Spread axle setup?

[TxTwoSome]

I see a few of the newer trailers being offered with what the dealer calls a spread axle setup with the wheels further apart and that is supposed to improve your towing experience.

Is this just dealer hype or a better axle setup?

[kkuhl]

my new trailer has e-z tow axle setup. the trailer rides smoother than my last trailer doesnt shake things of kitchen counter. will see how tires wear i dont think it is going to be a big issue

[Doug33]

My Bullet has the spread axles and in general I like the way they tow very stable. There is more stress when turning tightly, but I have not seen any evidence of tire scuffing. I do wish I could use x-chocks.

[horton333]

This was one, of a couple, of threads I read prior to buying my new trailer (Tracer 238 AIR). In the end I decided the axles were not a significant issue for me, either way. It's another 2 weeks till real world results start coming in, and next year till I have significant enough kilometers to really have an opinion. If I think there is anything interesting I will post.
I suspect the new trailer being several inches higher than the current one will have more impact on towing, and with the vast majority of my tight turns on gravel or sand I just don't think fatigue will be an issue for my use even is there is a design weakness.
It is always best to be informed, thanks to those who contributed to my education in this thread.
John

[goducks10]

Had spread axles on my Heartland North Trail. IMO they were there to reduce the TW. From the factory the TW was under 10%. The axles were also placed toward the center too much. Horrible towing TT. I used an EQ with built in 4pt sway control and had a 950lb TW on a 7200lb TT. The TT constantly wandered. Never got into a sway issue though.
To those that say they don't think the scuff is that bad. Well when I have to back into my driveway I need to backup 90*. I always left tire cuff marks on the pavement when doing so. With my current 5th wheel making the same exact maneuver I leave no marks. 5er has standard spread axles.
If spread axles were so much better then all TT's would have them. They put spread axles on TT's for a reason and those reasons may vary. But a well built, well balanced TT shouldn't need spread axles.

[apr67]

Calicajun wrote:

Great to hear that your RV won't let the rim of a blown tire not drag the ground. Wish my TT would do that but it doesn't. 😞

Interesting, I wonder what the difference is?

[Huntindog]

It's a compromise.
Spread axles WILL impart a LOT more stress on things when turning sharp. That CAN over time cause hangers to fatigue and fail. It won't happen right away, but can take years. That is called metal fatigue.
The advantage is the ability to use a lighter frame, with less tounge weight and a more stable tow with a less capable TV.
Since many people that want TTs do not have a full size truck, the manufacturers are filling a market need. Most of these TTs simply won't be used very hard or often and things will work out fine for them. If this type of TT fits what you need, then it is a good fit for you. If you have a stout TV and tow often then it may not be a good choice for you.

[mosseater]

Atlee wrote:
Then you must want to get on the next planet when a triple axle is making a sharp turn. 🙂

mosseater wrote:
The only thing I know for certain is that when I'm near one while it's taking a sharp turn, I have a primal need to get farther away. That's a lot of stress, whether you feel good about it or not.

You got it.

[69_Avion]

8iron wrote:

69 Avion wrote:

icanon wrote:
Just a thought. Can someone get their TT modified to have the 'spread axle setup'? Is it ok to do so if done at truck/trailer suspension repair shop? Or is it Not recommended?

Almost anything can be done for a price. Why change a setup that has less scuffing and should have been built with a heavy enough frame from the factory for proper support?
Check out large trailers on semi trucks. The rear tandem duals are close together on "most" of the trailers. They will spread them out for special loads, but it is relatively uncommon.
If spreading the axles are such a great idea, why not spread them out another foot or two. If wide spread axle placement is "really good" than futher apart should be "even better"!!! It isn't.
These manufacturers that use the wide spread axle placement are probably doing it to spread the load on their frame. It saves them money on a frame that may not have enough support with the axles close together.

Any facts to support any of your statements? I toured the Crossroads factory a few years ago and was told the Lippert frames were made of the same materials just longer or shorter per spec. Hence the shorter TT's generally having a higher CCC than the longer ones.

I said they are "PROBABLY" doing it to spread the load on their frame. Am I going to crawl under them to "prove" it to you. Of course not. Why would I? I don't have much experience in building trailers since I have only done it on and off for about 40 years.
When you spread the axles you do increase the scuffing affect. That is a FACT and no I don't need to "prove" it. The other issue is that any misalignment is compounded the further the axles are spread apart. When I built a few trailers with the "spread" axles, I didn't have that issue because all of my trailers were built on jigs and the axles would be placed within 1/16" of an inch. Every one was double checked with a string line. All my frames were built to 1/8", and double checked with string lines. The only real variance is from any distortion or warping from the welding. Most manufacturers won't take the time to make sure they are that close in tolerance. Those tolerances really matter in how the trailer will tow.
Many things can be done with enough money. I see nobody wants to take me up on spreading the axles 2,4, 5, 6, maybe even 8 feet apart (LOL). Does anyone really think it will "handle" well?
I have built many triple axle equipment trailers over the years. Do I prefer them? NO. I prefer skipping them and going to tandem duals. And yet, I still have a triple axle Avion TT. Why, because of the quality of the unit, not the axle setup. I would have preferred tandem axles that were "heavier" rated so I could have tandems instead of triples.
The spread axle tandem setup starts having the same issues the triple axles have. The more the "spread" the more the scuffing. As long as the "spread" isn't too far, most folks towing them won't notice the issues unless they do a lot of turns. Where I used to build trailers, I had an overhead hoist and some nice C-3 zoned property to do it on. My access, off a divided roadway, was a "U" turn from one direction. When testing the trailers, it was easy to see the difference.
Now, back to why they spread the axles. From my experience, there is no "advantage" to spreading the tandem axles apart other than to spread the load across a larger area of the frame. I will let you come up with the conclusion as to why they do it. If someone really wants it on their trailer, go for it. The most important thing is to be happy.

