Towing a TH / Truck choice

[lmcracing]

Hello!

I have some questions about towing these large toy haulers and truck choice. The TH category seems to have gotten super heavy and jumped to crazy lengths so I am trying to do my homework before purchasing. I see the towing topic alot on older threads but since my truck is newer I will ask it again and hopefully get some feedback.

This is my first post and first RV/TH purchase so forgive my ignorance on the topic, but it is also the reason I am here.

I am looking to purchase a new/newer toy hauler 5th wheel this year, my truck is a 2014 Ram 2500 Crew Cab Laramie 4x4 with the Cummins and an Auto. The dodge site says I can tow 17100 but I wanted to get input from others before jumping into something that size.

I am trying to keep the weight down due to the SRWs but I am also trying to get something with garage space for my toys (14'+). I attended the camping/RV show last week and found the new Carbon 387 which seemed to fit the bill and is much lighter than the competition (13287 dry weight and 19000 GVWR). I am not sure that I would ever reach that GVWR, not sure how I would.. My guess would be 15-16,000 loaded. Is this something I can safely do?? I know those weights are within my limits, but want input from those who have been there.

My truck is my daily driver and a dually is not a preferred option for my daily activities and parking restrictions. I do plan to add the Firestone airbags which will add some stability I assume but doesn't replace the stability of 4 rear tires... Adding another vehicle purchase also greatly reduces the wife approval factor.. haha!

Obviously safety is my paramount concern I am certain I will get some various opinions but I would rather ask than be "that guy" because the safety of others is also important to me. The only input thus far is from my original truck sales guy and salesmen at the RV dealer which all say "Oh yeah! That truck can do that easy!"

[lincster]

kofire wrote:

lincster wrote:

kofire wrote:

lincster wrote:

kofire wrote:
I tow a 38' weekend warrior with a large slide. I have an F250 with airbags. It tows great. I am completely legal and I am actually planning on going bigger.

I never stated anything about legal, I said "within tow ratings of the truck".

I would like to see a CAT scale ticket and then the year of your truck before I judge. 🙂

There's one on glamisdunes.com. 2008 ww led3505. 06 f250. Lifted 8" on 37" tires.
I'm under all legal ratings. That's all that matters to me. If there was an issue with people exceeding their manafacturers rated sticker there would be a law prohibiting it. We have laws for everything in this country. If you have proof of somebody recreational towing and being sued for something in a civil lawsuit please post it up here. I'd love to read it.
You can literally find anything on the internet. I've yet to find a factual story about this issue. I could literally being involved in a civil suit with all kinds of things, heck we probably shouldn't ever have anybody over to the house because we might get sued.

Like I said, I am not talking "legal" stuff.

Although I'm not sure what you mean by "legal ratings".
What ratings are those?

Again, post up a CAT scale ticket with your year truck and then lets talk.

How do you post pics? I've got some with a slightly different truck but should be the same. Rear axle unloaded trailer 6460. Rear axle Trailer loaded 7240
I have a sterling 10.5 rear axle. It is rated for 9750 by the manfacturer. I have toyo mud terrains rated at 3800 a piece. By legal I'm referring to staying under axle, tire ratings. Those are legally enforceable per the CVC.
I'd like to hear your argument why I'm unsafe or should not be towing my trailer with my current truck.

What year is your truck?

You need to re read what I have stated, I never stated anything about not being safe, I said I would base my response after I see real weights and I know what year your truck is.
Year of truck affects what your GVWR and GCWR are.

Your numbers and descriptions you stated above don't make any sense.

Rear axle unloaded trailer 6460. Rear axle Trailer loaded 7240


Does this mean your rear axle on your truck and the difference is when you have your trailer hooked up and when you don't?

That means you have 780lbs of pin weight? Impossible.

[lawnspecialties]

I've been all over the board on this one. I've been overweight on the pin and had to change trucks. I've towed with duallys and SRWs. There are some who are so obvious overweight, its silly. Then there are those who insist a triple axle fiver must be hauled with a road tractor.

I've seen some obvious, crazy set ups at campgrounds. The older F150 pulling the triple axle Raptor at Willow Tree will always be etched in my memory.

But one thing keeps coming to mind. With all these overweight set-ups, how often do we really hear about a crash or truck failure because the set-up had exceeded the limits of the truck? I for one have never heard of such an event, although I'm sure somewhere it has happened.

