5 figure 30 foot

[davelinde]

A while back DW told me she wanted a Class C so I checked into that forum to get advice and learned loads about chassis options, engines, pros and cons etc.

We just got back from the Tampa RV show and went through the various C's and nothing seemed to strike our fancy. Our favorites were some of the options on a Sprinter chassis (I mostly liked a diesel)... but for what we intend to do there was not enough storage, they were set up with almost no carry capacity, and they were not really affordable. To set some context - we paid $70K for an HDT with a 40' toy hauler as our last rig. It was really a dream rig for what we did back then. We are OK to downsize now that we have no kids in the mix... but to pay a lot more and be scrimping on every pound of cargo seems wrong.

Our intention is to have a rig for extended stays (we've live in an RV for up to 6 months with kids) as well as long trips (we'd like to do a circuit of the continental US one day).

Now that a Class C seems out - are we off base to think we can get into a capable Class A in any 5 figure price range and maybe under 30'? We went through several shorter floor plans with a V10 gas engine and 2 slides and there were a few that seemed quite livable. The "show prices" on several rigs we liked were under $90K (a few a lot under).

I've never really looked seriously at a Class A before, in part because I hesitate to spend over 6 figures on a depreciating asset. However, if DW is behind this and I can get my homework done - this could be a plan.

All my previous RV have been diesel but I guess I could be OK with a V10 gas. The rigs we saw had 80 gallon tanks so even with gas fuel efficiency the range was ok. I'm OK driving anything but DW is hesitant. I got her to drive the 34' fifthwheel setup but she refused to attempt the hauler behind the HDT. I need her to be able to take turns driving and I do think that if she could do the 3/4 ton diesel towing she can step up to a motorhome? In fact, sitting in a few class A vs sitting under the doghouse of some class C made her think she might prefer the sight lines of the A vs a C?

Finally, I just cannot see us doing a 2 (or 4 or 6) month trip with an 800# cargo capacity. We can pack light.... but not that light. I have not yet checked all the numbers on the short A's with a V10 but I am assuming we are OK to tow a small car and carry a ton of stuff and go across the country?

What wisdom can this group offer? What questions should I be asking. What issues do I face with a less expensive and short A?

[davelinde]

As my pondering continues, it does seem like a used Fleetwood Flair or Winnie Vista might be our choice. The biggest concern I have at this point is cargo. I'm wondering if I can mitigate that by keeping some of the bulky and weighty item in a car I can tow, eg golf clubs, tools, maybe a bike rack on the car.

I am trying to apply what I know about the fifthwheels we had to motorhomes an I don't know what I don't know here. What, if any, are factors unique to Class A that I should be thinking about?

[davelinde]

Racklefratz wrote:

davelinde wrote:
I'm wondering what I could assume for depreciation and cost of re-sale.

When I buy an RV, I know it will depreciate, and do so much more quickly than most other vehicles.

I think you missed my point. We are looking to buy 3 years out. I know what those rigs cost now, new. I am trying to guestimate what they will cost for me to buy in 3 year, used. To be honest I see the retail re-sale prices of used rigs mapping to a "depreciation" from the new list price. But in addition to knowing that new rigs depreciate... I also know that new rigs should not be purchased at list price.

[pearsonrj]

I use to have a 34’ Winnebago Chieftain, and I was surprised how little basement storage there is on our 28’ Class A. On the plus side it prevents you from lugging around a bunch of stuff you rarely or never use; but reinforces the fact that these shorter rigs are not for full-timing without serious compromises.

[Racklefratz]

davelinde wrote:
I'm wondering what I could assume for depreciation and cost of re-sale.

When I buy an RV, I know it will depreciate, and do so much more quickly than most other vehicles. But the dirty little secret is, most of us don't buy our RVs worrying about how much they'll depreciate - we buy them because we have the means, and because we WANT one. It's not an "investment".

[davelinde]

way2roll wrote:
Could you full time in them? Maybe, but you couldn't carry much and towing would need to be seriously calculated. ... things you won't find on a sub 30' coach. Almost a moot point anyway as you mentioned you aren't buying for 2-3 years. A world of things will likely happen in the RV world between now and then.