If I was worried about my frame load, I would have done what Avion did on the triple axle trailer. The frame is 8" (8x2)high rectangular tube with another 6" high (6x2) tube under the 8" tube where the axles mount. That gives the trailer a 14" high frame section where the axles mount and the load is spread on 3 axles. I'll bet you won't see many built like that today. Ask yourself why? It is that the companies don't have the technology? NO, it is because "cheap is good" for them, not for you.

As you mentioned above, the manufacturer was using the same material no matter the frame length. If that is the case, it is easy to see why they spread the axles. Look at how much money it saves them in material costs and different material that they have to keep in stock. Is it best for them or the customer?

[TxTwoSome]

OP here just wanted to say thanks to all who replied to my question!

I think I may have learned something!:B

[spoon059]

8iron wrote:
Any facts to support any of your statements?

Probably not... Everyone has an opinion about everything on rv.net. Everybody is an armchair engineer too. Bottom line, if spread axles were grenading at the rate some posters here want you to believe, we would see spread axle carcasses all over the place. The gas stations would be littered with them... there would be piles of destroyed frames at campgrounds... there would be thread after thread after thread after thread about it on rv.net.

The reality is that the work for the intended purpose. Are they the BEST? Probably not. I would argue that NOTHING in the travel trailer world is the BEST. Everything is a compromise between durability, weight and cost.

We aren't driving around with class 8 semi's pulling our trailers... that would be the "best" in terms of pulling power and stopping abilities. We aren't driving around on run flat G rated tires that cost $1000 each... those would be a lot closer to the "best" than what we have.

My buddy has a spread axle and he likes how it tows. He goes camping maybe 8-10 times a year. That is 16 to 20 times he has to back in a year. No issues with backing up. He feels less sway and has a lighter tongue weight as a result. Great for him. My Jayco has standard axles and I like how it tows.

Buy what you want to buy and keep up with maintenance. If you do that, it probably doesn't matter which system you have. Just another 4 pages of belly-aching on rv.net...

[8iron]

69 Avion wrote:

icanon wrote:
Just a thought. Can someone get their TT modified to have the 'spread axle setup'? Is it ok to do so if done at truck/trailer suspension repair shop? Or is it Not recommended?

Almost anything can be done for a price. Why change a setup that has less scuffing and should have been built with a heavy enough frame from the factory for proper support?
Check out large trailers on semi trucks. The rear tandem duals are close together on "most" of the trailers. They will spread them out for special loads, but it is relatively uncommon.
If spreading the axles are such a great idea, why not spread them out another foot or two. If wide spread axle placement is "really good" than futher apart should be "even better"!!! It isn't.
These manufacturers that use the wide spread axle placement are probably doing it to spread the load on their frame. It saves them money on a frame that may not have enough support with the axles close together.

Any facts to support any of your statements? I toured the Crossroads factory a few years ago and was told the Lippert frames were made of the same materials just longer or shorter per spec. Hence the shorter TT's generally having a higher CCC than the longer ones.

[69_Avion]

icanon wrote:
Just a thought. Can someone get their TT modified to have the 'spread axle setup'? Is it ok to do so if done at truck/trailer suspension repair shop? Or is it Not recommended?

Almost anything can be done for a price. Why change a setup that has less scuffing and should have been built with a heavy enough frame from the factory for proper support?
Check out large trailers on semi trucks. The rear tandem duals are close together on "most" of the trailers. They will spread them out for special loads, but it is relatively uncommon.
If spreading the axles are such a great idea, why not spread them out another foot or two. If wide spread axle placement is "really good" than futher apart should be "even better"!!! It isn't.
These manufacturers that use the wide spread axle placement are probably doing it to spread the load on their frame. It saves them money on a frame that may not have enough support with the axles close together.

[icanon]

Just a thought. Can someone get their TT modified to have the 'spread axle setup'? Is it ok to do so if done at truck/trailer suspension repair shop? Or is it Not recommended?

[icanon]

Terryallan wrote:

icanon wrote:
Who makes these spread axle setups?

they are on "some " Forest river, and "some " Jaycos, and "some" of just about every brand.

I'm guessing they are Dexter axles

Thanks.