batwing replacement

[lemjim]

Has anyone switchout there bat wing antanna with the King HDTV replacment head ? if so how did it come out.

Thanks, Jim

[rgatijnet1]

Boy, you guys really got me. :B I guess I cannot depend on what is working, even tho I can see it right before my own eyes. As I said, I get the three main network channels, wherever I am parked. Maybe I am missing some channels, but I don't speak Spanish, not interested in children's programing, and some of the other garbage channels out there, so to me it is irrelevant. I never said anything about repeaters other than to say I did not care why my Jack antenna picked up a Salt Lake City channel in Moab, UT. That was jorbill2or stating that I must be receiving a repeater transmission. I mentioned I could care less since I was interested in watching the channel and didn't care how or why with my Jack antenna.

Maybe you should examine what other actual users have to say about their RV antennas. Of course they are not "experts", they are only people like me that bought, installed, and use their antenna. There are so few Rayzar antennas out there that I could not find a place that had a significant amount of reviews to compare.

King Jack: 165 reviews with 91 FIVE(highest) star rating and 21 ONE(lowest) star rating for an overall 3.9 rating King Jack antenna

Winegard Wingman: 162 reviews with 70 FIVE(highest) star ratings and 30 ONE(lowest) star ratings for an overall 3.6 rating. Wingman Antenna

JCVJeff I have just given you the reviews from 327 users that have taken the time to write various reviews of the products. Some like them, and some do not. The Jack got a higher rating from actual users, but not by much. Perhaps they did not read your report, or like me, they were more interested in results rather than rhetoric. I'm sure you are well qualified to write a report, but it appears that some people just didn't read your report and they were still happy with their antenna choice. I guessing that you are a HAM operator and just love to talk about antennas and test equipment with other HAMs. Me, I just watch TV.
Now if anyone wants to learn anything from this thread, perhaps now they can read the reviews of the 327 "users" and make up their own mind.

[Dutch_12078]

rgatijnet1 wrote:
As I sit in my coach, watching a crystal clear picture on my TV with my Jack antenna up in the air, I care little about anyone's tests, no matter how knowledgeable the tester is. If I am receiving a crystal clear picture because of a repeater, so what? WE typically put 15,000 miles a year on our coach in the West and the East, stay in small towns and large, and I cannot remember the last time I was unable to pick up the network channels with my Jack antenna at any location. My own personal experience in my coach trumps any test by anyone. :B

Only for you, not necessarily for anyone else trying to learn something from this thread... :W

[SCVJeff]

rgatijnet1 wrote:
As I sit in my coach, watching a crystal clear picture on my TV with my Jack antenna up in the air, I care little about anyone's tests, no matter how knowledgeable the tester is. If I am receiving a crystal clear picture because of a repeater, so what? WE typically put 15,000 miles a year on our coach in the West and the East, stay in small towns and large, and I cannot remember the last time I was unable to pick up the network channels with my Jack antenna at any location. My own personal experience in my coach trumps any test by anyone. :B

BTW- it's again clear you are misinformed.. There are no HD "repeaters" anywhere. Just because you sit there claiming that you get all the channels you want doesn't mean that there are aren't plenty more available, or your system is broken and you don't even know it. As the author of that antenna report I'll be happy to debate the results all you want, but you better come up with more evidence than how much you drive. We don't care, we're looking for antenna performance, and the numbers simply don't lie.

[SCVJeff]

rgatijnet1 wrote:

Dutch_12078 wrote:

rgatijnet1 wrote:

Bill.Satellite wrote:
If your existing Winegard antenna is working, the Jack is going to be a downgrade. Many stories of people replacing non-working or very old Winegard antennas with Jack's a getting great results. Well, of course they are!
If you stay in close to town then the Jack will perform very well, it is a good antenna. However, it will not bring in NBC in Las Vegas as they are still broadcasting NBC 3 on VHF channel 2. The Rayzar Air will also not receive these channels. The Sensar's long arms are required to receive channels 2-6 and there are still multiple markets that use channels 2-6.
If you do a search Batwing vs. Jack (or similar) you should be able to find the comparison done by JVCJeff (JCV?). It is an excellent report.

Way too many variables for you to make such a blanket statement. Our last time in Moab, Utah, we were able to use our Jack antenna and pick up 26 channels with some being as far away as Salt Lake City, Utah. This was with a range, in the mountains, of over 120 miles. Over flat land out west, our range has been greater.
There have been very very few instances where we could not pick up all three of the network channels, no matter where we are parked.

How many low-VHF channels (broadcast, not virtual) have you picked up at that distance? There are still 300 plus stations broadcasting on the low-VHF (2-6) channels in the US.

Who cares? That number of 2-6 channels is getting smaller every day as the stations upgrade. I'm more interested in the future than the past.

