Tow Rig question SRW or DRW for 5th RAM

[RokNDmax]

I'm sure this has been debated millions of times, but here is a new spin.

At what weight would you consider a DRW to be mandatory whilst towing a fifth wheel ?

10k
11k
12k
13k
14k
15k
16k
17k
18k
19k
20k


or other.

For background, looking at new Ram 3500's, the SRW payload is @ 4400, and the DRW is 5600. Lots has changed in the last few years, but I realize a # is only a # and a DRW may feel more safe and secure even though the SRW isn't technically overloaded. Will be buying both a new truck and fiver in the next few months, so everything is still wide open.

PS - Could not find a good thread discussing by weight, if you know of one, feel free to post.
PSS - Sorry this has been done, feel free to ignore if you don't wish to discuss again...

Thanks !

[justme]

Me Again wrote:

justme wrote:


After experiencing both I would say that the point to consider a dually would be with a trailer at 16.5 GVW. Then I would consider a F450 or equivalent because those truck are designed to DRW with a stronger frame and suspension. People talk about stability of DRW for pulling 5th wheels, but that is mostly physiological if the SRW has an optional rear sway bar. Saying that, a 16.5GVW trailer would exceed the Combined vehicle weight by a couple of hundred pounds, but that is not a critical factor in towing--- provide the trailer has good brakes.

Sounds like you have not looked the RAM 3500 that got new frames in 2013. Ford is planning similar frame upgrades for MY 2017.

BTW the RAM 3500 SRW trucks are rated to tow 17K+ 5th wheels.

Chris

Yes I have looked at all of them. And I only mentioned the F450, but I should have said all 45 series trucks. All of the manufacturers are about the same over-all. However, Ford did not need a frame upgrade because they have always been strong ;-). However, Ford my have leap frogged the completion in 2017 with the aluminum body and engine power increases. I suspect GM and Dodge will have their years of leap-frogging, because that is what competition is all about. One can not go wrong with a Ford, Dodge or GM product.

[Me_Again]

justme wrote:


After experiencing both I would say that the point to consider a dually would be with a trailer at 16.5 GVW. Then I would consider a F450 or equivalent because those truck are designed to DRW with a stronger frame and suspension. People talk about stability of DRW for pulling 5th wheels, but that is mostly physiological if the SRW has an optional rear sway bar. Saying that, a 16.5GVW trailer would exceed the Combined vehicle weight by a couple of hundred pounds, but that is not a critical factor in towing--- provide the trailer has good brakes.

Sounds like you have not looked the RAM 3500 that got new frames in 2013. Ford is planning similar frame upgrades for MY 2017.

BTW the RAM 3500 SRW trucks are rated to tow 17K+ 5th wheels.

Chris

[justme]

RokNDmax wrote:
I'm sure this has been debated millions of times, but here is a new spin.

At what weight would you consider a DRW to be mandatory whilst towing a fifth wheel ?

10k
11k
12k
13k
14k
15k
16k
17k
18k
19k
20k


or other.

For background, looking at new Ram 3500's, the SRW payload is @ 4400, and the DRW is 5600. Lots has changed in the last few years, but I realize a # is only a # and a DRW may feel more safe and secure even though the SRW isn't technically overloaded. Will be buying both a new truck and fiver in the next few months, so everything is still wide open.

PS - Could not find a good thread discussing by weight, if you know of one, feel free to post.
PSS - Sorry this has been done, feel free to ignore if you don't wish to discuss again...

Thanks !

After experiencing both I would say that the point to consider a dually would be with a trailer at 16.5 GVW. Then I would consider a F450 or equivalent because those truck are designed to DRW with a stronger frame and suspension. People talk about stability of DRW for pulling 5th wheels, but that is mostly physiological if the SRW has an optional rear sway bar. Saying that, a 16.5GVW trailer would exceed the Combined vehicle weight by a couple of hundred pounds, but that is not a critical factor in towing--- provide the trailer has good brakes.

[blofgren]

broark01 wrote:
On the highway, has the cross wind ever blown your 5th wheel so hard sideways that the swerving motion of truck and trailer deployed your trailer steps? This happened to me driving a high profile 2013 F350 FX4 SRW on I90 through Wyoming. At that moment I was convinced of 3 things:
1) High profile SRW packages are not the answer to towing heavy high profile loads.
2) SRW is not the answer for towing high profile loads in windy conditions.
3) Strap the steps.

