3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[dash8wrench]

jwitt wrote:
An option to get it without the shipping charges, is to call your LOCAL Kragen, Checker, Schuck's, or Advance Auto Supply, JIM

The option for Advance Auto Parts hasn't worked for me although it is linked from their website. I stopped by a local store and tried to order one. It doesn't show up in their system as available to them. I'm still trying to track down a local vendor.

[professor95]

Would one of these Chinese GenSets of 3000-3500 surge watts work with my welder? I need to be able to do some light welding up at the farm where I have no electricity. The welder is rated at 19.9 volts at 90 amps (20% duty cycle). In theory the welder will put out up to 140 amps but everyone that knows anything about them seems to think that is more than a little optimistic. Hope I've given enough info for the Professor or someone else to help me out.

I have a Century 120. I have used it with .30 flux core wire at the highest amperage setting when plugged into my ELM3000 to weld a new 1/8" thick battery carrier frame into the front of my camper. The welder did not work as well as it does when connected to "shore power". While the metal was pretty thick, there was more spit and sputter from the arc and I had to use a slightly slower spool feed speed than normal.

[jr182pilot]

jwitt wrote:
Hi Pilot... Love those 182's
Sorry about the extra shipping charges. An option to get it without the shipping charges, is to call your LOCAL Kragen, Checker, Schuck's, or Advance Auto Supply, and order the item number. Works over the phone or in person. As an example, I just called a Seattle area Schucks and they can have it in their store in 3-4 days (weekend) and they pick up the shipping charges. Confirmed tonite and in stock..
Most of my time was in 172's
JIM

Jim,

Thanks for the heads up. I never gave it a thought.:Z I canceled my on-line order. Called a Schuck's about 5 mins away and placed a new store order...:) Saved the $59.87 shipping. (More gas $$$ for flying):B Unit should get here Thur. if not sooner...

Yes, 182's are the Best all around Air-O-Planes ever made....:W This coming July we have had ours 10 years. It's one of the reasons for getting the Champion C46540, it will run my air compressor, buffer and whatever at the tie down.....

[Skibane]

jwitt wrote:
On the Kragen site, do not click on generators. Just enter the part #C46540 in the search box. Put it in your shopping basket, it will ask for your zip code. It will then locate a nearby parts store where you can pick it up. NOT JUST KRAGEN, several regional parts stores all over the country.

As mentioned, the Kragen, Shuck's, Checker's, and Advance Auto Parts (formerly Western Auto) regional chains are all combined into one nationwide website under the Parts America name. Both the new and older Champion models are listed on this website - After placing an order, you will be directed to the nearest store in which ever regional chain serves your area to pick up your order.

[jwitt]

Hi Pilot... Love those 182's
Sorry about the extra shipping charges. An option to get it without the shipping charges, is to call your LOCAL Kragen, Checker, Schuck's, or Advance Auto Supply, and order the item number. Works over the phone or in person. As an example, I just called a Seattle area Schucks and they can have it in their store in 3-4 days (weekend) and they pick up the shipping charges. Confirmed tonite and in stock..
Most of my time was in 172's
JIM

[jr182pilot]

jwitt wrote:
Hi Rey,
Yes, I did order online. I picked it up and the picture is of my unit. The item number in the post is correct. On the Kragen site, do not click on generators. Just enter the part #C46540 in the search box. Put it in your shopping basket, it will ask for your zip code. It will then locate a nearby parts store where you can pick it up. NOT JUST KRAGEN, several regional parts stores all over the country. 1-2 day delivery. It is now listed @ $299.00.
Be careful, they still are selling the old one at the same price. The OLD generator in part #C46535.... JIM

Thanks for the Info Jim,

I just went to Kragen site and placed an order for the #C46540.:) for $299.00 No units in the Seattle area as yet, so had to pay for shipping ($58.97) it's coming from Mendota Heights, MN. So will take a week or so to get here.:(

[triplej]

cuchara.red wrote:
Newbie here...

I was at Pep Boys today looking at their Wen Power Pro 3500. It has one duplex 120 vac outlet and one 4-hole 120/240 vac outlet, with a switch between the two outlets to select either the duplex 120 outlet or the 120/240 vac outlet. Professor, do you know if this particular unit has the Honda clone engine and is it capable of putting all its amperage into one 120 vac outlet? It seems to me that the same requirements for powering a camper/TT/MH would also let the genset power my welder. Is this reasonable?

I bought the same gen set a few weeks ago. Yes it does have the Honda clone engine and it is capable of putting all its amps into the 120 vac outlet. A few pages back the Prof goes over the schematic for this unit and explains why it it is capable of doing this. (thanks again Prof!!!!)

Hope this helps.

[catalina30]

cuchara.red wrote:
Newbie here...

I've been following this forum for awhile and find it fascinating. So much knowledge! And, for me, so much confusion. I've got a small Class C ('91 Toyota Dolphin) and would love to be able to use one of these GenSets with it. However, a more pressing need is to be able to run my 120 vac wire-feed welder off the same unit (not at the same time of course). The welder is a Lincoln ProMig 140 and only has a 15 amp plug, not the 20 amp plug with right-angle blades. It appears to work fine on a 15 amp garage circuit, even tho' a 20 amp circuit is recommended. Would one of these Chinese GenSets of 3000-3500 surge watts work with my welder? I need to be able to do some light welding up at the farm where I have no electricity. The welder is rated at 19.9 volts at 90 amps (20% duty cycle). In theory the welder will put out up to 140 amps but everyone that knows anything about them seems to think that is more than a little optimistic. Hope I've given enough info for the Professor or someone else to help me out.

