buying older TT...as tiny home

[mattbatson]

Ok,
So my plan is to buy a TT (5th wheel or bumper pull) that I will basically park full time on my mothers property and live in as my residence.
I will T off her well water, run electric from her service panel, and dig my own little homemade septic system. And will essentially live for free.
We are both in the house flipping business together and her and her husband are in 70's and not getting any younger.
I have a 8x20 shed to store much of my stuff in...along with her basement if needed.

Anyways, I had thought about building a tiny home, but decided the advantage of a TT were that it is ready to go (essentially), probably cheaper (I'm looking at 6-9K dollar TT's), and if in a few years I decided to do something else I could probably sell the TT for near what I paid for it.

I plan to have it delivered to the property, and do not plan on having a tow vehicle any time soon...if ever. I do have experience towing, and may pick up a truck someday...but right now it isn't in the plans.

We live in western NC, so winters are short-ish and mild-ish and summers the same.
Plan to put up a metal RV port to keep sun and rain off the TT

It will sit on a very large concrete pad that is already there.

I'm looking at 5th wheels in the 1998 to 2001 model year range and bumper pulls in the 2002 to 2007 model year range...all in my price range of about 7-9K.

slide outs are definitely a requirement...and 28 ft or longer for sure.

I've done a bit of reading on here as I research my options
But my question is...what do you guys think about my plan and what would your concerns be with regards to looking at older models and maybe any specifics on what models/options/years you guys would look out for and what kinds of issues/problems you would be concerned about....that sort of thing

thanks for reading and any feedback will be appreciated

[NanciL]

mattbatson wrote:

SoundGuy wrote:

mattbatson wrote:
So my plan is to buy a TT (5th wheel or bumper pull) that I will basically park full time on my mothers property and live in as my residence.
I will T off her well water, run electric from her service panel, and dig my own little homemade septic system. And will essentially live for free.
We are both in the house flipping business together and her and her husband are in 70's and not getting any younger.
I have a 8x20 shed to store much of my stuff in...along with her basement if needed.

thanks for reading and any feedback will be appreciated

Seems obvious to me your first concern should be whether this plan to park a trailer on your mother's property and live in it full time as you would a house is even legal. Should we presume you've already done this considering you're in the house flipping business? Not much point in proceeding any further with the idea if you're in contravention of any local regulations or bylaws. 😉

To answer the questions about code ...

There is very little code here in the backwoods of western NC...loose zoning laws and so on.
I come from Florida and am constantly amazed at what I see here.

We have looked at homes to flip and found no record of septic systems and asked neighbors and been informed most of the homes along that stretch just dump into the river !

and sure enough would go look down the bank of the river and see the pipe sticking out.
Absolutely crazy stuff.

my mom is a real estate broker and we are fully aware of what is allowed and what is not...and careful to no get her or her license into trouble.

I am not sure what county you are in, but I am in western NC and you are wrong.
They are very strict on codes.
It is just people violating them and not getting caught.

Last month they had the electric company shut off the electric meter on a young couple down the road from us, because they were living in a brand new shed that they had inspected as a "storage shed"

My advice to you, is don't put things in print here that might come back to haunt you.

If you don't believe me go check with your county building inspector and your county health inspector.

Jack L

[NanciL]

mattbatson wrote:

SoundGuy wrote:

mattbatson wrote:
So my plan is to buy a TT (5th wheel or bumper pull) that I will basically park full time on my mothers property and live in as my residence.
I will T off her well water, run electric from her service panel, and dig my own little homemade septic system. And will essentially live for free.
We are both in the house flipping business together and her and her husband are in 70's and not getting any younger.
I have a 8x20 shed to store much of my stuff in...along with her basement if needed.

thanks for reading and any feedback will be appreciated

Seems obvious to me your first concern should be whether this plan to park a trailer on your mother's property and live in it full time as you would a house is even legal. Should we presume you've already done this considering you're in the house flipping business? Not much point in proceeding any further with the idea if you're in contravention of any local regulations or bylaws. 😉

To answer the questions about code ...

There is very little code here in the backwoods of western NC...loose zoning laws and so on.
I come from Florida and am constantly amazed at what I see here.

We have looked at homes to flip and found no record of septic systems and asked neighbors and been informed most of the homes along that stretch just dump into the river !

and sure enough would go look down the bank of the river and see the pipe sticking out.
Absolutely crazy stuff.

my mom is a real estate broker and we are fully aware of what is allowed and what is not...and careful to no get her or her license into trouble.

I am not sure what county you are in, but I am in western NC and you are wrong.
They are very strict on codes.
It is just people violating them and not getting caught.

