Luxury vs. Mid-level Pushers

[TheVoiceNinja]

Good morning, all!

We've spent the past year or so looking at and refining our lifestyle and my income sources so that we can spend 4 to 5 months per year on the road with our two young sons (4 and 8 years old). Everything seems to be lining up quite nicely:

• We have minimal debt on our stick and brick home.
• We home school the boys.
• I have two primary sources of income, which are both mobile - voiceovers and communication/change management consulting.
• I travel quite a bit for business, so we can leverage some tax and reimbursement benefits from business travel in a motorhome.

We've decided that we want a Diesel pusher with 3 to 4 slideouts so that I have room for an office/portable vocal booth in the master bedroom and the rest of the family will have ample space to live up front.

Given that background, my question for all of you is this:

We have found floor plans that would work for us in both luxury and mid-level motorhomes. All other things being equal, similar used luxury coaches seem to run about $15,000 more than a non-luxury coach. For example, we've looked at Coachmen Cross Country and Four Winds Presidios where length, layout, engine size, etc., are all basically the same, but there's a $15K premium for the Presidio.

Do you find that the luxury lines have higher quality slides, better overall construction, etc., in the coach body itself? Or is the price increase really just for the trim and cabinets?

We don't care about the fancy tile floors, ceiling light treatment, gold fixtures, etc., so that's not worth the premium price tag. However, it may be worth the upgrade if the coach components are more durable.

I have my suspicions, but would love to hear from some of you who have long term experience in those types of motorhomes.

Thank you!

[TheVoiceNinja]

Happy Saturday, everyone!

Thank you, all, for your advice. We're looking hard at all of our options and have found a few that appear to be gems out there. Your feedback and thoughts have been immeasurably helpful and our family is looking forward to joining many of you on the road!

[crasster]

To be honest I haven't really seen "entry level DP's". Most DP's are pretty nice. There is luxury and not luxury. You can usually tell by the faucets and cabinets.... I have not seen any real "junkers" though. Typically the higher price brings up the quality. Tiffin is a great brand just to name one.

[Effy]

1SG wrote:
I have been following this thread and wondering what I would do. All the advise and information given to the OP has been spot-on.

So I decided to see what I could find here in Oregon that might fit the bill. Of course due to budget the coach had to be older. In older coaches I like to find ones that have been upgraded with modern TV's, appliances etc....

This is what I found, 2005 Western Alpine

Nice coach.

[1SG]

I have been following this thread and wondering what I would do. All the advise and information given to the OP has been spot-on.

So I decided to see what I could find here in Oregon that might fit the bill. Of course due to budget the coach had to be older. In older coaches I like to find ones that have been upgraded with modern TV's, appliances etc....

This is what I found, 2005 Western Alpine

Disclaimer: I am not associated with RV Sales of Oregon or this particular motorhome.

[Ivylog]

In 2012 an exception was made in the Highway Bill so MHs could have a 24K rear axle decreasing the number of MHs that need a tag axle... making it possible to have decent CCC without a tag. This will not help the OP as his $90K will not buy a 2012 or newer 39' mid level DP.

"Tag axles have little to do with quality or luxury," I have to disagree as more slides, hardwood cabinets, tile floors,Corina counters, thicker floors and roofs, Aqua Hot heating, often larger engines and transmissions all add to the weight... requiring a tag axle starting around 2002.

For the half time use the OP is wanting to do with four people I would buy the biggest DP I could find with the floor plan that works for them... that will require a tag axle coach.

[ldm468]

tatest wrote:
...The tag becomes a necessity as the gross vehicle weight rating approaches or exceeds 40,000 pounds, as DOT has a 20,000 pound per axle maximum on Federal highways.

Good Morning Tom:

I think you will find that single axle motor home now have a limit of 24,000 lbs on the drive axle. I believe it was changed a few years ago.

If you look at all the specification for the single axle Entegra Aspires, Newmar Dutchstars and American Coach Revolutions, you will find the 24,000 GAVW on the drive axle .

Other makes and models may also be using the 24,000 axles, but I have not looked at their specs.

Cheers.

Len

[tatest]

In your selections you are looking at entry level for diesel pushers, and the $15K difference is likely premium trim level. Whether or not the extra trim, at the same chassis capacity, is worth it is a personal matter. I tend to buy vehicles at "base level" or the minimum trim level that includes the features I want.

