Why ST tires?

[UTCoyote]

Hey All,

Total noob, trying to soak all this RV stuff in all at once. The Maxxis ST tires on my recently purchased 2001 TT "look" like new, but I don't know how old they actually are, so don't know how much life I should consider they really have in them. I need to research how to read the date code on them.

When I do buy new ones, I'm wondering why ST's? With their 65 MPH speed limit, there has to be some redeeming properties that make them desirable for TT/RV use?

Without knowing anything - which I don't - on the face of it, seems obvious to put LT's on. They can be had in load ratings plenty heavy enough and not be stuck in the slow lane with the semi's all the time.

- Coyote

[Shavano]

This thread has run its course.

[Huntindog]

Beachums wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

kedanie wrote:
How about one of you guys try being the bigger man and just walk away from a fight that neither will win!!!!!!!!!!!

Enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually I won the day I walked away from ST tires.

There sure are a few egos on this thread, I keep going back to the title to make sure I am in a tire thread on a RV site..... You would think that the topic would be of much more consequence with the tone of most of these posts.

Also, You lost before you even finished the first word with that red font....... Are you trying to be a mod or something?

I guess someone smarter than me wouldn't even bother to post this opinion, but what can I say.......I guess I need to go on a camping trip or something

I like colors. Losing is a state of mind. I don't have that state of mind. I seek solutions to problems. That is what winners do.
I am going camping too. I hope your tires, what ever they are treat you well.

Have a nice trip

[FastEagle]

When writing posts in a medium (RV trailer tires) I’ve found it best to use the language common to the that particular medium.

Safety Standards and Industry Standards are the most common terms used throughout the tire industry.

In this first reference, rules are determined and put into play for all to follow.

Click to view ref

In this second reference, a single regulation is explained. It reefers to other like regulations that may also apply.

Click to view ref

When you go into the big daddy (Code of Federal Regulations) and use the key word tire, you will get 418 hits. When a regulation is on file and current it has precedence.

Click to view ref

Personal views of active regulations vary from “so what” to “hogwash”. Litigators will apply them as they are currently written.

FastEagle

[Beachums]

Huntindog wrote:

kedanie wrote:
How about one of you guys try being the bigger man and just walk away from a fight that neither will win!!!!!!!!!!!

Enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually I won the day I walked away from ST tires.

There sure are a few egos on this thread, I keep going back to the title to make sure I am in a tire thread on a RV site..... You would think that the topic would be of much more consequence with the tone of most of these posts.

Also, You lost before you even finished the first word with that red font....... Are you trying to be a mod or something?

I guess someone smarter than me wouldn't even bother to post this opinion, but what can I say.......I guess I need to go on a camping trip or something

[JJBIRISH]

[Huntindog]

JIMNLIN wrote:
I like yanking JJs chain as he gives us long impressive flowing posts like a couple of his posts.

IMO we should all be working together and give folks looking for a better brand or tire type some input on what actually works out here instead of backing a tire company into the liability corner.

Hell I can ask any LT tire maker the right question and they will have to give the usual CYA liability answer like the BFG and Vanco email responce.
They also will give a trailer owner a thumbs up simply by wording the email/1-800 differently.
Its all about ones agenda.

Most folks understand that ploy.

Give me a TT that I like everything about except the tires, and I WILL find a way to get good tires on it.
I look for solutions to problems. Don't get hung up on what isn't possible, but rather what IS possible.

[JIMNLIN]

I like yanking JJs chain as he gives us long impressive flowing posts like a couple of his posts.

IMO we should all be working together and give folks looking for a better brand or tire type some input on what actually works out here instead of backing a tire company into the liability corner.

Hell I can ask any LT tire maker the right question and they will have to give the usual CYA liability answer like the BFG and Vanco email responce.
They also will give a trailer owner a thumbs up simply by wording the email/1-800 differently.
Its all about ones agenda.

Most folks understand that ploy.

[SprinklerMan]

Over the weekend I took my little Kubota tractor , a BX 24 over to a job to tie in a sewer line . Trailer is a 14 ft single axel 3000 lb rated landscape with a 1800 lb machine . No where near its capacity . The tires ..... The goodyear marathons that I took off my TT over the winter , 4 years old , great tread no cracks . Driving 35 mph on a neighborhood rd , all the tread came off then the tire blew , after I stopped and all the tread was gone . Backed the loader off the trailer , picked up the back of the trailer with loader , changed tire in 15 minutes .