It's fun going over the what-if... We are not actually planning for being full-time but more along the lines of extended-time trips. Still I need storage... this morning I was airing tires on DW car and remembered that without the tap on the air brakes I had in the last rig I'd want a portable compressor that didn't take all day per tire. Folding chairs and tables are light but take up space. I could go on. I need some kind of storage.

Maybe someone will introduce a new product idea before we buy, but since we are leaning towards used this time the options are likely all on the table today.

The other day I'd almost gone all in on the "must be less than 30' to get access to where DW wants to camp"... but now I'm wondering again about a short DP.

[DFord]

davelinde wrote:

DFord wrote:
Dave, have you done anything with my suggestion to look at the Treks I gave you links for earlier? These are 29-1/2 feet long, high end coachs

I followed the link you gave me as soon as I saw it - THANKS!

I got a bit distracted though since we are still a couple years from buying and our plan was to look at what is out new now so we can be looking for those rigs used in two years. With this product out of production it's less clear we will want something that old when the time comes. Though I guess I should not rule it out. Thanks for the reminder.

Dave, once you take the time to do a walk through of either of these Treks and compare the features and quality of them to whats available new today, you may end up disappointed you passed on them. By all means, take the time to have a look at one before continuing your search.

Here's a sales brochure on the 2005 Treks:
http://www.nwtfc.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/2005-safari-trek-brochure.pdf

[way2roll]

pearsonrj wrote:
We bought our 2020 Holiday Rambler Admiral 28A a few months ago; equivalent to the Fleetwood Flair 28A. The 28A and 29M floorplans appealed to us for the exact reasons the OP mentioned. Easier to drive for the DW, less rear overhang, easier to find sites in State and National Parks, and comfortable for short trips for the 2 of us soon-to-be-empty-nesters.

The OCCC on ours is a paltry 1,200 lbs. Built on a 16,000 lbs F53 chassis; the 18K chassis would have been preferable but would have (of course) increased the price.

I figure we'll just make sure we only take what we need on each trip, rather than filling it with 'just in case' and seasonal stuff that just adds weight. Not much basement storage anyway in the 28A.
We did not buy it with the intention of full-timing; weekends away and the occasional week here and there. The towing capacity is massive (7,000 lbs) so a loaded toad will be easy.

Good points all said more articulately than I was trying to say in an earlier post. Small 30' Class A's and under are great. They are nimble, easy to handle, no limits on campsites etc. But everything is a concession - not much storage, low CCC, etc. I've owned 2 and loved them. Could you full time in them? Maybe, but you couldn't carry much and towing would need to be seriously calculated. After owning the 2 I had, I am looking for 35' plus to full time in. More room, more slides, raised rail for basement storage, washer dryer, 22.5 wheels, better quality, etc. All things you won't find on a sub 30' coach. Almost a moot point anyway as you mentioned you aren't buying for 2-3 years. A world of things will likely happen in the RV world between now and then.

[pearsonrj]

We bought our 2020 Holiday Rambler Admiral 28A a few months ago; equivalent to the Fleetwood Flair 28A. The 28A and 29M floorplans appealed to us for the exact reasons the OP mentioned. Easier to drive for the DW, less rear overhang, easier to find sites in State and National Parks, and comfortable for short trips for the 2 of us soon-to-be-empty-nesters.

The OCCC on ours is a paltry 1,200 lbs. Built on a 16,000 lbs F53 chassis; the 18K chassis would have been preferable but would have (of course) increased the price.

I figure we'll just make sure we only take what we need on each trip, rather than filling it with 'just in case' and seasonal stuff that just adds weight. Not much basement storage anyway in the 28A.
We did not buy it with the intention of full-timing; weekends away and the occasional week here and there. The towing capacity is massive (7,000 lbs) so a loaded toad will be easy.

[davelinde]

DFord wrote:
Dave, have you done anything with my suggestion to look at the Treks I gave you links for earlier? These are 29-1/2 feet long, high end coachs

I followed the link you gave me as soon as I saw it - THANKS!

