WiFi verses Powerline

[AMOS33]

If anyone is interested in this: I live at a RV Park that has free Wifi but the problem was how to ensure every customer receives access. We have discovered that Wifi coupled with Powerline adapters are the answer. If anyone is interest, post here and can share more.

[AMOS33]

Dutch
"I'm trying to figure out how you're getting "36Mb/s to Pole 40" from a "20Mb/s DSL link". Which speed test are you using?"

Hi Dutch. The 36Mb/s is the max speed at a distance of 200'for that link between Pole 40 and Pole 33(my RV). Using Ookla speed test I am getting 8.58 Mb/s download and 1.86 upload with a ping test of 31ms.

The shorter the distance the greater the speed of the Nano links.

[AMOS33]

westernrvparkowner

"Thank you sir for your reply.I like it when you said:"People just want to turn on their devices and connect, not wire up a village ever time."

I cannot begin to understand what it takes to run a successful RV Park.

[SCVJeff]

That doesn't mean you can't use BPL in the park to attach to remote routers. But... if there is a transformer in the way there will need to be coupling installed

[Dutch_12078]

I'm trying to figure out how you're getting "36Mb/s to Pole 40" from a "20Mb/s DSL link". Which speed test are you using?

[westernrvparkow]

AMOS33 wrote:
Ok Bill.Satellite will try to explain what I am doing.

First, I live in a small rural RV Park with a 20 Mb/s DSL link that is broadcast throughout the Park over an Amped_Pro_AP directional antenna and we normally use Wifi extenders to connect. We all want fast downloads, right? So I began looking at Powerline technology and soon realized that this may be the way future connectivity will work.

My Routers is a Comtrend NexusLink 3112u. 1 ethernet port is connected to the AP600EX High Power Wireless-N 600mW Pro Access Point. This is housed on a separate leg.

So I wanted to pickup the signal from the closest point to the AP. I did this by installing a wifi extender connected by ethernet cable to a AV500 Nano powerline adapter on the 20Amp breaker located at Pole #40 that I had previously 'pared' to one in my RV located 200' away at Pole #33. Inside my RV I plugged in the 2nd AV500 Nano adapter and connected it to my PC using a ethernet cable and it worked.

My download speed went from <= to 3 Mb/s to 8+ Mb/s. Since it worked I asked the owner if I could test around the park and he gave me the go ahead. Of course this means that every RV between me and the start point could also do the same.

Now I realize that if ever RV were connected at gigabit speeds we'd soon drain the swamp. But that problem could be alleviated by adding additional DSL links or some other way.

These AV500 Nano adapters I am using have a max distance of 1000 feet and of course the speed downgrades with distance. For example my current connection shows 36 Mb/s to Pole 40. IF I can figure out how to post images, will do.

Some limitations I have noticed are:
1)Max no. of PL nodes using the cheap equipment I have are 16. which is ok because there are never more than 16 on each of the 6 legs in the Park.

Hope this is helpful and thanks for your interest.

So you have to have an adapter in each RV for this system to work, plus somehow connect from the park's wifi routers to the various 200 amp mains via ethernet cabling? Since ethernet is only rated for 300 feet you still would have to have a very small park, plus the park would have to have adapters for each RV to plug inside their rigs, then the guests would have to connect a router to that adapter. Not going to work for anything but long term stays as far as I can tell even if the park wanted to go through the trouble of installing the base system to the power mains. Way too complicated and way too many moving parts (adapters, routers etc. that guests do not have). People just want to turn on their devices and connect, not wire up a village every time.

[AMOS33]

Ok Bill.Satellite will try to explain what I am doing.

First, I live in a small rural RV Park with a 20 Mb/s DSL link that is broadcast throughout the Park over an Amped_Pro_AP directional antenna and we normally use Wifi extenders to connect. We all want fast downloads, right? So I began looking at Powerline technology and soon realized that this may be the way future connectivity will work.