I am now patting myself on the back for taking the advice from people on this forum , (and reading my owners manual ) I had upgraded the rims and tires on my TT to 16 inch rims and Vanco LT tires . And the guy that was with me has a TT also , can you guess the topic of discussion the rest of the day .

[Huntindog]

kedanie wrote:
How about one of you guys try being the bigger man and just walk away from a fight that neither will win!!!!!!!!!!!

Enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually I won the day I walked away from ST tires.

[kedanie]

How about one of you guys try being the bigger man and just walk away from a fight that neither will win!!!!!!!!!!!

Enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JJBIRISH]

JJBIRISH wrote:

The new Carlisle has its new marketing not a new reputation… the reputation of Carlisle radial wasn’t much different that there bias ply tire…

Myself, I am not a big believer in their bad reputation based on personal experience and using many of their tires without a single failure or flat tire… I do believe Maxxis is the best ST trailer tire for RV use…

No free ride for Maxxis from me… I have long been a critic of Maxxis for their distribution system even though I am a fan of their M8008 tire… even though they have a great reputation and I believe there is a good reason for it, I am still skeptical because of their minor market share…
and
I am pretty well satisfied that today Maxxis is the only choice I have for a dependable tire, although their distributions system is the pits… something I addressed with Maxxis USA several years ago and was told they were working on that issue… I haven’t seen a lot of improvement in distribution myself since then…
And
Distribution and the lack of it is Maxxis biggest problem… I don’t know why they can’t solve their problem with it, but it hasn’t improved much since they told me 2 years ago they were working on it and had several unnamed national distributors in the wings to come on board… they have to loosen up the territorial rights they give their distributors a little…

But that’s ok you know everything,

[Huntindog]

JJBIRISH wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

JJBIRISH wrote:

JIMNLIN wrote:

The rules are pretty simple, the replacement tires must equal or better the tires listed on the vehicles tire placard…

JJ, knows as well as most folks that the tire placard is a recommendation only. When you use the word "Rules" it implies some kind of law. There is no enforcement law that says the replacement tires have to be the same type listed on the placard.
The only enforceable law is roadside. They look for a DOT number and the tire capacity to match the vehicles axle ratings.

if your trailer came with ST225x75x15 in LR D @ 2540 lbs. capacity on the placard you can’t just say you can use a Wrangler HT in LT215x15 LR D @2090 lbs. capacity or in a LT 235x75x15 LR C @ 1980 lbs. capacity, which is what is often recommended in the forums for this situation…

Incorrect.
What I and others have recommended and are actually using is those two 1980-2080 lbs capacity LTs you mention for replacing a ST205/75-15 C at 1820 lbs capacity.

Actually you are incorrect, I know you insist this is not true and have posted so even for my state…
“Jack, you and FastEagle are playing to the tire placard liability thing simply by constantly bring up the issue just like your last post referring to certain tires that have been mentioned wouldn't pass your state inspection. Baloney. FastEagle has tried that trick also.
As long as the tire has enough tread depth and enough load carrying capacity/etc it will pass anyones state safety inspection requirement or even pass the annual fed safety inspection required for a commercial trailer/all vehicles regardless of tire type.”

The PA inspection say… the mfg. that being the trailer mfg. as the one required to correctly placard the vehicle… there are other provisions in the law pertaining to the trailer tires condition and tread also, but I am not about to search them all out right now…

(g) Tires and Rims - The axles of a vehicle
specified under this subchapter shall be
equipped with the number and type of tires
and rims which have a load rating equal to
or higher than those offered by the
manufacturer.

If the placards are only recommendations why do they deserve to be safety recalled so often for having the wrong information on the placards…

There have been recommendations made on the forums based on claimed trailer weights only that have had nothing to do with the trailers placard weights or even the axle weights…

While I haven’t ever made the claim that the tire type must be the same and that is misquoting me, the inspection law does in fact say the same number and type and load rating equal to or higher than…

You consistently accuse myself and others of boxing the tire builders into a corner when they are asked for information only because it don’t agree with your personal positions…
One posters response
We do not recommend using light truck tires on trailers that specify ST tires. If the trailer manufacturer calls for ST tires, it is important to replace with ST tires in order to maintain the load requirement.