Last month they had the electric company shut off the electric meter on a young couple down the road from us, because they were living in a brand new shed that they had inspected as a "storage shed"

My advice to you, is don't put things in print here that might come back to haunt you.

If you don't believe me go check with your county building inspector and your county health inspector.

Jack L

[Terryallan]

Define Western NC. Your idea of mild winters, and my idea of mild winters are two different things. Western NC is the NC mountains, and it gets, and stays durn cold in the NC High Country. Waterfalls freeze, the lakes freeze over, and many places like Boone get a whole lot of snow, and it stays a long time. I have been there many times, and the temp is in the minus. Shoot. I just live in the foothills, and the low teens is NOT unusual, nor is single digits.

IF you are in a trailer in the High Country in the winter. You will use a bunch of propane, and better have heated hoses running to your RV, and heated underbelly.

However. Summer in the High Country is great. AC not needed.

[Fizz]

My TT has been parked at my cottage for the past five years.
I use it as a guest house.
By law I can do this if it's still on wheels, has current plates and is in no way connected to any service in a permanent manner.

[coolmom42]

I think you should consider a composting toilet to deal with your black waste. Tee into the home's existing system for your gray water. This will avoid a lot of pluggage problems.

One consideration is the electric panel. You will need at least a 30 amp/120 V connection, and if your trailer needs 2 AC units to cool it, you will need a 50 amp/120 V supply. So somewhere in the electric panel there needs to be enough available circuits to supply the current. Definitely get a licensed electrician to hook this up and be very clear on the power supply and the type of outlet you need.

[Tiger8r]

Jmho, why not put in a 500 gal concrete tank and two 50 gal plastic tanks. Run a trunk line 20 or 30 feet to a y and ten feet to each of the plastic barrels, perforate them. This will last a lot longer and you could have the concrete tank pumped out. We have a sys similar to this it has never been a problem and has only been pumped out once in 30 years. Granted it was mostly used as a vacation type cabin.

[Naio]

Once the barrel fills up, where are the solids going to go? Does your friend put TP in his? Are the holes big enough that stuff gets pushed out? Is there enough pressure to counteract the weight of the soil? That seems awfully unlikely.

[mattbatson]

Naio wrote:
If you are excavating I assume you will bury your water and drain lines? That should save a lot of hassle.

The sewer system sounds pretty whack, but far better than using the river. Remind me not to swim in any NC rivers ;).

Have you considered a composting toilet? Or renting a porta-john?

yes, buried everything

tiny homes across the country utilize septic systems like what I described...some to code...some not.

the guy who owns the crossfit box I go to has lived in a TT for the past 2 yrs and he buried one of those 50 gallon rain barrels and punched holes in it, and has worked for him great so far.

For a one bedroom/small place, these septic systems will work just fine. Especially if the gray water is diverted.

The land needs to perk for it obviously...

if a drain field needs to be added at some point that isn't all that difficult either.

I'm still researching that area and haven't determined yet exactly what needs to be done.

Just like I haven't determined exactly what kind of wire and conduit and so on.

these are details that will be worked out over the next few months.

It will be a few months before I'm ready to move.

[Naio]

If you are excavating I assume you will bury your water and drain lines? That should save a lot of hassle.

The sewer system sounds pretty whack, but far better than using the river. Remind me not to swim in any NC rivers ;).

Have you considered a composting toilet? Or renting a porta-john?

[mattbatson]

DownTheAvenue wrote:
1. Zoning laws. Is this even allowed?
2. Environmental health laws. Is your "homemade septic system" allowed ever?
3. A park model is a better choice than a travel trailer. It will have a residential refrigerator and toilet. It will be designed for fulltime living.
4. A used mobile home is even a better choice. For about the same money (considering you're building a cover), you will have a real house with better insulation, real house furniture, room for your "stuff", room for a washer and dryer, and room to move around.

appreciate the advice...I have some different ideas to consider

[mattbatson]

KD4UPL wrote:
I agree, tap the existing home's septic as well. Home made septic system sounds gross and/or expensive.
Is your mother prepared for a much larger electric bill? Heating and cooling an RV all year will use a lot of electricity. Possibly more than the house currently uses depending on it's size and construction. RVs are poorly insulated. Most people using them stationary use little electric heaters which are an extremely expensive way to heat. You'll also need to keep your water hose from freezing in the winter which is often done with electric heat tape, yet another electricity hog. If you use the RV's propane furnace be prepared to get your tanks filled regularly or get some large 100 pound cylinders to connect too.
You do realize that the $9,000 you spend on an RV plus the plumbing and electric connections would pay rent on a small apartment for well over a year if not two?