My Routers is a Comtrend NexusLink 3112u. 1 ethernet port is connected to the AP600EX High Power Wireless-N 600mW Pro Access Point. This is housed on a separate leg.

So I wanted to pickup the signal from the closest point to the AP. I did this by installing a wifi extender connected by ethernet cable to a AV500 Nano powerline adapter on the 20Amp breaker located at Pole #40 that I had previously 'pared' to one in my RV located 200' away at Pole #33. Inside my RV I plugged in the 2nd AV500 Nano adapter and connected it to my PC using a ethernet cable and it worked.

My download speed went from <= to 3 Mb/s to 8+ Mb/s. Since it worked I asked the owner if I could test around the park and he gave me the go ahead. Of course this means that every RV between me and the start point could also do the same.

Now I realize that if ever RV were connected at gigabit speeds we'd soon drain the swamp. But that problem could be alleviated by adding additional DSL links or some other way.

These AV500 Nano adapters I am using have a max distance of 1000 feet and of course the speed downgrades with distance. For example my current connection shows 36 Mb/s to Pole 40. IF I can figure out how to post images, will do.

Some limitations I have noticed are:
1)Max no. of PL nodes using the cheap equipment I have are 16. which is ok because there are never more than 16 on each of the 6 legs in the Park.

Hope this is helpful and thanks for your interest.

[wa8yxm]

Broadband over power lines has been tested in many markets. There are several systems.

MOST of those systems.. Suck big time, they both cause major interference to licensed radio services and are subject to interference by the same.

ONE system (I won't name it because I'm not sure and I'd rather not name it than be wrong on this) it seems, works well without this problem.

But serveral BBoPL projects simply vanished,, no takers for the service.

What can I say

Same is true of the 'Home' type modules that let you use yoru house wiring instead of pulling Cat 5.. Some of them are kind of bad,, Though there is at least one that is OK and plays well with other radios.. They are radios by the way. Even if it's "over power lines" not over the air.

[Bill_Satellite]

AMOS33 wrote:
Thank you sir for your reply but it does work in our small RV park with only 58 sites. I am sure that many problems will arise, but for now, my RV is getting excellent signal and throughput compared to what I got originally. I must admit I find it discouraging the comments to date replete with accusations of snake oil salesman, immaturity since I am a new poster,ad infintum...have a nice day, I stop.

Please don't go away. I tried to explain that internet over powerline is neither new nor unique. I am really interested in what you did. The 1 known factor of public forums is that their are a lot of folks who post even when they have no idea what they are talking about or accuse folks of stuff they never did (I have done it myself but I am working of doing better).
If you could explain how the host system ties into the powerline (and which part of what powerline) it might help us all understand how this is done. It sounds like even in a larger park multiple systems could be setup to allow the necessary number of connections via multiple powerline.
Hoping to hear back from you again!
If you are not comfortable with the responses here, please feel free to PM me. I really am interested and I might be able to run some interference.

[AMOS33]

Had you posted your introduction and experience in your first post you would have received a better greeting.
Apologies for the Snake Oil comment.
I do believe your setup is not a one-fits-all solution though.

Apology received and thanks. You may well be correct sir, but this much I have learned: Even if I am the only one in my RV Park to deploy this technology it does cut down on 2.4 Mhz interence inside my own RV exactly as Bill.Satellite explained in his original reply to my post; it acts as a extended Ethernet cable from the Router located 200 feet away to my PC inside my RV and the downloads went from an average of 3 Mb/s to 10 Mb/s.

[Fizz]

AMOS33 wrote:
Thank you sir for your reply but it does work in our small RV park with only 58 sites. I am sure that many problems will arise, but for now, my RV is getting excellent signal and throughput compared to what I got originally. I must admit I find it discouraging the comments to date replete with accusations of snake oil salesman, immaturity since I am a new poster,ad infintum...have a nice day, I stop.

Had you posted your introduction and experience in your first post you would have received a better greeting.
Apologies for the Snake Oil comment.
I do believe your setup is not a one-fits-all solution though.

