Super Wide Singles

[rtz549]

If the tire makers made these tires in sizes that would fit dual wheel pickups; would you run them?



The semi tires don't look big on a semi; but they are apparently 40" tall.

These tires are rated at about 10,000 lbs each.

I think they would work great for driving on sand?

Do you think OEM's would ever start offering those tires as stock or at least an option? I'm surprised we haven't seen them in smaller sizes by now.

Semi truck tires:


http://www.thedieselgarage.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96850

[Flamingfalcon64]

Jefe, thanks for all the great articles. I am booking my white rim trail excursion now.
On the super- singles; have you obtained pricing on those wheels?
I have an 02 dually with a north star and a 3" lift, locker, etc., and would like to go to SS for the reasons you espouse. Just out of curiosity, have you come up with a 16" combo between the 315 and the 375? I might try it.

[jefe_4x4]

jefe here. The term, 'super single' means different things to different people. They have been around a long time and have their good/bad/ugly, just like any other setup. I am the self proclaimed Sultan of Super Singles on this forum and have some observations.

A super single is essentially a wider, studier tire with an accompanying wider rim that is to take the place of two tires, with a footprint about as wide as two slimmer tires put together. Why use SS's? Michelin tested the wheels off super singles and found they saved fuel as there were only two sidewalls to flex instead of four. Also, the combined unsprung weight was higher with duals. Two wheels, two tires.
Why would I use super singles? These have a 15.5 inch wide tread on 12 inch wide wheels:

1. to have a larger footprint that could be pressured down to 'float' on sand and even snow. This does not work very well if you use any .5 wheels/tires. Why? It's a different design made for high load capacity and no lowering of the pressure. That little ridge you get with a non-.5 wheel allows the bead to stay on the rim longer at low pressure. This is why I used 375/55R16 (33x15.50R16) Mickey Thompson AT tread tires and the accompanying 12" wide Mickey Thompson aluminum wheels as they could be deflated down fairly low and still stay afloat and not come off the bead and offer superior floatation. There was a lot of air space inside the tire that worked well when deflated for sand. Here are a 33", 285x75R16 AT, vs. the 375x55R16, AT. Both tires unmounted at this point. Both E rated.

My problem is i like sand. My problem is I drive a 10,300 pound off-road domicile.
2. To widen the rear track for better stability.
3. To obtain the highest load rating I could find to support that Lance camper, of which most of the weight is added to the rear axle. At that time it was a 3750 pound load rating.
The 16.5" wheels and tires of old were not made to be pressured down. To work with that rim they must have a robust, stiff carcass. But they were called super singles as they had a slightly wider tread and a slightly wider wheel and could haul a heavier load. They did work ever so slightly better on loose ground than the skinny regular truck tire could even without airing down.
If you NEVER plan to air down your tires for any reason, by all means get the .5 wheels/tires as they will haul a heavier load. The so-called super singles for 450/550's noted above still use only the E rated Mickey Thompson carcass.
Alas, my SS's are not made by M.T. anymore and I am on the hunt for some new shoes. Here is what my latest research has revealed:
No company stocks what i need. There is not a sand suitable super single wheel already made that will work. So, I'm going to have Stockton Wheel make me four, custom made wheels. These will have 1/2 inch solid flat steel centers with a 10" wide version for the front axle with a 6.25 inch backspacing to work with my slightly lifted 2001 Dodge. All the commercial wheels I can find have a 3.5 inch to 4.5 inch B.S. This puts the scrub radius too far out on the spindle for me: and also for the rear of the front fender opening. So many of these driving around destroying their front wheel bearings as the load is way out on the spindle. For the rear, it will be two 11 inch wide wheels with the same 6.25 inch B.S. Why these numbers? I'm trying to squeeze the most floatation I can from all four wheels/tires and still have the ability to carry the load and steer. The rears will be about 6 inches narrower of track than I have now when it all goes together, making the track fit better grinding down some jeep trail.
I searched for tires first. I'm not having wheels custom made without having the tires that will fit said wheels. These were the ones in the running:
Cooper Discoverer S/T MAXX
LT315/75R16
load range E
sidewall black
Approved Rim Width: 8 -11 inches
measured rim width: 8.5 inches
Section Width: 12.5 inches
Overall Diameter: 34.45 inches
Tread Width: 10 inches
Max load: 3860 pounds
tread depth: 18.5
*******************************
Nitto Trail Grappler M/T Mud Terrain
LT315/75R16
Load Range E
black wall
Diameter: 34.8 inches
tread depth: 20/32 inches
section width: 12.83 inches
min/max recommended wheel width: 8.0 - 11.0 inches
Load range E
Load max: 3860 pounds (less for dual application)
********************************
Kumho Road Venture MT
315/75R16
black sidewall
tire diameter: 34.50 in.
section width: 12.30 in.
Tread width: 10.00 in.?
min/max recommended wheel width: 8.00 - 10.00 in.
Load range E
tread depth: 21/32 in.
Max load: 3860 pounds.
*********************************
All this leads me to believe that all three tires were made by the same tire maker in China. Note the up tick in the load capacity from 3750 to 3860. That's comforting.
I'm leaning toward the Coopers. They should fit. They are fairly quiet for such an aggressive tread tire. We have a similar version of the Coopers on Jeanie's 2011 Grand Cherokee with good results.
I have been driving at low pressure on sand for 40 years. You get a feel of what setup you need to make it work.
jefe

[mooring_product]

Super single


Here is the article on that truck.

