Weight and Truck

[cs2kplus]

Have a 1989 Fleetwood Taurus travel trailer. Weight is 6500. Need to get a truck. Can someone tell me what the minimum I should be looking for. I read all about tongue weight, etc. I have in my driveway. Just bought. Was delivered. I have no way of bring to get weighed. Thanks!:S

[wintersun]

Ideally a 1/2 ton would do the trick and it may though it is borderline. For sure a 3/4 ton pickup with a gas V-8 and 4.10 rear end is going to have no trouble towing and stopping with that amount of load.

Even with the 1/2 ton don't try to go with the smallest engine and high rear end gears. And read the fine print. Ford for example changed its V-6 engine so it produces more horsepower with ethanol but a lot less horsepower (inadequate for towing) without this fuel.

Take the time to download the towing guides from the Ford, Chevy, and Ram websites. They provide all the information you need in terms of towing capacity with the different models, cab configurations, rear end gears, and engines.

Also get the "tow package" which will provide an inexpensive upgrade of the alternator, radiator, transmission cooler, and trailer hitch, and is a lot less expensive to buy this way than it is to add these items on later. If a trailer braking controller is available as an option get this added in as well. With some 3/4 ton trucks like those from Chevy this is standard with the tow package.

[ol__grouch]

cs2kplus wrote:
I can understand steering being heavy. But this had a sort of skip to it. I looked up stock pics and tires look ok. Guy says he does not even notice it. Maybe its just me?

While my steering is heavy, I've never noticed any skip or stutter to it. I wonder if the belt was loose. I've had vehicles in the past do that. Have a mechanic or at least someone mechanically inclined look at it. You can also check for any trouble codes. Most OBD II vehicles, you have to use a reader. Mopars though, can still use the same process as the older OBD I cars.

With the truck shut off, turn the key on, off, on, off, on. Do NOT bump the starter and leave the key on the third time. Watch the odometer readout on the speedometer. It will either say "no code" or will show any codes in the computer.

[cs2kplus]

I can understand steering being heavy. But this had a sort of skip to it. I looked up stock pics and tires look ok. Guy says he does not even notice it. Maybe its just me?

[ol__grouch]

cs2kplus wrote:
@ ol'grouch....Sure does seem like it has HD suspension. I drove it yesterday. Not a bad ride. However - there is a bit of a tug when turning steering wheel. Not so much a tug....but feels like something ain't right. It was not enough to cause a loss of control of the wheel tho. Also someone mentioned that the tires look to small and maybe they replaced them when they decided to sell? I am thinking maybe that is the reason for the tug in the steering wheel? Are your tires bigger or same?

The steering is heavy. There is a steering damper on the front linkage. It looks like a shock absorber on the side. That's just the nature of the beast. The tires look about the right size. Mine are slightly larger but there's just as much wheel space in the fenders. There were two size tires on those and I went with the slighly larger size. When I got mine, I thought someone had put a lift kit on it. Nope, those 6 inch blocks are factory standard.

When you looked in the rear wheel openings, did you see just one set of leaf springs or three? When I drove my truck, the seller had a ton of dirt in the back to improve the ride. Without the dirt, it's a roght ride.

If I can get them posted, I'll take a picture of my springs. I've had a 3200 pound electric motor in the back. There was definitely something back there but it handled it pretty well.

[cs2kplus]

@ ol'grouch....Sure does seem like it has HD suspension. I drove it yesterday. Not a bad ride. However - there is a bit of a tug when turning steering wheel. Not so much a tug....but feels like something ain't right. It was not enough to cause a loss of control of the wheel tho. Also someone mentioned that the tires look to small and maybe they replaced them when they decided to sell? I am thinking maybe that is the reason for the tug in the steering wheel? Are your tires bigger or same?

[ol__grouch]

cs2kplus wrote:
will this do?

http://southjersey.craigslist.org/cto/4608857949.html

guy does now know hitch class.

That's pretty much like my truck. Being the 5.9 (360) V-8, fuel mileage isn't great. Mine is 4X4 also. Does it really have the HD sspension? You can tell by looking into the rear wheel well at the springs. My truck has the 8800 pound chassis package (that will be on a sticker in the glove box, under the hood or in the door) and there are three spring packs on the axle. Empty, it rides like a log wagon.