Yes, the 9 grand would pay for rent for a year or two.

however, then that money is gone forever.

this way, after the year or two or three or four...I resell the TT for near what I paid (since it will be in such protected condition under my RV port) and I get all that money back.

The hookups that we will surely invest a couple grand into (wire, excavator rental, etc) will be a small value add to the property and not completely lost if, and when, I sell the TT.
Lots of people vacation here and it is really common to see homes with hookups next to them.

Also, fully aware of cost of heating a space with those little electric heaters. The house I'm currently flipping was built in 20's and is 1700 sq ft and this last winter (this was a slow flip that I occupied...I never do this with our other flips) I heated the house exclusively with portable electric heaters.
My bill for a few months in the winter was about 250 to 300 dollars.

However, in florida, for the 10 months of the year that it is hot, my electric bill to cool the house would be about that (1300 sq ft house)

so I'm used to that.

But usually here in the mountains of NC the weather is very mild

plus the TT will be 200 sq ft instead of 1700...so I'm hoping the cost is similar if not less.

I totally hear you on the bigger propane tank. Definitely should plan on one or two of those

thx

[mattbatson]

SoundGuy wrote:

mattbatson wrote:
So my plan is to buy a TT (5th wheel or bumper pull) that I will basically park full time on my mothers property and live in as my residence.
I will T off her well water, run electric from her service panel, and dig my own little homemade septic system. And will essentially live for free.
We are both in the house flipping business together and her and her husband are in 70's and not getting any younger.
I have a 8x20 shed to store much of my stuff in...along with her basement if needed.

thanks for reading and any feedback will be appreciated

Seems obvious to me your first concern should be whether this plan to park a trailer on your mother's property and live in it full time as you would a house is even legal. Should we presume you've already done this considering you're in the house flipping business? Not much point in proceeding any further with the idea if you're in contravention of any local regulations or bylaws. 😉

To answer the questions about code ...

There is very little code here in the backwoods of western NC...loose zoning laws and so on.
I come from Florida and am constantly amazed at what I see here.

We have looked at homes to flip and found no record of septic systems and asked neighbors and been informed most of the homes along that stretch just dump into the river !

and sure enough would go look down the bank of the river and see the pipe sticking out.
Absolutely crazy stuff.

my mom is a real estate broker and we are fully aware of what is allowed and what is not...and careful to no get her or her license into trouble.

[mattbatson]

rjxj wrote:
x2 on the sewage. That opens the door to county health issues. If she has a septic system tap into it but dont dump a full tank. Maybe dump when it's half full. Keep the black valve closed until dumping. The main issue with buying an RV is water damage. If you get past that then your next big risk items are Frig $1,500 or more or replace with residential. AC $500 to $700 if diy replacement. Furnace $500. Water heater $400.

You are on the right track with the roof cover because of summer heat and rain. If there is a way to have side shade along with the roof over it may help a lot in the summer. Because you are on a cement pad you will be able to use inexpensive blocks under the rig for less movement while walking around in it. A FW will usually sit a little higher than a TT so more steps and a FW will have steps inside too. If you keep up on the exterior cleaning and dont let it get trashed it should do ok at resale time. I'm guessing I might lean toward a TT with a big slide if you are never pulling. You dont need what some may consider to be advantages of a FW if you wont pull it.

Ok, I hear you on the extra steps...although I'm very fit and healthy and wont have an issue with that...I appreciate the insight on the advantages and disadvantages of both...and the TT do seem to be cheaper. I can get a newer model TT for same money as an older FW

And yes, my plan was to get some side cover on the metal rv port. I basically want to protect as much of the TT as possible from sun and rain

And I had read on here about replacing the fridge with a residential one...and in fact a few for sale in the area have just that modification.
And a good test of the slides, a/c, water heater, etc will be on the list of things to check
thx

[mattbatson]

Sport45 wrote:
Be careful with that "little homemade septic system" you're digging. If not designed just right it can become a real headache if not a liability. I'd let the gray water flow freely in order to keep the bugs alive. The difficulty will be in sizing things to work with a very small amount of regular inflow but still be able to handle 60 gallon flushes without surging scum into your field lines.

Yes, gray water was going to flow freely

It is a homemade system using two 50 gal rain barrels, one set slightly lower underground then the other, connected to each other with pvc pipe near top...it is a design I found on a homesteader/survival site I used to frequent

[mattbatson]

2gypsies wrote:
Look at this site for 5th wheels and trailers to get an idea of price:

http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/5thwheel/5th-wheel-trailers.php

thank you for that link
I'm checking it out now