Speaking of untrue blanket statements. You are incorrect that stations are still on the move, especially to UHF, even the Winegard rep that shows up here (NOT Bill) says that , and he too in incorrect. I suggest you look at the upcoming repacking auction rules too. You will find that there is actually incentive for stations that don't sell out to move BACK to VHF.

Do a little homework. Everything Bill says is dead-on

[wa8yxm]

I would not replace my batwing with the Jack but you unhook coax from Batwing, remove two pins, remove head, replace with new head, replace pins, re-connect coax (NOTE: might as well replace exposed coax (roof cable) while at it. if it takes 10 minutes you are dogging it.

Bartwing, with wingman = best range (Distance to transmitter)
Jack: Wider field of vision (Better if closer to tower)

I have only one CG I stay at where that would help.

[wildtoad]

IAMICHABOD wrote:
If you are talking about the JACK antenna, I changed out mine to it and got very good results.
I put one on my RV for 2 reasons, the bat wing was only marginal and the addition of the Wing Man was not an option because of it's size, it would not clear my A/C on the roof. Where the Jack would.

I have had great luck with it and compared it with others in our camping group that had the BatMan, when out together and got as good or better reception as they did.

I found a new one that is not much bigger and fits in the same space.

It is The Rayzar
][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/TgLwTbbl.jpg" height=220>

In a non scientific test I was able to get 20 more channels from it when doing a scan on my TV. One nice thing about it is, its Bi-Directional and gets larger field of coverage than the Jack.
On a recent outing I found that it outperformed the Jack at the same place that I had camped at before.

After I bought it and used it a while, I found a discussion Here on the NET about it.

Same situation. Batwing -> Jack -> Rayzar.

[rgatijnet1]

As I sit in my coach, watching a crystal clear picture on my TV with my Jack antenna up in the air, I care little about anyone's tests, no matter how knowledgeable the tester is. If I am receiving a crystal clear picture because of a repeater, so what? WE typically put 15,000 miles a year on our coach in the West and the East, stay in small towns and large, and I cannot remember the last time I was unable to pick up the network channels with my Jack antenna at any location. My own personal experience in my coach trumps any test by anyone. :B

[Dutch_12078]

rgatijnet1 wrote:

Dutch_12078 wrote:

rgatijnet1 wrote:

Bill.Satellite wrote:
If your existing Winegard antenna is working, the Jack is going to be a downgrade. Many stories of people replacing non-working or very old Winegard antennas with Jack's a getting great results. Well, of course they are!
If you stay in close to town then the Jack will perform very well, it is a good antenna. However, it will not bring in NBC in Las Vegas as they are still broadcasting NBC 3 on VHF channel 2. The Rayzar Air will also not receive these channels. The Sensar's long arms are required to receive channels 2-6 and there are still multiple markets that use channels 2-6.
If you do a search Batwing vs. Jack (or similar) you should be able to find the comparison done by JVCJeff (JCV?). It is an excellent report.

Way too many variables for you to make such a blanket statement. Our last time in Moab, Utah, we were able to use our Jack antenna and pick up 26 channels with some being as far away as Salt Lake City, Utah. This was with a range, in the mountains, of over 120 miles. Over flat land out west, our range has been greater.
There have been very very few instances where we could not pick up all three of the network channels, no matter where we are parked.

How many low-VHF channels (broadcast, not virtual) have you picked up at that distance? There are still 300 plus stations broadcasting on the low-VHF (2-6) channels in the US.

Who cares? That number of 2-6 channels is getting smaller every day as the stations upgrade. I'm more interested in the future than the past.

If missing out on available network channels, low power repeaters, etc., doesn't affect you, that's fine with me. Others may find the information about the low-VHF channel reception useful though, when making an antenna selection. The bottom line is that tests run by knowledgeable people with the proper test equipment have found the Sensar batwing with the Wingman add-on to be a more efficient antenna under more circumstances than any other OTA RV specific antenna. Here's a link to one thread on this forum showing the comparison testing done by one of our own very knowledgeable forum members:

Batwing vs.BatMan vs. Jack: The Results..

[jorbill2or]

The Razar and the jack are good antennas and are less directional. .. Put it up it works and most people find that as the definition of better . the batwing with wingman attachment is more capable of distance but must be pointed accurately and then moved if the other stations are in a different direction
120 miles for UHF is impressive and unlikely. I would think the salt lake station has a repeater in Moab ( it does) 😉 many small communities use repeaters and that's what your really receiving your siting right on top of the station
The jvcjeff post / study shows the differences very clearly .

[rgatijnet1]

Dutch_12078 wrote:

rgatijnet1 wrote:

Bill.Satellite wrote:
If your existing Winegard antenna is working, the Jack is going to be a downgrade. Many stories of people replacing non-working or very old Winegard antennas with Jack's a getting great results. Well, of course they are!
If you stay in close to town then the Jack will perform very well, it is a good antenna. However, it will not bring in NBC in Las Vegas as they are still broadcasting NBC 3 on VHF channel 2. The Rayzar Air will also not receive these channels. The Sensar's long arms are required to receive channels 2-6 and there are still multiple markets that use channels 2-6.
If you do a search Batwing vs. Jack (or similar) you should be able to find the comparison done by JVCJeff (JCV?). It is an excellent report.