I was at Pep Boys today looking at their Wen Power Pro 3500. It has one duplex 120 vac outlet and one 4-hole 120/240 vac outlet, with a switch between the two outlets to select either the duplex 120 outlet or the 120/240 vac outlet. Professor, do you know if this particular unit has the Honda clone engine and is it capable of putting all its amperage into one 120 vac outlet? It seems to me that the same requirements for powering a camper/TT/MH would also let the genset power my welder. Is this reasonable?

Thanks to this forum I've gone from being highly skeptical of the Chinese GenSets to being anxious to try one out - if it'll support my welder as well as the RV. Thankie again.

My generator will and has run manytimes my harbor freight 130 flux/gas MIG welder. I suppose it will weld together whatever you want if you can. I always try for more than the duty cycle will allow and the gen just keeps up with it.

Kevin
The Right Lane

[MrWizard]

my linclon 90amp wire feed works great from the RV 4.5 kw

and I have run it from a 2500 watt portable, but it was not a full capability

from this experince I think the 3500 would NOT carry your 140 under full load

it might work for some tacking or light sheet & small work, BUT I don't think you could weld heavy tractor parts back together..

but if your a better welder than me , you might

[cuchara_red1]

Newbie here...

I've been following this forum for awhile and find it fascinating. So much knowledge! And, for me, so much confusion. I've got a small Class C ('91 Toyota Dolphin) and would love to be able to use one of these GenSets with it. However, a more pressing need is to be able to run my 120 vac wire-feed welder off the same unit (not at the same time of course). The welder is a Lincoln ProMig 140 and only has a 15 amp plug, not the 20 amp plug with right-angle blades. It appears to work fine on a 15 amp garage circuit, even tho' a 20 amp circuit is recommended. Would one of these Chinese GenSets of 3000-3500 surge watts work with my welder? I need to be able to do some light welding up at the farm where I have no electricity. The welder is rated at 19.9 volts at 90 amps (20% duty cycle). In theory the welder will put out up to 140 amps but everyone that knows anything about them seems to think that is more than a little optimistic. Hope I've given enough info for the Professor or someone else to help me out.

I was at Pep Boys today looking at their Wen Power Pro 3500. It has one duplex 120 vac outlet and one 4-hole 120/240 vac outlet, with a switch between the two outlets to select either the duplex 120 outlet or the 120/240 vac outlet. Professor, do you know if this particular unit has the Honda clone engine and is it capable of putting all its amperage into one 120 vac outlet? It seems to me that the same requirements for powering a camper/TT/MH would also let the genset power my welder. Is this reasonable?

Thanks to this forum I've gone from being highly skeptical of the Chinese GenSets to being anxious to try one out - if it'll support my welder as well as the RV. Thankie again.

[mcmurphrjk]

As a matter of fact, I e-mailed champion tech support last week andasked if they would offer such a conversion. To date I have not received a reply

[AZDesertRat]

Someone ought to talk with Champion and see if they could sell a conversion kit to make the older models into the RV model. I would do it if I could get the new panel and outlets so it would not look cobbled up.

[jwitt]

Hi Rey,
Yes, I did order online. I picked it up and the picture is of my unit. The item number in the post is correct. On the Kragen site, do not click on generators. Just enter the part #C46540 in the search box. Put it in your shopping basket, it will ask for your zip code. It will then locate a nearby parts store where you can pick it up. NOT JUST KRAGEN, several regional parts stores all over the country. 1-2 day delivery. It is now listed @ $299.00.
Be careful, they still are selling the old one at the same price. The OLD generator in part #C46535.... JIM

[FreeFlighter]

jwitt wrote:
NEW RV PLUG GENSET!! NO NEED TO REWIRE.
I'm a newbe with this forum thing, so I hope I can get a picture to upload. I just picked up one of the new Champion RV model 3500 watt Gensets. I have been following the forum and was about to get the regular model and do the wiring mod. I called Champion Tech and was told that it hadn't shipped as yet, and they could not advise when it would. I later talked to their phone operator. She said it had been shipping for two weeks to the Kragen Auto Parts group. She was able to advise the new part # C46540. I checked with Kragen online searching the part number and there it was. No picture yet, but ships in 24 hours.
Im happy, it has a 120-240 switch and of course the 30 Amp RV style plug (29.6amps:)). Also, 240 twist lock, separate 120 and the 12v.
Well, I hope the picture follows correctly... JIM

Did you actually order this online? If so, did you receive the correct model? I hate to use you as a guinea pig, but if you have already ordered it I'd like to know if they are shipping the new model. We don't have any Kragen's , etc. here.

Rey

[subcamper]

XR4rider:

Yes I have had the same thing happen a few times with my Elim3000 (not the later L model). I did some preliminary testing when I got my Elim3000 and noticed that the voltage actually went UP as it went from no load to max load. Maybe the microwave didn't like the low voltage, until the added load of the AC brought up the voltage to an acceptable level. Most of the time mine is ok, this only happened a few times.

Steve