Mine was a commercial farm truck before I got it and had a new plastic bedliner in the bed. It was there to cover the dents and scratches from heavy use. I pulled it out as things were always sliding around in the bed. I do wish mine was an extended cab though. The step rails are almost a neccessity. I'm 6 foot and the steps are handy for me. For shorter people, they're a must have.

[cs2kplus]

will this do?

http://southjersey.craigslist.org/cto/4608857949.html

guy does now know hitch class.

[cs2kplus]

@ol'grouch... Yeah I need to find a dealer. One near me seems like its all sales. I hear ya on taking my time. Thanks for all the info!

@grit dog...maybe i will post something I am interested in. I've taken a break from looking. But love all the info you all provide! And ha! did the forum bleep you? So the C word is bad huh? LOL.

[Grit_dog]

First, the hitch. All OE receivers on pickups until some recent HD trucks are a 2" receiver. You can put any size ball hitch on them.
If you're looking at 15-20 yr old $5k pickups, honestly the condition and miles are worth more than the Brand. All 3 mfg had solid drivetrains except Dodge IMO was the weakest trans. I had several of them. Never lost one but never liked them. I still would buy a 2nd gen Dodge in a heartbeat.

Cost diff for 1/2 ton vs 3/4 or 1 ton will be negligible. It's all about miles and condition unless you're talking Cummins Dodges. They still command a premium for obvious reasons.

In that age range I'd be looking for 3/4 ton trucks. Mainly for bigger brakes and suspension.
That said I put a******ton of miles and a lot of towing on a few 90s model GM 1500s and they handled it well.
If I had $5k to spend on the best truck I could find I would be looking for a 1990-1998 GM 2500 with a 350 and NV4500 5 speed. That is still one of the most bulletproof combos out there in my experience.
And if you don't need 4wd that helps your situation a lot.

Edit, sorry, I didn't realize c r a p was a bad word!

[ol__grouch]

@ol' grouch - man you know your stuff. It makes my head spin. But I understand. I think I am set on 3/4 ton and possible diesel - year 2000+?. However - since I will buy used I guess I will need to do some homework on brakes and rear end ratio. It's really actually cool stuff...just makes it tougher to shop for the right truck. But....it must be that way. News to me about the diesel oil capacity by the way. Wow. Oh it would be a class 4 hitch I need as well?

I work in logistics so I deal with it all day every day. One sort of picks up details after close to 40 years. Generally, I deal with loads up to 40 tons. There is a local trailer/ hitch/ truck cap dealer that generally has good advice for lighter towing. They sell equipment and usually have the latest in stock. For instance, the old hydraulic trailer brake controller has been replaced by solid state electronic. A couple of wires and some adjustments replaced cutting brake lines ad such.

If you have a local RV dealership, especially one that sells trailers, talk to the guys in the parts and service department. They can give you advice on how to set your rig up. When I bought my B, they gave me good pointers that made camping more enjoyable. Go with a 3/4 ton Ford or Ram (used to be called Dodge Trucks) unit. I used to like Chevy/GMC trucks but they have such poor quality control the last few years, I no longer so so. When you recall more vehicles than you sell, there's a problem somewhere.

I think you mentioned buying a used truck. There should be a label that gives the order specifications when the truck was built. It will be either in the drivers door jamb, inside the glove box or under the hood. Look for the axle or axle ratio. I like to run in the 3.7 to 3.9 range for towing. If it says something like antispin, that's usually a bonus as both wheels will pull equally. On ice though, it can make the rear slide so you have to watch the throttle in icy conditions.

On the receiver, if you're getting a bumper pull trailer, you want as heavy as you can get. Class IV at least. You have to watch the ball height. My truck sits so high, I have to have a 6 inch drop and it still makes the trailer lean back. You want the tow height to be as level as possible. An equalizing or weight distributing hitch to go into the receiver is a good idea. (Two names for the same thing.) If you think about getting a fifth wheel trailer, see if you can find a truck with a gooseneck hitch in the bed that flips down. This lets you pull the trailer but use the truck as a truck when you flip the ball down.

When you buy used, you are limited to what's available. It may take a while to find the right truck for you. Don't get in a rush. You're on the internet now, use it to look around. There may be the perfect unit just down the road and they are getting on in years and down sizing.