[tinner12002]

N-Trouble wrote:
About your only option to keep weight reasonable with 14+ ft of cargo is to NOT purchase a separate garage model but a combined garage/living. My 5er weighs 9Klbs dry and has 16.5ft of cargo space a small slideout in living area and tows beautifully with my 3/4 ton Duramax. I wanted nothing to do with pulling a land yacht so didn't even bother looking at separate garage models.

I agree on not getting the separate garage, You might look at something like the Forest River Sandstorm 5th wheel model #F335GSLR, not sure of that particular model as far as quality but just an example of layout and weight. 16ft open garage, GVWR #15000, hitch #2362, CCC #5077, UVW #9922 and 36ft long.

[Y-Guy]

kofire wrote:
How do you post pics?

New! Easy Photo Upload & Posting Web App! (thanks to Moderator 1492)

A fast and easy way to post a photo in a forum post. Just drag-n-drop a photo, and receive a copy-n-paste image link for your forum post. Uploads directly to IMGUR.com servers. Resizes photos to the max recommended by the Open Roads Forum. Includes a thumbnail preview, and also provides an optional link to permanently delete the photo. A shortcut to the web app is available at bit.ly/photo-upload.

If you need more help with posting photos please visit the RV.Net Tutorials and Picture related FAQ's

[crazybanshee]

Hey Lincster you keep getting sucked up into these threads. It must amuse you. I just try and stay away from these people on the roads.:S

[kofire]

lincster wrote:

kofire wrote:

lincster wrote:

kofire wrote:
I tow a 38' weekend warrior with a large slide. I have an F250 with airbags. It tows great. I am completely legal and I am actually planning on going bigger.

I never stated anything about legal, I said "within tow ratings of the truck".

I would like to see a CAT scale ticket and then the year of your truck before I judge. 🙂

There's one on glamisdunes.com. 2008 ww led3505. 06 f250. Lifted 8" on 37" tires.
I'm under all legal ratings. That's all that matters to me. If there was an issue with people exceeding their manafacturers rated sticker there would be a law prohibiting it. We have laws for everything in this country. If you have proof of somebody recreational towing and being sued for something in a civil lawsuit please post it up here. I'd love to read it.
You can literally find anything on the internet. I've yet to find a factual story about this issue. I could literally being involved in a civil suit with all kinds of things, heck we probably shouldn't ever have anybody over to the house because we might get sued.

Like I said, I am not talking "legal" stuff.

Although I'm not sure what you mean by "legal ratings".
What ratings are those?

Again, post up a CAT scale ticket with your year truck and then lets talk.

How do you post pics? I've got some with a slightly different truck but should be the same. Rear axle unloaded trailer 6460. Rear axle Trailer loaded 7240
I have a sterling 10.5 rear axle. It is rated for 9750 by the manfacturer. I have toyo mud terrains rated at 3800 a piece. By legal I'm referring to staying under axle, tire ratings. Those are legally enforceable per the CVC.
I'd like to hear your argument why I'm unsafe or should not be towing my trailer with my current truck.

[Bedlam]

Expect 20-25% of the FW GVWR to be on the pin. This amount of payload on a SRW truck once you have your family loaded in the cab will most likely exceed your truck's GVWR before it exceeds the GCWR.

You may also find the your RAWR may be exceeded. There are ways around this since the axle and frame have a higher rating in the SRW than what is posted. Going with higher rated springs and 19.5" wheels can allow you more payload.

I carried a truck camper on the back of my F250 that resulted in a 7000 lb RAW. Once I hitched up my enclosed trailer, I was closer to 8000 lbs RAW. Going with suspension modifications, 4500 lb rated rims and 4805 lb rated tires, I was able to confidently and safely drag this 19K lb GCW combination around easily across the western mountains and half way across the country.

I would still be using this setup if I was not planning on a truck camper 1.5x the weight of my current one. With the exception of some Canadian provinces, the listed ratings on your truck door opening are warranty limitations. In many states you register your truck for the GVWR you want and the only legal restrictions are your wheel, road bed and stopping limits.

Only you have to decide whether you will scale back your FW purchase, upgrade your current truck or replace your current truck.

[lincster]

kofire wrote:

lincster wrote:

kofire wrote:
I tow a 38' weekend warrior with a large slide. I have an F250 with airbags. It tows great. I am completely legal and I am actually planning on going bigger.

I never stated anything about legal, I said "within tow ratings of the truck".

