No DEF for 2020 Emissions??

[ACZL]

Has anyone else heard any rumblings on DEF being eliminated for 2020 emissions? I've heard it from 2 different people, but have NOT seen a thing in any semi web site or on a trucking radio show.

[FishOnOne]

BIL's 09 6.7 cummins had the constant CEL with the continuous trips to the dealer because of the emissions system and all they would do is clean out the emission system, tell him to drive with the exhaust brake on, run a fuel additive and send him down the road. After 9 months of the run around he sold that truck because the dealer couldn't provide any real solutions to the root cause. I suppose the class actions took care of these type of impacted customers. The only people who didn't exhibit these problems were the ones who towed heavy on a frequent basis.

His 04 and my 05 6.0 PSD also sooted up the EGR valves and would require cleaning every ~80k miles.

[ACZL]

Our trucks at work (older ones now-- '05'08 era) have Cummins ISM engines and seem to have a fair amount of EGR issues. Few older ones yet have the ISX and no EGR's and no issues. Newest ones '12 and up have Detroit DDT 13's w/ DEF and while the engine itself is quite durable, the DEF side of things have been a pain. But when they work right, all is great. For the most part overall, cannot really say the DEF systems have set us back. I know awhile ago I stopped at local semi dealer's service dep't to ask a question and they told me that 70% of trucks in yard were DEF related problems. IMO, the trucks that get ran the hardest seem to have the least amount of issues. Those that start/stop/shut off often are the problem children.

[Cummins12V98]

"Wouldn't a 10% increase in HP for the Cummins still make it have less HP than the competition?

385 Current
39 10% increase
424 new HP

440 right now for the Ford
445 right now for Chevy

Or am I missing something?"

I said "left in the dust and astounding" On the Dyno I am willing to bet the BIG "C" will be on top hp wise.

Add 20 percent to the current 900HP and it will be "astounding" at 1,080 TQ!

Who knows what will happen but it will be BIG.

I had ZERO issues with my HO 11 RAM for 65k with at least 1/2 towing 27-29K. My oil analysis always came back with less than .05 percent fuel dilution so basically nothing.

Yes the first couple years the 6.7 had issues but they were taken care of. Can't say the same for many 6.0, 6.4 and 6.7 customers.

[SweetLou]

Bionic Man wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:
Troll Man,
Not fear mongering at all, but just stating facts. Another fact there's no denying that implementing DEF and reducing EGR duty cycle cummins made a major improvement. You're the exception, not the rule!

Bottom line I wouldn't own any of the DPF equipped diesel trucks that are not equipped with DEF.

I won't argue with you that DEF is an improvement. That said, would you be so kind as to give some sort of verifiable documentation that the majority of non-DEF trucks have significant problems? Or are we just going off of your typical "my neighbors', barber's, milk man's veterinarian told me" - your normal proof source.

The real bottom line is that you will never own anything but your Blue Kool-Aid, and you will bash every chance you get.

Even the moderator here has called you a troll. Yet you can never help yourself.

Your routine is tiresome.

HAHA Good one

[FishOnOne]

Me Again wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

kw/00 wrote:
Well if they move the emissions down stream out of the engine bay, that may provide an easier way of removing them for those that tune and delete?

Know one can really say until we see how the system is implemented. Having said that deleting today's trucks is not really to difficult for most people.

So one or two percent of people delete their trucks. Just give the remainder a truck that runs good OEM. Chris

Not sure I understand your point or question?

[FishOnOne]

Bionic Man wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:
Troll Man,
Not fear mongering at all, but just stating facts. Another fact there's no denying that implementing DEF and reducing EGR duty cycle cummins made a major improvement. You're the exception, not the rule!

Bottom line I wouldn't own any of the DPF equipped diesel trucks that are not equipped with DEF.

I won't argue with you that DEF is an improvement. That said, would you be so kind as to give some sort of verifiable documentation that the majority of non-DEF trucks have significant problems? Or are we just going off of your typical "my neighbors', barber's, milk man's veterinarian told me" - your normal proof source.

The real bottom line is that you will never own anything but your Blue Kool-Aid, and you will bash every chance you get.

Even the moderator here has called you a troll. Yet you can never help yourself.

Your routine is tiresome.