Thank you for choosing BFGoodrich.

Your reply
“The OP backed BFG into the liability corner with that type question. He will get the same answer from any LT or P tire maker by asking for a direct replacement for a ST tire.”
And
“If your really interested in using LT tires don't back the tire makers or their dealers into the liability corner. “

Obviously you don’t think these are big boys that know how to answer for themselves…


My e-mail reply from continental tire
Thank you for contacting Customer Relations at Continental Tire the Americas, LLC.

We no longer manufacture ST tires, and the Vanco line is not a suitable alternative.
We would recommend searching for a dedicated ST tire line.

And your reply
“You badgered Vanco with the more canned questions until they gave you the answer you were looking for”
None of these people according to you know how to answer normal questions to their help line… no badgering, no pushing… the answers just don’t back up your opinions...

If you want the answer you are looking for according to your words, be sure to softball your questions

If these companies can’t stand tall on their own feet and recommend a LT tire, no, their LT tire even one with sufficient load capacity as a replacement tire for a ST tire why should I or anyone else assume it’s the thing to do, or assume you and others are their secret information outlet…

And this coming from me someone that generally don’t like the ST tire or their specifications, or their DOT certification requirements, and have voiced this many times, and believe the LT tire is a better tire… someone that if not for the Maxxis brand having proven itself to me, would be faced with a serious personal dilemma….

Stop the nonsense already. You pretty much admit that LTs are generally a better tire...Except for the beloved Maxxis, which has availability issues....
What will you do when Maxxis lowers their standards to the same as the rest of the ST crowd.
They seem at the present time to build to a higher standard...But all corporations are under constant pressure to increase profit. You say yourself that the govt. standards for ST tires are much weaker than for LT tires... That means at any moment that Maxxis can, and one day likely WILL lower their standards in order to remain competitive.... And they will do this overnite with telling you or all the people you are trying to convince to use those tires.

Anyone that actually bothers to read the testing standards required of LT tires and then reads the standards for ST tires, will be amazed at the difference. And all this debate will be over for those that do.
The only way to be sure that a tire will meet the higher LT standards is to BUY LT tires.

There is no nonsense here… I have not generally admited the LT is a better tire…When you admit that the testing criteria for LT s is higher....It is the same as admitting it. I have stated that before and have never stated any ST tire was a better tire including the Maxxis… I have said Maxxis is the best ST tire...
No one has complained about the testing and certification requirements of the ST tire more than I, including you… or the fact that Maxxis is voluntarily building well above those minimum standards, leaving me with my last choice in a ST tire since no Chinese tire of any type will ever grace my trailer… And you never bring up the downside to Maxxis...
That it does seem to be a good ST tire, but has availability issues. Post after post on here of people having to order them and wait. This is OK I guess if you don't mind having to wait. But it can be really inconvenient if a tire experiences a road hazard away from home and needs replacing pronto.... And ALL tires, even good ones can have this happen. in my last post I also admitted if not for the Maxxis I would have a real dilemma… reading only what you want again… Not at all. You still do have a dilemma... You just refuse to recognize it or admit it.

I did actually read all the testing procedures for both the ST tires and the LT tires and have posted my interruption of the results many times…

Have you actually read them yourself or only what myself and a few others much smarter than I have posted about them… I assure you it’s not fun, interesting, or light reading…. Yes I have read them.

Your and you cohorts that just profess to buy and change to LT tires are merely putting words in a post, because for the TT there just aren’t a lot of good choices for us like there are for the bigger trailers and 5ers, and when you find a tire for many more it just won’t fit under the trailer with the correct clearances…
So you solution is to try to erect obstacles to solutions that can work for people. Getting email after email answers that fit your narrow view and saying that it can't be done....

You guys know all of this of course, and just try to display your superior wisdom because you were fortunate enough to be able to switch but lacked the wisdom to buy the trailer with them already…We have covered this before. Changing tires is a easy fix in order to have a TT that fits my needs in other ways. Moving walls and installing another bathroom etc. Not so easy to do.
So I think I had PLENTY of WISDOM.