Yikes that must have been scary. I am on my second dually and have absolutely no regrets. Our previous trailer was a 12k lbs 30' fifth wheel and there was a noticeable difference in towing stability from the F-250 PSD that I was towing it with to the F-350 DRW. We now have a high profile 16k lbs triple slide fifth wheel and the Ram DRW handles it with ease. I will never go back to a SRW truck as long as we are towing a fifth wheel.

[alboy]

I tow a 15k fiver 3000lb pin with a 2015 gmc 3500 ,payload stickered at 3816.This truck literally toys with this load in the mountains ,very stable in high winds,13 ft high.

[Me_Again]

JIMNLIN wrote:

A 350/3500 SRW truck is a heavy truck and rear axle weights and may run in the 3000-3200 + lbs range which leaves 3800-4000 lb before exceeding its 7000-7050 RAWR = rear spring pack/tires and wheels.

Here are my weights ready to tow with Demco picture frame, B&W RVK3270 manual slider, and to boxes full of snowbird stuff! Chris

[JIMNLIN]

op wrote:
For background, looking at new Ram 3500's, the SRW payload is @ 4400, and the DRW is 5600. Lots has changed in the last few years, but I realize a # is only a # and a DRW may feel more safe and secure even though the SRW isn't technically overloaded. Will be buying both a new truck and fiver in the next few months, so everything is still wide open.

PS - Could not find a good thread discussing by weight, if you know of one, feel free to post.
PSS - Sorry this has been done, feel free to ignore if you don't wish to discuss again...

I have no recommendation SRW vs DRW truck I need or you need for a heavy trailer. Too many variables such as trailer axle spacing and location/number of axles/actual hitch loads/etc.

However just a heads up on looking at GVWR based payloads on the tire placard sticker or in the truck makers spec websites.

And in particular 4400-4500 lbs payloads I see on Ford/Ram and GM SRW spec websites.
A 350/3500 SRW truck is a heavy truck and rear axle weights and may run in the 3000-3200 + lbs range which leaves 3800-4000 lb before exceeding its 7000-7050 RAWR = rear spring pack/tires and wheels.

[mtofell1]

I'm still with kids and just got into a mid-sized 5th wheel that fits with my 2500 6.4 Hemi. Once the kids are grown and it's more often just the DW and I, it's either a diesel pusher or a 5th wheel. With the 5th wheel route I have no interest in a DRW and I'm currently thinking of loaded/wet weight of no more than 15K.

I absolutely believe all the reports of the DRW being more stable. I would just rather downsize my 5th to fit a SRW than deal with the DRW as a vehicle w/o the 5th attached. It's a personal choice and we are all entitled to our opinions.

The way I look at it (wet/loaded weights):

Gas SRW up to 11K or so
SRW diesel up to 15K
DRW diesel 15K+

[broark01]

On the highway, has the cross wind ever blown your 5th wheel so hard sideways that the swerving motion of truck and trailer deployed your trailer steps? This happened to me driving a high profile 2013 F350 FX4 SRW on I90 through Wyoming. At that moment I was convinced of 3 things:
1) High profile SRW packages are not the answer to towing heavy high profile loads.
2) SRW is not the answer for towing high profile loads in windy conditions.
3) Strap the steps.

[dapperdan]

When we decided it's time to buy a fifth wheel I looked into what truck I wanted before hand. I'm partial to duallies being I was a truck driver. That being said get PLENTY of truck, you can't have too much truck IMHO. Then just about any trailer you decide will be no problem to tow or stop.

My 2015 rides REALLY nice but like mentioned above it's not the easiest to park but when I hook up to our Suites I'm totally at ease 'cause I know I have plenty of truck for the task. :B

Dan

[rhagfo]

Coach-man wrote:
To the OP, would the TV be your only driver? If that will be a daily driver, parking an maneuvering is a big issue, and can not or should not be ignored. With proper tires, you should be good to go up to 13K - 14K for your rig. However you will be at max in that range! You state you will buy both rig and TV, why not settle on your rig first, then determine what you would need to haul it with? If you buy the TV first you may limit your options!