[AMOS33]

Thank you sir for your reply but it does work in our small RV park with only 58 sites. I am sure that many problems will arise, but for now, my RV is getting excellent signal and throughput compared to what I got originally. I must admit I find it discouraging the comments to date replete with accusations of snake oil salesman, immaturity since I am a new poster,ad infintum...have a nice day, I stop.

[RedRocket204]

westernrvparkowner wrote:
With the advances in cellular data, wifi will soon join the payphone, the cassette tape, floppy discs and tube televisions in the technology junkpile.

AT&T seems to very much disagree with that opinion... and as everyone already knows, AT&T is selling cellular.
AT&T Labs’ Project AirGig Nears First Field Trials for Ultra-Fast Wireless Broadband Over Power Line...

Sounds like room for both wireless and cellular moving forward into multi-gig speeds

[westernrvparkow]

Bill.Satellite wrote:
Powerline equipment uses the actual power lines to send the signal. Imagine it as a dedicated Ethernet cable running throughout your home and you can plus a sender in at one location and it can be received at multiple other locations on the same set of circuits. It's certainly not snake oil and it's not any kind of an amplifier. It will be interesting to see how this could be implemented in a campground but sending the signal through a separate 20amp circuit that goes to all sites just might work! I am not sure how anyone here knows what the backhaul is at this location. Powerline equipment will not improve the backhaul but a better connection (powerline vs. Wifi) could easily improve the end user experience.
I am interested to hear more.

If your basic outline of how it works is correct, it won't work in a RV park setting. There is no separate 20 amp circuit that would run to every site. Just not possible, unless it is a 5 or 6 site park. At one of our parks we have 14 separate 200 amp mains that come off of 6 different transformers. Even if you could somehow feed to each main, there would be the problem of which leg of the 200 amp feeder to connect the wifi feed. The legs are actually routed randomly across the loop, leg one might feed the 30 amp and the right side 50 amp leg at one box and feed the 20 amp receptacle and the left side of the 50 amp at the adjacent one. Then you don't know how each RV is going to connect. That wifi signal may feed into the proper outlet inside their rig if they use the 30 amp connection, but only feed the water heater and air conditioner circuits if they use the 50 amp. There just are no easy answers to park wifi. It is going to be a problem until us park owners can rip it out completely in about 3 years. With the advances in cellular data, wifi will soon join the payphone, the cassette tape, floppy discs and tube televisions in the technology junkpile.

[AMOS33]

Lenny K wrote:
OK. I'm interested. Tell me some more.

Intro bit:
Thanks for your interest. First, I not selling anything. I am retired and living in my RV full time and wanted to share with all what I have discovered. Second, it works for me and my neighbors.

Background bit:
We are located in a very rural area and the most bandwidth we can get is a 20 Mb/s DSL feed to our Router. From there the signal goes out over a Amped_Pro_AP directional antenna. Since I am located 200' from the source, my signal gets block by trees and larger RVs, etc. It's enough for checking email, online banking, surfing the web, etc., at the best of times. I was using a WiFi extender to share the signal inside my RV.

Being frustrated, I begin to investigate what options were available and that is when I discovered Powerline adapters. Now each RV is on a leg of the power grid, each with its own meter with a max of 16 RVs per leg. And the Router is isolated on its own leg. So I installed a TL-WA860RE at Power Pole #40 to receive the WiFi signal from the A P antenna with a TL-PA4010 powerline adapter and at my RV at Power Pole #33 I installed a paired TL-PA4010 powerline adapter connected with my original TL-WR700N to provide WiFi inside my RV.

Sorry for the long post but if there still be an interest, perhaps I can post some images of the setup with actual speed test,etc.

[fj12ryder]

MrWizard wrote:
Could be
Except there is no link in the post to the product
And the only link so far, had been provided by a long time member
Who is not enamored with the product idea

Yeah, I think he realizes that scammers/spammers get posts deleted lots of times because they include a direct link. He just puts in to contact him with a PM.