Like it or not, there are both legal and liability concerns that you choose to ignore and deny even exist, but I will continue to point them out and we can continue to disagree, and that’s ok… readers need to hear all sides and make their own informed decisions on what risk they are willing to accept…
Are you a lawyer? If not, shush. After all of your quotes about listening to the "experts in the field", you should understand that you have no expertise in the law unless you are a lawyer.


It doesn’t matter if the LT is a better tire if it isn’t made in the right size, installed on the right rim, or don’t fit under the trailer correctly…

This I sorta agree with. But one doesn't have to limit themselves to the exact everything. Many times a bigger size etc. WILL work just as good or even better.

[EldIr]

Atlee wrote:
After this post, I'm done.

However, the googled link you gave plainly says towing speed is "As Posted".

Yet you've been saying the trailer towing speed in Virginia is unposted and is 55mph.

And one other thing. Why would Virginia limit travel trailer speed to 55 mph, when all other towed vehicle speed limits, including 18 wheelers, is what ever is posted on the highway being traveled, and unposted speed limits on Virginia secondary roads is 45 mph?

I don't know what you're looking at, but it sure isn't the link I provided. That link is to Virginia towing laws as posted on Trailer World's webiste and clearly states max speed towing = 55mph. I'll copy and paste the text. It says nothing about a travel trailer - it's towing period.

Virginia Towing Laws


Height 13 1/2'
Width 8'
Combined Length 60'
Trailer Length NS (41)
Trailer Width 8'6"
Trailer Height 13'6"
MH Length 45'
Two Vehicle Length 65'
Triple Tow no
Safety Chains yes
Breakaway yes (34)
Fire Extinguisher Not Stated
Flare Signs Not Stated
Brake Laws Trailers 3000
Brake Laws Towed Cars No laws regarding.
Wipers yes
Overnight Parking P
Max Tow Speed 55
Ride In 5th-Wheel
Ride Pickup Camper yes
Ride Travel Trailer
Speed Limit Posted
GVW Federal Bridge Formula
Axle 20,000 lbs
License Required Class B
Reciprocity Yes

[JJBIRISH]

Huntindog wrote:

JJBIRISH wrote:

JIMNLIN wrote:

The rules are pretty simple, the replacement tires must equal or better the tires listed on the vehicles tire placard…

JJ, knows as well as most folks that the tire placard is a recommendation only. When you use the word "Rules" it implies some kind of law. There is no enforcement law that says the replacement tires have to be the same type listed on the placard.
The only enforceable law is roadside. They look for a DOT number and the tire capacity to match the vehicles axle ratings.

if your trailer came with ST225x75x15 in LR D @ 2540 lbs. capacity on the placard you can’t just say you can use a Wrangler HT in LT215x15 LR D @2090 lbs. capacity or in a LT 235x75x15 LR C @ 1980 lbs. capacity, which is what is often recommended in the forums for this situation…

Incorrect.
What I and others have recommended and are actually using is those two 1980-2080 lbs capacity LTs you mention for replacing a ST205/75-15 C at 1820 lbs capacity.

Actually you are incorrect, I know you insist this is not true and have posted so even for my state…
“Jack, you and FastEagle are playing to the tire placard liability thing simply by constantly bring up the issue just like your last post referring to certain tires that have been mentioned wouldn't pass your state inspection. Baloney. FastEagle has tried that trick also.
As long as the tire has enough tread depth and enough load carrying capacity/etc it will pass anyones state safety inspection requirement or even pass the annual fed safety inspection required for a commercial trailer/all vehicles regardless of tire type.”

The PA inspection say… the mfg. that being the trailer mfg. as the one required to correctly placard the vehicle… there are other provisions in the law pertaining to the trailer tires condition and tread also, but I am not about to search them all out right now…

(g) Tires and Rims - The axles of a vehicle
specified under this subchapter shall be
equipped with the number and type of tires
and rims which have a load rating equal to
or higher than those offered by the
manufacturer.

