Mar-02-2005 06:20 AM
professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.
In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.
Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.
What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.
Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.
I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.
Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.
No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.
Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.
Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.
We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.
Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.
Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.
This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......
Randy
For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.
I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:
Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)
The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.
The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.
The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.
ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.
The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.
The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...
Jul-29-2011 08:11 PM
Jul-29-2011 05:34 PM
gnolivos wrote:
I looked at the circuit diagram again. In my opinion the AVR only monitors one winding under the 120/240V plug. This would explain why loading the other side with a sump pump would cause the Voltage to drop. (no regulation!). Can you triple check your diagram and confirm what you see?
Also, this is driving me CRAZY... So essentially I have a 3500 Watt generator, but I have no way or utilizing the full capacity in my household (for emergencies). I cannot find a TT-30P RV cord with the RV plug on one side, and regular 120V household plugs on the other. That I think would solve my issue.
Jul-29-2011 11:51 AM
professor95 wrote:
Can you give me a guessestimate as to what the loads were or even a measured figure if you have the ability to measure? Kill-A-Watt meters do an excellent job of giving current and voltage up to loads of 15 amps and fit the North American style duplex outlet. For their low cost they make a good RVer investment. A voltage drop down to 95V is not anything close to normal. You may have other problems that need investigating.
The most useful information would be the amperage and voltage on the leg from MW1 and then the amperage and voltage on MW2 as the generator is running. Then, switch loads to the opposite legs and take the measurements again.
Jul-29-2011 11:31 AM
Jul-29-2011 06:18 AM
gnolivos wrote:
Professor... when using the 120/240V outlet, only one leg is regulated. (or so I thought?) My cord had four outlets on the other end... one pair from one leg, the other pair from the other leg. My belief has been that when loading on the unregulated leg caused the voltage to drop considerably from 120 down to 95V etc.
Jul-29-2011 05:00 AM
professor95 wrote:
I would like to know what "all sorts of issues" you experienced with your generator cord. This could help me considerably to further understand how to answer any remaining questions you may have.
Jul-28-2011 10:33 PM
Jul-28-2011 07:11 PM
gnolivos wrote:
Hello all. Simple question...
Can anyone confirm that on the Champion C46540 generator, one can use the RV Plug (L5-30P, 3 prong, 30 Watt outlet) to power up 120V devices at home, WHILE MAINTAINING A REGULATED VOLTAGE?
The reason I ask is because my tests on the 120/240V outlet indicate that only one leg is regulated, and it caused all sorts of issues with my generator cord. (2 outlet at the end of the cord were regulated, the other 2 where not).
I'm planning on using one of these:
http://www.amazon.com/Coleman-Cable-25-Foot-Generator-3-Outlets/dp/B000289BAK
Thanks for any help!
Jul-28-2011 06:27 PM
Jul-28-2011 02:00 PM
Jul-27-2011 07:24 PM
Jul-27-2011 07:15 PM
professor95 wrote:DrBaker wrote:
What's the trick to searching this thread?
I tried doing searches for "champion electric start kit", "champion electric start conversion", and "champion propane conversion". All 3 attempts came up with nothing. What should I be doing to find this info? I bet it's all in here somewhere.
I would like to find the info on doing a propane conversion, adding electric start, and adding remote start to a Champ 4000/3500. If anyone can give me a link or instructions to find it on my own, I would appreciate it.
Use the advanced search feature, type in your keywords and (:Z ) add professor95 to the author box. Select search in the archives (over 12 months.)
Be sure you are searching in Tech Issues
All of the above topics are ones that I have extensively covered. If the search feature is working (sometimes it is not and you get an error) you should find the section.
Jul-27-2011 07:10 PM
DrBaker wrote:
What's the trick to searching this thread?
I tried doing searches for "champion electric start kit", "champion electric start conversion", and "champion propane conversion". All 3 attempts came up with nothing. What should I be doing to find this info? I bet it's all in here somewhere.
I would like to find the info on doing a propane conversion, adding electric start, and adding remote start to a Champ 4000/3500. If anyone can give me a link or instructions to find it on my own, I would appreciate it.
Jul-27-2011 06:11 PM
Jul-27-2011 06:19 AM