Only as big an issue as you care to make it.:S
I have a quad cab long bed, not too many places I can't put it. No it will not fit in the same spot as a Smart Car, but it will also tow a lot more.

[cummins2014]

up2nogood wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Bobandshawn wrote:
One issue, which I consider a big issue, with the Ram trucks is the only gear ratio available unless you get the DRW option is 3.42. I know that diesel is a torque monster, but 3.42?
I really wanted a Mega Cab DRW rig but the price and difficulties living with it when I don't tow that much just wasn't in the cards. I ended up with a 2500 Mega Cab short bed with the 6.4 Hemi and 4.10 gears. $45K sticker ($10K off) and fully loaded. I have the air suspension which I probably would of never ordered, but now that I have it I really like it. I still just have a pull trailer with a hitch weight of about 850 lbs. Drop the hitch on the ball and the truck makes some RD D2 noises and boom-it raises right back up. My payload on the 6.4 is about 2900 lbs and tow weight is 15.5K lbs so I'll be looking at a 12-12.5 max weight rig with a dry hitch weight of 1700-1800 lbs.

The difference is the TQ of the Cummins. Most reviews of guys towing upwards of 8-9000lbs with the 6.4 and even 4.10 gears complain about the 1-2 spacing when in certain situations. It won't shift up to 3rd and if it does it bogs when under certain speeds. Never hear that with guys towing 9,10,11,12,000lbs or more and 3.42s with the Cummins. Same tranny too.

As to the OP get the DRW if you're pushing 3000lb on the pin. That doesn't leave much left for passengers or other gear in the truck. If you can handle the up cost of the DRW and the driving then get the DRW. Never heard anyone complain when towing with a DRW.

None of that stuff going on with the Cummins and 3:42 whatever it needs to do it shifts and does it. A lot of false thinking about the 3:42 gears and the 6.7 Cummins.

To actually answer the OP, with my setup ,and being a 3500 SRW diesel. I wouldn't want to be much more then where I am now , just over 13K .

[cummins2014]

goducks10 wrote:

Bobandshawn wrote:
One issue, which I consider a big issue, with the Ram trucks is the only gear ratio available unless you get the DRW option is 3.42. I know that diesel is a torque monster, but 3.42?
I really wanted a Mega Cab DRW rig but the price and difficulties living with it when I don't tow that much just wasn't in the cards. I ended up with a 2500 Mega Cab short bed with the 6.4 Hemi and 4.10 gears. $45K sticker ($10K off) and fully loaded. I have the air suspension which I probably would of never ordered, but now that I have it I really like it. I still just have a pull trailer with a hitch weight of about 850 lbs. Drop the hitch on the ball and the truck makes some RD D2 noises and boom-it raises right back up. My payload on the 6.4 is about 2900 lbs and tow weight is 15.5K lbs so I'll be looking at a 12-12.5 max weight rig with a dry hitch weight of 1700-1800 lbs.

The difference is the TQ of the Cummins. Most reviews of guys towing upwards of 8-9000lbs with the 6.4 and even 4.10 gears complain about the 1-2 spacing when in certain situations. It won't shift up to 3rd and if it does it bogs when under certain speeds. Never hear that with guys towing 9,10,11,12,000lbs or more and 3.42s with the Cummins. Same tranny too.

As to the OP get the DRW if you're pushing 3000lb on the pin. That doesn't leave much left for passengers or other gear in the truck. If you can handle the up cost of the DRW and the driving then get the DRW. Never heard anyone complain when towing with a DRW.

None of that stuff going on with the Cummins and 3:42 whatever it needs to do it shifts and does it. A lot of false thinking about the 3:42 gears and the 6.7 Cummins.

[Coach-man]

To the OP, would the TV be your only driver? If that will be a daily driver, parking an maneuvering is a big issue, and can not or should not be ignored. With proper tires, you should be good to go up to 13K - 14K for your rig. However you will be at max in that range! You state you will buy both rig and TV, why not settle on your rig first, then determine what you would need to haul it with? If you buy the TV first you may limit your options!

[bfast54]

I'm on my second Dually--- biggest reason for me is--- stability ,and If you have a tire issue --you already have the spare tire mounted..(on the truck ):W