[mkirsch]

Yeah, there's a huge market for those. Someone should start making them.

[mooring_product]

Buzzcut1 wrote:
Jefe runs super singles on his truck

To me a super single is taking a dually and running a single wheel on the rear such as a 19.5, 22.5 or 24.5. A wide 16" wheel on the rear of a SRW doesn't fall into super single in my mind.

Here is a 20" Super single set up I looked into.

http://www.1stattack.com/brush-fire-trucks/super-single-wheels

[mooring_product]

That truck was built by First Coast Diesel out of Jacksonville FL. Its been years since I saw it but if memory serves me it was built for show and towed very little.

[samuraiowner]

I had A 1965 streamline(not airstream) motor home that had 16.5 super singles on the back. they are hard to find but they are out there.
the problem with super singles they are terrible on wet pavement or snow.

[flatbedr]

Deserteagle and Buzzcut are spot on with their takes.

I ran Super Single's on my semi tractor. Had a blowout literally 8 miles from my tire dealer. Aside from the fact that it was -25, my Michelin dealer didn't have a spare in stock nor was there a tire to be found in the Michelin system within a 300 mile radius. Had to dual out the blown out axle to get back to their shop. Went back to duals after that experience.

If OEM's did offer such an option the axles and bearings would have to be beefed up drastically.

[Buzzcut1]

also a major advantage of having a single dual rear wheels and 2 tires on each side is if you do have a tire failure then you have a built in spare right there at that point

so no I would not do that

deserteagle56 wrote:
Amen! Had a rear tire blowout on my F350 SRW a few years ago while packing a camper and was very lucky I didn't roll. All that weight way up high and all of a sudden one side of the rig instantly dropped 6". I was only doing ~ 45 mph at the time - hate to think what would have happened if I were at freeway speeds. I never forgot that experience, so when it came time for a different pickup I considered only a dually.

did it at 65 with my SRW and a 4000 pound camper in the bed. Nearly change of shorts time. Quite the wild ride in keeping the rubber side down. That's why I now run 19.5s

[deserteagle56]

"also a major advantage of having a single dual rear wheels and 2 tires on each side is if you do have a tire failure then you have a built in spare right there at that point

so no I would not do that"

Amen! Had a rear tire blowout on my F350 SRW a few years ago while packing a camper and was very lucky I didn't roll. All that weight way up high and all of a sudden one side of the rig instantly dropped 6". I was only doing ~ 45 mph at the time - hate to think what would have happened if I were at freeway speeds. I never forgot that experience, so when it came time for a different pickup I considered only a dually.

[languiduck]

Why are you posting a pic of a mini tubbed, pro stock type hot rod, running soft compound grooved tires in which the sidewalls wrinkle for traction and would never carry any type of load?

[bfast54]

smkettner wrote:

rtz549 wrote:

Narrow the rear to make like an SRW 350/3500 and I am in :B

if you narrow the rear and then you would have to bring the wheel wells in and you would not be able to carry a truck camper so you would defeat the purpose.


also a major advantage of having a single dual rear wheels and 2 tires on each side is if you do have a tire failure then you have a built in spare right there at that point

so no I would not do that

[Mike_Hohnstein]

Wheelholder wrote:
Those super singles you are talking about only come in 22.5 rims. They save fuel, which is why truckers use them. I have heard complaints about hydroplaning in the rain. The cost is actually less than buying 2 tires on the big rig. After the initial cost of buying 4 new rims to hold the tires, there is a cost savings.

I would imagine one of the reasons no air ride seats is the air compressor. A big rig uses air for a multitude of reasons(brakes, works the splitter on the transmission, supply the trailer with air, etc.) If the oem's would put a built in compressor like a big rig, it would make sense to air ride the seat.

You can have air seats
Air compressors
Our F350 has air seats 4 corner air bags, no problem. No 19.5s however.
In the late 80's we towed the race car with a 3/4 ton and later a one ton c/c Chevy trucks, had 10" wheels and over size rear rubber on the back axle. Worked well.

[rtz549]

It seems like smaller size true super wide singles with proper weight rating would also work great on Class A, B, and C RV's too. I think there is a market for them(new RV's from the factory).

Imagine a Class A diesel pusher with with a tag axle and only 4 tires in the back instead of 6. No more inside duals to check.

If the tire was wide enough; I think it would work great on sand and not need aired down?