I got a bit distracted though since we are still a couple years from buying and our plan was to look at what is out new now so we can be looking for those rigs used in two years. With this product out of production it's less clear we will want something that old when the time comes. Though I guess I should not rule it out. Thanks for the reminder.

[DFord]

Dave, have you done anything with my suggestion to look at the Treks I gave you links for earlier? These are 29-1/2 feet long, high end coachs with corian counter tops and real wood cabinets. Huge bathrooms, full body paint. 4 coach batteries with inverter and pass through storage compartments. These are not comparable to the under $100k units you've seen before. While they're orphans, they've got a great support group going for them with answers to just about anything you run across. At least take the time to look at the pictures in the ads and see what you think.

[davelinde]

way2roll wrote:
As far as campsites, you'd be hard pressed to find a place you couldn't camp with a 35 footer.

Part of the plan is to see a lot of the National Parks. I'm getting some confirms that some NP won't accommodate 30'+ - though that opinion is mixed. One of the sales guys at the show made a big deal about how there might be fewer sites but almost all parks had some longer sites. Not sure if that is true or not - but a by-stander to that conversation said that some parks are such a hot commodity that being limited to some sites means you likely will never get a site there...

[way2roll]

davelinde wrote:

way2roll wrote:

the smallest DP's I know of are the Tiffin Allegro breeze (come in 31 and 33')

We had not wandered to the Tiffins because I assumed they were well out of our price target. Looking at them on line though they do look nice...

Now I'm wondering what I could assume for depreciation and cost of re-sale. Skimming listings I don't see these falling under 100K until they are about 7 years old? I see new MSRP around a 1/4mil (not happening). DW has a 60K number in her head and I'm thinking 90(ish)

Tiffin's are nice. Good quality though. I'd actually put Tiffin over Newmar, especially given that Winnie owns Newmar now. My guess is that if you want to stay in the $60-90k range and of newer than 10 years and 30' - ish, your can definitely narrow it to a gasser. Good news is I think most manufacturers have a small Class A and have since 2013-2015 ish. Thor started the whole 30' Class A with the ACE around 2012, all of them quickly followed suit once they saw how many Thor sold. Heck the FR3 was a direct ripoff from the floor plan to the drop down bunk to the grill, exactly the same as the ACE.

Another note, a 35' MH isn't much different driving than a 30'. Actually the bigger one probably handles better. Smaller MH's have short wheel bases and a lot of unsprung weight. You have cameras and a spotter to help with backing etc, mind the turn radius. But driving down the road, won't make any difference, except probably a better ride. As far as campsites, you'd be hard pressed to find a place you couldn't camp with a 35 footer.

[davelinde]

way2roll wrote:

the smallest DP's I know of are the Tiffin Allegro breeze (come in 31 and 33')

We had not wandered to the Tiffins because I assumed they were well out of our price target. Looking at them on line though they do look nice...

Now I'm wondering what I could assume for depreciation and cost of re-sale. Skimming listings I don't see these falling under 100K until they are about 7 years old? I see new MSRP around a 1/4mil (not happening). DW has a 60K number in her head and I'm thinking 90(ish)

[way2roll]

davelinde wrote:
Thanks for the opinions and insights.

DW has a 30' number in mind both because she thinks shorter is easier to drive and because she heard 30' is a common max length in some parts of the US. Actually along the NorthEast our jumbo length rig (HDT with triple axle hauler) always found a spot for rent. The only time length ever hurt us was trying to back into a driveway on a narrow residential road with soft shoulders, ditches and two brick mailboxes in very bad places...

We kind of stumbled into the lower cost gas motorhomes vs a DP because all the DP were longer than DW liked. I'm wondering what the shortest DP might be and if that is a better option.

PS, angler - HDT are not cheap to maintain.

the smallest DP's I know of are the Tiffin Allegro breeze (come in 31 and 33') And the Fleetwood excursion in 33'. The excursion is no longer in production.