No shots...not getting in.

[garyhaupt]

https://globalnews.ca/news/8013469/unvaccinated-tourists-canada-trudeau-covid/


Gary Haupt

[FWC]

I agree with the posters above that I don't think there is going to be a flood of people crossing the border with faked vaccination documents. But this is going to be an increasingly a requirement for travel, just like Yellow Fever vaccines are required for many parts of the world, and thus it is worthwhile to get out in front of the problem and figure out some universal way to demonstrate you are vaccinated.

The fact that there already appears to be a market for fake vaccine cards, does seem to indicate that people are planning on using them.

[RHasse]

bgum wrote:
It should be required to travel across borders or on public transportation. No one has the right to endanger the health of others. There will be those who don't get shot because of religion and that is their choice but should not be permitted to travel. Those who can't take the shot due to health also should not travel due to health.
It is all a matter of choice. And it is a personal choice.

Wow, how authoritarian of you? Is this still the Land of the Free and the Home of the Brave? Sounds more like the USSR....

[Terryallan]

bgum wrote:

Terryallan wrote:

bgum wrote:
It should be required to travel across borders or on public transportation. No one has the right to endanger the health of others. There will be those who don't get shot because of religion and that is their choice but should not be permitted to travel. Those who can't take the shot due to health also should not travel due to health.
It is all a matter of choice. And it is a personal choice.

So you are saying your vaccination didn't work? That the covid shot is useless? Because if you have had it, and it works. It doesn't matter if someone beside of you has had it or not. IF it works. You are protected. How are they endangering your health?

That you don't believe it works is the very reason most are not getting it. Why get it, if it doesn't work?

The shot is to keep the crud to a manageable level and keep you out of the hospital not to keep you from getting the crud. Be aware the crud serious or not has shown to cause serious health issues including heart and lungs.

So you are saying there is no benefit to getting the shot since it does not protect you . So tell me why any one should get it. According to you it is useless. Why subject yourself to an experimental drug if people like you say it is useless.
Me, Well I think it works, so I took it. I don't worry about those that didn't infecting me. Of course I didn't worry about them infecting me before I Took it.
And How would any one know? It is against health laws for anyone to even ask.

[RHasse]

agesilaus wrote:
The people who say that it hasn't 'been tested' puzzle me. And I'm sorry to say some are my relatives. Millions and millions of doses have been administered and as always there are some very few claimed reactions, most probably just coincidence but some may be real. We both got ours as soon as they were offered.

I think the ones who resist are math challenged and just do not understand the statistics of large numbers. Few people not technically trained do understand those numbers.

It's not "math challenged" to realize that there are plenty of possible long term effects that are unknown at this point, and can't be known for years. This is brand new technology and nobody, I repeat NOBODY knows how this will turn out. I hope for the best, but there are already many reports of harmful reactions. Are you aware there are over 6,000 deaths associated with the vaccines? And many thousands more adverse reactions. And that is probably only a few percent of the total. There are top level virologists that are saying at this point the use of the vaccines should be stopped for safety reasons. And none of this includes the unknown potential long term effects. Do yoiu know the term "Pathogenic Priming"? Maybe you should look it up. Well informed people have good reason to not get the jab, it's kind of rude to imply they are "math challenged".

[FWC]

The decision may have been made for political reasons, but it is entirely consistent with the science. The efficacy of vaccines is well understood and they are widely available. The scientific community is unanimous in recommending the vaccine. There is no question that requiring a vaccine for entry to Canada reduces the transmission of COVID into Canada.

Now if they decide to remove this requirement because it is unpopular, that would be a political decision that goes against the science. Lets hope they don't do that, but for now this decision as well as the one to reduce quarantine requirements for vaccinated Canadians seems to be quite popular.

[thomas201]

Don't spin your wheels too much on false documentation. The number of people who want to cross to Canada, and willing to falsify documents is small. Then subtract out the number that have antibodies from a very mild bout of Covid, and it shrinks to almost nothing.

Remember:"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes, a Latin phrase from the Roman treatise Satires of Juvenal, written around AD 100", you know "Who watches the watchers". A corrupt government official (how many of those around?) is all you need to enter your info into the database.

My last experience with this was over 10 years ago, a nice lady was selling CDLs with full backup (test scores, driving history, testing sign off, the whole thing) near Baltimore for $300. Even though we and other employers reported something "funny" to the state, it still took a couple of years for her to be arrested.

There is not much you can do with the leakers, but really how many will there be?

So why not allow those of us, willing to provide documentation, entry?

And if your current system is so good, how do the new variants make their way in? Just asking!!

[agesilaus]

simple thing to have a secure website

First, I don't think there is a Federal Database, maybe there are state DB. I don't know. My wife got her first jab in AZ and the second in FL so that sort of thing makes it a lot more difficult. If there was such a DB why are they talking aboutgoing door to door?

And Secondly, do you trust the feds to create a secure database? I certainly don't.

[JaxDad]

FWC wrote:
The problem I see with this, is how does the Canadian Border Service Agency, or any other foreign government access these databases?

bgum wrote:
In the US each state maintains a database containing name, date of first shot, date of second shot, name of manufacturer, and lot number.

This how the million dollar lottery has confirmed winners. The same could be used at borders to verify shot cards.

Canada, nor anyone else for that matter, needs access to the US database. It would be a simple thing to have a secure website that would generate a QR code (displayed on your smartphone, tablet, even printed out for that matter, whereby the QR code is scanned along with your passport and the system generates a ‘go / no go’ reply.

[valhalla360]

FWC wrote:
The problem I see with this, is how does the Canadian Border Service Agency, or any other foreign government access these databases?

bgum wrote:
In the US each state maintains a database containing name, date of first shot, date of second shot, name of manufacturer, and lot number.

This how the million dollar lottery has confirmed winners. The same could be used at borders to verify shot cards.

Probably just ask you to show the vaccine card.

Before you say it: Yes, some idiot could print up their own card and fake it but even among those against vaccinations, most won't take it to that level, so checking the card is 99% effective.

Keep in mind, this isn't a first case situation where they are trying to keep the virus out because they have zero cases. It's already there. These rules are only effective at slowing the spread. If they can eliminate 99% of new sources, that will be very effective at slowing the spread.

[rexlion]

This policy of Canada's is no surprise to me at all, and should not be a surprise to any observer of the way they've responded to the situation to date. I had already written off Canada in my mind as a place for me to RV or visit. Plenty to see and do there, but there's enough in the USA to keep me busy for quite a while, too.

[FWC]

The problem I see with this, is how does the Canadian Border Service Agency, or any other foreign government access these databases?

bgum wrote:
In the US each state maintains a database containing name, date of first shot, date of second shot, name of manufacturer, and lot number.

This how the million dollar lottery has confirmed winners. The same could be used at borders to verify shot cards.

[bgum]

In the US each state maintains a database containing name, date of first shot, date of second shot, name of manufacturer, and lot number.

This how the million dollar lottery has confirmed winners. The same could be used at borders to verify shot cards.

[FWC]

It seems like Canada is planning on some pretty reasonable border policy. They have already relaxed the 2-week quarantine for vaccinated Canadians returning to Canada, and requiring vaccination for non-Canadians to visit would be in line wit that.

I just hope we (as in the global community) can figure out how to effectively provide 'proof of vaccination'. There are already fake vaccination cards springing up all over the place.

[TexasShadow]

you have the freedom to choose. but that doesn't give you freedom from consequences..like being blocked from entering stores or countries, etc.
no shoes, no shirt, no shots, no service.