[cs2kplus]

@ol' grouch - man you know your stuff. It makes my head spin. But I understand. I think I am set on 3/4 ton and possible diesel - year 2000+?. However - since I will buy used I guess I will need to do some homework on brakes and rear end ratio. It's really actually cool stuff...just makes it tougher to shop for the right truck. But....it must be that way. News to me about the diesel oil capacity by the way. Wow. Oh it would be a class 4 hitch I need as well?

[ol__grouch]

cs2kplus wrote:
@ol' grouch...I hear ya. But I don't have a way of weighing the camper at this point - without a truck to take it to a weigh station. As far as loaded weight? I would say it would perhaps be 2 adults and 3 teens max. That's what?....800 lbs right there. So 6500 + 800 = 7300. Added weight to rv? I can only give a high guess of 1000? So now we are at 8300. I looked at a f150 and the guy said its towing capacity is 8100. So that would tell me to step up to f250.
I get confused with the total weight vs. towing capacity. I understand the GCVWR is important to know. But I do not know how that relates to towing capacity. Man - I wish someone had an online calculator to input this stuff and get a real birds eye view of what is needed. As far as the truck brakes, engine, transmission being up to it? I do not know how to calculate this? This is in fact turning into rocket science.

Rear end gears and brakes are the two things that affect this the most. Your rear end ratio makes the biggest difference. My Ram 2500 for instance has 3.55 to 1 gearing.The bigger the first number the more mechanical advantage you have. I've seen folks run 4.11 to 1 which will pull a house down. It also makes the engine run faster to maintain a speed. What it means is the drive shaft turns 4.11 times for one ratation of the axle (and wheel). If I were to order a truck new, I'd get about a 3.7 to 3.9 to 1 ratio gearing. Gearing in the transmission helps when you use lower gears, like in traffic, but it only helps a little on the highway.

Oversized brakes are the other part of the setup. 4 wheel discs don't overheat as much as drums and you want trailer brakes on all the axles. If you think you'll use the truck a lot without the trailer and hit the hills with it, I'd recommend going with a 3/4 ton truck like the F250, and see if you can get a deisel. They cost more but have superior towing ability and much better fuel mileage under load. My Ram 2500 with the gas engine can stay with the oil burners, until we get to a fuel stop.

One thing to watch for on diesels, you DON'T want one that's been cranked up. A lot of guys do that to make them smoke and really pull. It also increases wear and shortens the service life of the vehicle. Ford makes a good diesel truck and the Dodge Ram with a Cummins is the puller of choice around the shops where I hang out. The Cummins puts out 1/3 of what it is able but that's so it will last several hundred thousand miles. Diesels are also pretty dainty on some things. Overheat one and you rebuild it. Change the oil and it is in gallons, not quarts. One fellow was talking today and mentioned it takes 3 1/2 gallons to change his oil. Dodge now has a smaller oil burner in the 1/2 ton. I don't know how it will handle pulling.

[cs2kplus]

@ol' grouch...I hear ya. But I don't have a way of weighing the camper at this point - without a truck to take it to a weigh station. As far as loaded weight? I would say it would perhaps be 2 adults and 3 teens max. That's what?....800 lbs right there. So 6500 + 800 = 7300. Added weight to rv? I can only give a high guess of 1000? So now we are at 8300. I looked at a f150 and the guy said its towing capacity is 8100. So that would tell me to step up to f250.
I get confused with the total weight vs. towing capacity. I understand the GCVWR is important to know. But I do not know how that relates to towing capacity. Man - I wish someone had an online calculator to input this stuff and get a real birds eye view of what is needed. As far as the truck brakes, engine, transmission being up to it? I do not know how to calculate this? This is in fact turning into rocket science.

[ol__grouch]

cs2kplus wrote:
@ol'grouch...so if my camper is 6500lbs and truck is what 6500-? Then I need a gcvwr of like 13,000?

I'll give you a definite......maybe. Are each of them 6500 fully loaded? My '01 Ram 2500 weighs in at 6580 with a full tank and no load or passengers. Your brakes, engine, transmission and such need to be up to the task. You'll also need to make sure your truck plates are heavy enough. The heavier the truck, the more road tax you pay. If you truck weighs 7500 pounds loaded with the tongue weight, 7000 pound plates will have you overgross.

I would advise a vehicle combination slightly higher. 14K, maybe 15K. You always want a little extra capacity just for safety.