If the placards are only recommendations why do they deserve to be safety recalled so often for having the wrong information on the placards…

There have been recommendations made on the forums based on claimed trailer weights only that have had nothing to do with the trailers placard weights or even the axle weights…

While I haven’t ever made the claim that the tire type must be the same and that is misquoting me, the inspection law does in fact say the same number and type and load rating equal to or higher than…

You consistently accuse myself and others of boxing the tire builders into a corner when they are asked for information only because it don’t agree with your personal positions…
One posters response
We do not recommend using light truck tires on trailers that specify ST tires. If the trailer manufacturer calls for ST tires, it is important to replace with ST tires in order to maintain the load requirement.

Thank you for choosing BFGoodrich.

Your reply
“The OP backed BFG into the liability corner with that type question. He will get the same answer from any LT or P tire maker by asking for a direct replacement for a ST tire.”
And
“If your really interested in using LT tires don't back the tire makers or their dealers into the liability corner. “

Obviously you don’t think these are big boys that know how to answer for themselves…


My e-mail reply from continental tire
Thank you for contacting Customer Relations at Continental Tire the Americas, LLC.

We no longer manufacture ST tires, and the Vanco line is not a suitable alternative.
We would recommend searching for a dedicated ST tire line.

And your reply
“You badgered Vanco with the more canned questions until they gave you the answer you were looking for”
None of these people according to you know how to answer normal questions to their help line… no badgering, no pushing… the answers just don’t back up your opinions...

If you want the answer you are looking for according to your words, be sure to softball your questions

If these companies can’t stand tall on their own feet and recommend a LT tire, no, their LT tire even one with sufficient load capacity as a replacement tire for a ST tire why should I or anyone else assume it’s the thing to do, or assume you and others are their secret information outlet…

And this coming from me someone that generally don’t like the ST tire or their specifications, or their DOT certification requirements, and have voiced this many times, and believe the LT tire is a better tire… someone that if not for the Maxxis brand having proven itself to me, would be faced with a serious personal dilemma….

Stop the nonsense already. You pretty much admit that LTs are generally a better tire...Except for the beloved Maxxis, which has availability issues....
What will you do when Maxxis lowers their standards to the same as the rest of the ST crowd.
They seem at the present time to build to a higher standard...But all corporations are under constant pressure to increase profit. You say yourself that the govt. standards for ST tires are much weaker than for LT tires... That means at any moment that Maxxis can, and one day likely WILL lower their standards in order to remain competitive.... And they will do this overnite with telling you or all the people you are trying to convince to use those tires.

Anyone that actually bothers to read the testing standards required of LT tires and then reads the standards for ST tires, will be amazed at the difference. And all this debate will be over for those that do.
The only way to be sure that a tire will meet the higher LT standards is to BUY LT tires.

There is no nonsense here… I have not generally admited the LT is a better tire… I have stated that before and have never stated any ST tire was a better tire including the Maxxis… I have said Maxxis is the best ST tire...
No one has complained about the testing and certification requirements of the ST tire more than I, including you… or the fact that Maxxis is voluntarily building well above those minimum standards, leaving me with my last choice in a ST tire since no Chinese tire of any type will ever grace my trailer… in my last post I also admitted if not for the Maxxis I would have a real dilemma… reading only what you want again…

I did actually read all the testing procedures for both the ST tires and the LT tires and have posted my interruption of the results many times…

Have you actually read them yourself or only what myself and a few others much smarter than I have posted about them… I assure you it’s not fun, interesting, or light reading….

Your and you cohorts that just profess to buy and change to LT tires are merely putting words in a post, because for the TT there just aren’t a lot of good choices for us like there are for the bigger trailers and 5ers, and when you find a tire for many more it just won’t fit under the trailer with the correct clearances…

You guys know all of this of course, and just try to display your superior wisdom because you were fortunate enough to be able to switch but lacked the wisdom to buy the trailer with them already…

Like it or not, there are both legal and liability concerns that you choose to ignore and deny even exist, but I will continue to point them out and we can continue to disagree, and that’s ok… readers need to hear all sides and make their own informed decisions on what risk they are willing to accept…

It doesn’t matter if the LT is a better tire if it isn’t made in the right size, installed on the right rim, or don’t fit under the trailer correctly…