Way too many variables for you to make such a blanket statement. Our last time in Moab, Utah, we were able to use our Jack antenna and pick up 26 channels with some being as far away as Salt Lake City, Utah. This was with a range, in the mountains, of over 120 miles. Over flat land out west, our range has been greater.
There have been very very few instances where we could not pick up all three of the network channels, no matter where we are parked.

How many low-VHF channels (broadcast, not virtual) have you picked up at that distance? There are still 300 plus stations broadcasting on the low-VHF (2-6) channels in the US.

Who cares? That number of 2-6 channels is getting smaller every day as the stations upgrade. I'm more interested in the future than the past.

[IAMICHABOD]

Dutch_12078 wrote:
How many low-VHF channels (broadcast, not virtual) have you picked up at that distance? There are still 300 plus stations broadcasting on the low-VHF (2-6) channels in the US.

With over 1700 stations out there it seems to be a lot to choose from.

[Dutch_12078]

rgatijnet1 wrote:

Bill.Satellite wrote:
If your existing Winegard antenna is working, the Jack is going to be a downgrade. Many stories of people replacing non-working or very old Winegard antennas with Jack's a getting great results. Well, of course they are!
If you stay in close to town then the Jack will perform very well, it is a good antenna. However, it will not bring in NBC in Las Vegas as they are still broadcasting NBC 3 on VHF channel 2. The Rayzar Air will also not receive these channels. The Sensar's long arms are required to receive channels 2-6 and there are still multiple markets that use channels 2-6.
If you do a search Batwing vs. Jack (or similar) you should be able to find the comparison done by JVCJeff (JCV?). It is an excellent report.

Way too many variables for you to make such a blanket statement. Our last time in Moab, Utah, we were able to use our Jack antenna and pick up 26 channels with some being as far away as Salt Lake City, Utah. This was with a range, in the mountains, of over 120 miles. Over flat land out west, our range has been greater.
There have been very very few instances where we could not pick up all three of the network channels, no matter where we are parked.

How many low-VHF channels (broadcast, not virtual) have you picked up at that distance? There are still 300 plus stations broadcasting on the low-VHF (2-6) channels in the US.

[rgatijnet1]

Bill.Satellite wrote:
If your existing Winegard antenna is working, the Jack is going to be a downgrade. Many stories of people replacing non-working or very old Winegard antennas with Jack's a getting great results. Well, of course they are!
If you stay in close to town then the Jack will perform very well, it is a good antenna. However, it will not bring in NBC in Las Vegas as they are still broadcasting NBC 3 on VHF channel 2. The Rayzar Air will also not receive these channels. The Sensar's long arms are required to receive channels 2-6 and there are still multiple markets that use channels 2-6.
If you do a search Batwing vs. Jack (or similar) you should be able to find the comparison done by JVCJeff (JCV?). It is an excellent report.

Way too many variables for you to make such a blanket statement. Our last time in Moab, Utah, we were able to use our Jack antenna and pick up 26 channels with some being as far away as Salt Lake City, Utah. This was with a range, in the mountains, of over 120 miles. Over flat land out west, our range has been greater.
There have been very very few instances where we could not pick up all three of the network channels, no matter where we are parked.

[RoyB]

My house setup here is some 50 miles away from Washington DC and has two clusters of TV stations there one on each side of DC.

Have experimented using both the BATWING with the UHF add-on dipoles and the JACK picking up the National Broadcast digital TV signals..

The BATWING seems to be the best for me doing this mounted on the same antenna pole at the same height... Both got good clear HDTV signals I had to move the JACK ANTENNA alot more to get precisely pointed at the two clusters of TV stations.

Probably the longer dipoles of the BATWING antenna setup gives it an edge perhaps...

Just my thoughts here... I have used both antennas on our off-road trips with my POPUP camper that has an outside antenna pole mounted to the side of the trailer. Both had excellent results for us...

Roy Ken

[Bill_Satellite]

If your existing Winegard antenna is working, the Jack is going to be a downgrade. Many stories of people replacing non-working or very old Winegard antennas with Jack's a getting great results. Well, of course they are!
If you stay in close to town then the Jack will perform very well, it is a good antenna. However, it will not bring in NBC in Las Vegas as they are still broadcasting NBC 3 on VHF channel 2. The Rayzar Air will also not receive these channels. The Sensar's long arms are required to receive channels 2-6 and there are still multiple markets that use channels 2-6.
If you do a search Batwing vs. Jack (or similar) you should be able to find the comparison done by JVCJeff (JCV?). It is an excellent report.