Your routine attacks on selective few while giving others a pass is a classic troll move.

Carry on Troll

[spoon059]

Bionic Man wrote:
Even the moderator here has called you a troll. Yet you can never help yourself.

Your routine is tiresome.

Ha, no kidding. The Energizer bunny... he just keeps going, and going, and going...

[Bionic_Man]

FishOnOne wrote:
Troll Man,
Not fear mongering at all, but just stating facts. Another fact there's no denying that implementing DEF and reducing EGR duty cycle cummins made a major improvement. You're the exception, not the rule!

Bottom line I wouldn't own any of the DPF equipped diesel trucks that are not equipped with DEF.

I won't argue with you that DEF is an improvement. That said, would you be so kind as to give some sort of verifiable documentation that the majority of non-DEF trucks have significant problems? Or are we just going off of your typical "my neighbors', barber's, milk man's veterinarian told me" - your normal proof source.

The real bottom line is that you will never own anything but your Blue Kool-Aid, and you will bash every chance you get.

Even the moderator here has called you a troll. Yet you can never help yourself.

Your routine is tiresome.

[3oaks]

crcr wrote:
^^ what he said ... runs good PLUS reliable. Some of us live in jurisdictions where we are subject to annual diesel emissions tests, so cannot delete even if we wanted to.

I was about to make the same comment just before I read your post. 😉

[Jarlaxle]

Me Again wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

kw/00 wrote:
Well if they move the emissions down stream out of the engine bay, that may provide an easier way of removing them for those that tune and delete?

Know one can really say until we see how the system is implemented. Having said that deleting today's trucks is not really to difficult for most people.

So one or two percent of people delete their trucks. Just give the remainder a truck that runs good OEM. Chris

It is called "gas power".

[crcr]

Me Again wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

kw/00 wrote:
Well if they move the emissions down stream out of the engine bay, that may provide an easier way of removing them for those that tune and delete?

Know one can really say until we see how the system is implemented. Having said that deleting today's trucks is not really to difficult for most people.

So one or two percent of people delete their trucks. Just give the remainder a truck that runs good OEM. Chris

^^ what he said ... runs good PLUS reliable. Some of us live in jurisdictions where we are subject to annual diesel emissions tests, so cannot delete even if we wanted to.

[Me_Again]

FishOnOne wrote:

kw/00 wrote:
Well if they move the emissions down stream out of the engine bay, that may provide an easier way of removing them for those that tune and delete?

Know one can really say until we see how the system is implemented. Having said that deleting today's trucks is not really to difficult for most people.

So one or two percent of people delete their trucks. Just give the remainder a truck that runs good OEM. Chris

[FishOnOne]

Troll Man,
Not fear mongering at all, but just stating facts. Another fact there's no denying that implementing DEF and reducing EGR duty cycle cummins made a major improvement. You're the exception, not the rule!

Bottom line I wouldn't own any of the DPF equipped diesel trucks that are not equipped with DEF.

[Bionic_Man]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

eHoefler wrote:
They are eliminating the EGR valve on the Cummins engines in 2019 model year. All emmisions will be downstream in the exhaust, and DEF is going to be part of it.

This is true, I spoke to a Lady at the Cummins Columbus, IN CMEP plant last Summer when taking the Plant Tour. She said she was working on the 19 engine and it will still be the 6.7. She had the "Cat Ate The Bird" look on her face when discussing it. Reports are the HP will increase 10 percent and TQ 20 percent. If so the competition will be left in the dust.

Cummins is using this technology on other engines.

Like when GM and Ford implemented DEF in their trucks and left cummins in the dust! :W

How will the competition be left in the dust if this women was unveiling cummins future hp and torque ratings?

Just add the percentages I mentioned to current numbers and they will be astounding. Also the fuel economy will be even better!

Let's mention fact, the Cummins did NOT need the DEF system. This engines are still desirable to some.

Wouldn't a 10% increase in HP for the Cummins still make it have less HP than the competition?

385 Current
39 10% increase
424 new HP

440 right now for the Ford
445 right now for Chevy

Or am I missing something?

And as far as the Cummins pre-def fear mongering that the Troller likes to do, there are plenty of people who are running that engine trouble free. Like I am.