I would like to see a CAT scale ticket and then the year of your truck before I judge. 🙂

There's one on glamisdunes.com. 2008 ww led3505. 06 f250. Lifted 8" on 37" tires.
I'm under all legal ratings. That's all that matters to me. If there was an issue with people exceeding their manafacturers rated sticker there would be a law prohibiting it. We have laws for everything in this country. If you have proof of somebody recreational towing and being sued for something in a civil lawsuit please post it up here. I'd love to read it.
You can literally find anything on the internet. I've yet to find a factual story about this issue. I could literally being involved in a civil suit with all kinds of things, heck we probably shouldn't ever have anybody over to the house because we might get sued.

Like I said, I am not talking "legal" stuff.

Although I'm not sure what you mean by "legal ratings".
What ratings are those?

Again, post up a CAT scale ticket with your year truck and then lets talk.

[kofire]

lincster wrote:

kofire wrote:
I tow a 38' weekend warrior with a large slide. I have an F250 with airbags. It tows great. I am completely legal and I am actually planning on going bigger.

I never stated anything about legal, I said "within tow ratings of the truck".

I would like to see a CAT scale ticket and then the year of your truck before I judge. 🙂

There's one on glamisdunes.com. 2008 ww led3505. 06 f250. Lifted 8" on 37" tires.
I'm under all legal ratings. That's all that matters to me. If there was an issue with people exceeding their manafacturers rated sticker there would be a law prohibiting it. We have laws for everything in this country. If you have proof of somebody recreational towing and being sued for something in a civil lawsuit please post it up here. I'd love to read it.
You can literally find anything on the internet. I've yet to find a factual story about this issue. I could literally being involved in a civil suit with all kinds of things, heck we probably shouldn't ever have anybody over to the house because we might get sued.

[time_to_go_now]

Listen to Lincster.

Far, Far, FAR too many people tow monster trailers with an undersized truck. Myself included, on occasion. Most of the time, my TH is towed by my motorhome. But, occasionally, I tow it with my Nissan Titan using a Trailer Toad as a hitch. The Trailer Toad removes the tongue weight from the Nissan. So, the Nissan only has to pull and STOP the trailer. Not support the weight. And, it is too much trailer for the Nissan to STOP. And everytime I do it, I swear it will be the last time. It is just not fun.

I am completely legal. But it is not fun.

Do NOT push the limits of the tow vehicle. Either buy a smaller trailer or get a larger tow vehicle.

JMHO.

[lincster]

kofire wrote:
I tow a 38' weekend warrior with a large slide. I have an F250 with airbags. It tows great. I am completely legal and I am actually planning on going bigger.

I never stated anything about legal, I said "within tow ratings of the truck".

I would like to see a CAT scale ticket and then the year of your truck before I judge. 🙂

[kofire]

I tow a 38' weekend warrior with a large slide. I have an F250 with airbags. It tows great. I am completely legal and I am actually planning on going bigger.

[lincster]

With 3500lbs of pin weight, no way can a SRW of anything tow that and stay within the trucks ratings.

It isn't all about what a truck can tow, it is also about what a truck can HAUL. 2 different things.

Anything over 35' needs a DRW to we within the tow ratings of the truck.

Can a 2500/F250 do it? Sure.
Do you see lots and lots of people do it? Sure.
Does it make it right? Nope.

If you are one of those folks looking for someone to say "I've been towing a 41' Hauler with 3 slides for years with my F250 and airbags, I don't have any issues." Then you will get plenty of folks saying you will be ok.

If you want to actually talk weights and reality, that is a different story.

If you want to talk reality, let me know and I can post up some CAT scale tickets of my setup and you can judge for your self.

[N-Trouble]

lmcracing wrote:
So, would upgrading to the 1 ton truck in a SRW make any difference? I dont see much change in the ratings?

You get an extra leaf spring and door sticker with increased payload numbers but that is about it. You don't get the added stability or safety (extra tires) that comes with a dually.

Many try to turn their 3/4 ton into SRW 1 ton by going to higher capacity wheels/tires and adding air bags or Timbrens. Axles, brakes, etc are all the same between 3/4 and 1 ton. "Legally" they are still overweight however as the door sticker does not change.

[arhayes]

I'd strongly suggest that you get the towing guides from the manufacturer(s) you are interested in and use that as your guide to what you need. That way you know exactly what the manufacturer ,states the rig can handle. There MAY be an SRW out there that works.

You also need to make sure that you really do have a 3600 lb pin weight. We full time, and ours is supposedly around there, but the way we are loaded, my actually pin weight is 4200 lbs, thought we are still under the 19,500 gross for the trailer. We full time in our TH so YMMV.