First steps up in RVs tends to be more slideouts and upgrades in chassis capacity, and to get there you have to take the upgrades in trim. If that extra size is what you need, then it is worth it. But don't expect a Presidio or Tuscany to be significantly different in construction or basic quality than a Palazzo. To get to mid-level (which would have been $300,000 to $600,000 new) you need to look at other manufacturers, like Newmar.

$60,000 to $90,000 in a diesel pusher means you are buying used. Age and condition of the RV today will be more of a price determinant that market position when it was new. However, you can find 38-40 foot mid-range diesel pushers in that price range, 10-15 years old. Mandalays, Dutch Stars and Kountry Stars, Allegro Buses, the occasional lower-end Country Coach, American Eagles.

Tag axles have little to do with quality or luxury, they are about size. The tag becomes a necessity as the gross vehicle weight rating approaches or exceeds 40,000 pounds, as DOT has a 20,000 pound per axle maximum on Federal highways.

[Winnipeg]

Great question by the OP, and quite a variety of advice. For me, it seams that wanting a high-end chassis/structure and average interior is not something you will find. Budget chassis go under budget coaches, and better chassis go under better coaches.

A quick look at online ads will quickly tell you that $100k budget and "better" coach desire will put you into an older coach. There are gems out there, but there are also ones you want to run away from. A low-mileage coach may have been lived in full time for 10 years, little maintenance, and basically worn out. A high-mileage coach may have had pristine care and could be a great choice.

Lastly, you cannot just go by brand name. The big ones, like Winnebago, produce nice stuff and junk from the same factory. Some brands tend to make lower end and others tend to make higher end, but you cannot just go by brand to judge quality.

Good luck with the hunt.

[Executive45]

To echo what's already been said with an example. Monaco built luxury coaches with the Signature, Executive and Dynasty. These all had steel cages. Below these three (now Camelot) the cages were constructed of an aluminum alloy. Didn't make any of the lower models unsafe just different. Their luxury line resulted in a heavier coach with better amenities. My floorplan would most likely work well for you. Highly insulated with a desk up front and a pull out desk in the bedroom; so they're out there, you just have to find it. As stated, PPL is an excellent tool to use. Remember, this is going to be your home. The more comfortable you make it for all, the more enjoyment you'll get out of it. Heck, a new Dodge Ram will run you $70K!....Dennis

[westernrvparkow]

Mile High wrote:

TheVoiceNinja wrote:
Do you find that the luxury lines have higher quality slides, better overall construction, etc., in the coach body itself? Or is the price increase really just for the trim and cabinets?

I always found that when looking within the same manufacturers fleet, the mechanics don't change much as you go higher in price and "luxury" so to speak. The manufacturers tend to use the same slides, construction, appliances, etc throughout their fleet. The top of the lines have more features of course.

However, when looking across brands, there can be a drastic difference in overall construction.

There are significant chassis improvements as you move up the pricing ladder. A higher price might get you aqua-hot heating and hot water, semi-monocoque construction, tag axles etc. You might get better construction and better materials. You might also only get sparkles and glitter. You will need to do you homework to be sure the extra price you might pay is really structural and quality improvements and not just glitz.

[Mile_High]

TheVoiceNinja wrote:
Do you find that the luxury lines have higher quality slides, better overall construction, etc., in the coach body itself? Or is the price increase really just for the trim and cabinets?

I always found that when looking within the same manufacturers fleet, the mechanics don't change much as you go higher in price and "luxury" so to speak. The manufacturers tend to use the same slides, construction, appliances, etc throughout their fleet. The top of the lines have more features of course.

However, when looking across brands, there can be a drastic difference in overall construction.

[Tom_Barb]

I'd much rather have a quality build than one full of glitch and glitter.
Well made cabinets no vinyl overlays. real wood, quality slides, real latches. Diesel engines, well built chassis.

I hope you get the idea.

[DrewE]

One thing I would check out very carefully is whether you'll have a quiet enough environment in your motorhome for voiceover work. Most units are not very well acoustically isolated from the outside and even less so from the rest of the interior. Campgrounds are not always the quietest locales, either, with often close neighbors and excited kids and maybe train tracks or airports not far off.

If you could plan on doing that part of your work in local studios wherever you happen to end up, it may open up some more possibilities for RV models and I think might work out better overall.

[Effy]

At the price point you are aiming for you might be hard pressed to fine a nice rig that's not pretty old. If you were in the gasser market I'd say you'd have better luck, but a DP in that price range is one of a few things; older, lower quality or has issues, or a combination of the 3.

PPL is a good pricing guide.

Looks like you are in the neighborhood of 10-14 years old on mid level coaches. One Tiffin in the mix a little over budget with 4 slides.

ppl