current f450 etc. Completely different than the pickups.

[tatest]

I'm not sure of the model year, but it would have been a Ford MDT chassis cab, F-550 most likely, before the 6.2 V8 and 6-speed auto started going over to Detroit Chassis. The "standard" drivetrain at this level in the series was the 6.8 V10 with six-speed manual, though most were ordered with Powerstroke and five-speed automatic.

[PaulJ2]

blt2ski wrote:
GM will be to about 2005 or so with a diesel. BB gas may have ended a year or two before that. I found a few 6sp manuals with diesels in 05 when I bought my dually, but went with an allison. Probably the best auto I have driven, and only one I got to last longer than half a clutch. BUT, still not as good in low as a manual in first. The allison is about an effective 5-1, vs a HD manual in the 5.5 or lower range. THe 4 sp autos are as high as 4-1.


Marty

My 2004 8.1 was available with a 6 speed manual as well as the Duramax. Don't know if the last year or not. Quite rare though I suspect. My owners manual shows it as well.

[buddyIam]

jayco

I may have to go with the new Ram because of that. But I sure hate spending 50+ grand on a stick shift.

I don't have to worry about rust in this area. The question is if I can find any manual gassers good enough to mess with. I got one on its last leg. It's worked great for 34 years but it's getting to be like old worn furniture.

And it doesn't have a overdrive. I guess there is always gear vendors. (I have to stop that kind of talk)

I guess we had plenty of gas in 1980. :>)

[buddyIam]

Blt2ski

I've never been worried about up hill, actually not worried about downhill with the truck I have now. My t18 has a 6.32 granny gear I just have to think ahead. Granny isn't synchronized. I have lost traction on some sand covered roads but never got stopped because of power.. I was by myself and came up on a area of road deeply covered by damp leaves, I lost traction and decided to back up. As I was backing up I high centered the trailer on a rock I couldn't see in my mirrors. Couldn't go forward or backwards. I had to block all the wheels with rocks. Jack up the trailer axle. Put rocks and dirt under one trailer wheel. Then make sure the truck didn't get high centered on the same rock. That was a bit scary I was way out of the main travel areas. And of course no cell phone or CB reception.

Going up hill if I got worried I'd jump before the truck stopped. ;.0

Going downhill I'd get run over buy my trailer. I got to have me some gears and brakes. lol

As hot as it gets in eastern Washington and Oregon I figured the rattle snakes just went east for the winter. :>)

We have Rattle snakes up to 6000 feet. And I wouldn't get to carful until over 7000 ft. Especially on the eastern side in the big granite mountain areas. All that granite can warm things up a bunch. There are a few lakes I will go to up above Bishop. Sabrina, South and North lakes. But that's a long drive. The season is so short there that it can get crowded. And mice are terrible in a wet year on that side, even at 8000 ft..

[jaycocamprs]

GM had the NV4500 with the 6.0 up thru at least 04, likely 06. The 8.1 and the NV5600, were probably the same timeframe. But GM did not sell many, and most are in regular cab trucks.

[blt2ski]

buddy

What is a rattle snake? I see garden snakes, mole snakes?!?!?! among the two that live around here. No rattle snakes.......unless it got loose from somewhere, then it will not survive too long due to colder temps....I've also never seen a mole snake or whatever the 2nd snake is that lives around here, so not too worried about one of them either.

If you are worried about going up the hills, as much as down. I have some formula's somewhere that show what gearing based on tire diam you need to go up an x% grade. My old 6.5td with 4.10s and the NV4500 with 385lb ft of torque was good to 30% at 20K. Where as the POS 4l80E was good to about 16%, if that. A Dmax with 600 lb of torque, an allison is good to about 25% at 20K lbs, and around 40% with the ZF6sp. Tranny gearing itself can do a lot vs just looking at axel gears.

With this in mind, the GM 6l90E has a 4.10 first gear, put that with a typical 3.73 or 4.10 axel gear, 31" tires, a TC around 2-1 with a loss of 20% for heat and slippage, you have a pretty low overall low in the 28to30-1 relm. Better than my 96 at 24-1. You should not have any issues going up hills that are typically found on side roads, forest service roads etc. The issue will be the going down, but as noted, even with a manual, some steeper grades in the less than 5mph range, you needed the service brakes to slow down etc.

Marty

[buddyIam]

Blt2ski

That maybe. The ones in Frisco are much steeper than 7% but not in the middle of a hairpin.

20% might not be to far from truth in the middle of the hairpin turns I am talking about also.

My brother and I have been all over west of the Mississippi. A few bad ones in N.E. Colorado.

I was pretty happy with the roads I traveled in Washington and Oregon. If the East side road to Crater lake was any wider and straighter I'd call it a freeway.

And our rattle snakes are bigger than yours too. 😉

[blt2ski]

Buddy,

The newer autos than my 05 auto are better yet. and the 05 allison is way better than my 2000 4l80e, and milleniums ahead of a th400 that I had behind BB gas rigs back into the 80s.

I would have no issues with a 6l90E behind one of GM's 6.0 gas V8's towing my 12K equipment trailer on roads way the he!! steeper than you are talking about, ie 15-20% with some in the mid 20% range. 8-10% are nothing grades in my book. i used to live on a hill that was 9 going one way, 11 the other. I know of many roads in downtown Seattle that are in the 20+ range......like I say, 8-10 are shoulder shrugger jaunts up and down.

marty

[buddyIam]

Taco

I will have to check but I don't think the 6L90E will stay locked up at 5 or 10 mph in first gear. With your foot hard on the brake. As I said the turns I am talking about are at a near stop. Even in granny gear I am still on the brake first because it needs a little brake. Second just for reassurance.

I am not familiar with the tow haul modes, but so far I have heard about 60/40 that they don't hold in the situation above.

I had hoped the new Auto's were better than my brothers late 90's Ram with a after market lockup switch. Even that wouldn't hold lockup through the hairpin turns. And when that came un locked in the turn the first time. It didn't send you home smiling.