3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[DPGBG]

ok. I believe I figure out how to add the picture. Here is the wiring schematic.

Also this is what I tested that I believe should have worked.. Didn't tho.

Thanks all

[DPGBG]

Gdetrailer. Yes sir I've seen that. Studied it for days. lol. Great info but for some reason mine will not work like that. Thanks though.

I do have the two whites that connect at the 240 plug.

I don't have an o scope but there is 4 wires coming out and I just can't figure why its not working. I'm beginning to think the AVR is stopping it however I can't see how. I mean I have two that are hot and two that are neutral. I can test them so I know which are which coil. That is easy enough to figure out and there is only so many ways you can hook them up. ??? I just don't get it. Something is keeping it from paralleling..

Wondering if the AVR has to see a neutral in the system for it to work??

I did meter it once without the neutral bond and the volts are high, red to white and black to white around 185 volts if I remember correct. So maybe that means the AVR needs the neutral to work. Without the neutral bond it seems like it's not controlling the voltage.

Any thoughts...

[Gdetrailer]

DPGBG wrote:
Hello all. First time posting and impressed with the help on this forum.

Also I started a new topic, This one is so huge it's hard to find anything in the tons of knowledge listed. However I thought better put on here also as my other might get overlooked. new topic is also in test issues.

I'm trying to re-wire a HF generator to parallel. I have tried many things I found on this site as well as others and I just cant seem to get it to work. I have the wiring diagram but not sure how to get it on this forum. If anyone can help I can e-mail it to you.

What I have tried was to switch the wires as explained in the 3000W Chinese Gensets Info. topic on this site. I do that and I get 20 volts across the two outputs. I also read that if you get 0 to 50ish volts to switch a set of leads. I didn't try this and I'm not 100% clear on which two leads to switch??

To try and explain without the diagram, I have 4 wires coming out of gen head. Coil 1 has Red and White. Coil 2 has white and black. Red and black are power and whites are neutrals. Coil 2 is the only coil that the AVR monitors.

So at the terminal block, I take coil 1 red and coil 2 white and put them together, and coil 2 black and coil 1 white and put them together. When metering across the two I get 20 volts.

I have been testing at the terminal block figuring if I can get it to 120 volts there then I will worry about the rest of the plugs and things down stream.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks all..

Does your 240V outlet have TWO wires on the Neutral connection?

If so, you should be able to isolate the two 120V windings that are in series for 240V. The Neutral connector is the "center tap" if you will. Breaking that connection separates the two 120V windings but keep in mind that to get both windings together you must observe that the windings are not reversed "phase".

Easiest way to determine proper phase would be the use of a O' scope so you can observe the waveforms.

The following website talks about a Coleman 120/240V gen being converted to 120V only and has some good diagrams and info on the conversion that you might find helpful.

Generator rewire

[MrRchitty]

Ok. Give me a few.

[Trimsters]

MrRchitty , please post the solution. I've got similar issues.
Thanks

[2oldman]

DPGBG wrote:
This one is so huge it's hard to find anything in the tons of knowledge listed.

True. I've never found a way to search a thread.

[MrRchitty]

DPGBG wrote:
Hello all. First time posting and impressed with the help on this forum.

Also I started a new topic, This one is so huge it's hard to find anything in the tons of knowledge listed. However I thought better put on here also as my other might get overlooked. new topic is also in test issues.

I'm trying to re-wire a HF generator to parallel. I have tried many things I found on this site as well as others and I just cant seem to get it to work. I have the wiring diagram but not sure how to get it on this forum. If anyone can help I can e-mail it to you.

What I have tried was to switch the wires as explained in the 3000W Chinese Gensets Info. topic on this site. I do that and I get 20 volts across the two outputs. I also read that if you get 0 to 50ish volts to switch a set of leads. I didn't try this and I'm not 100% clear on which two leads to switch??

To try and explain without the diagram, I have 4 wires coming out of gen head. Coil 1 has Red and White. Coil 2 has white and black. Red and black are power and whites are neutrals. Coil 2 is the only coil that the AVR monitors.

So at the terminal block, I take coil 1 red and coil 2 white and put them together, and coil 2 black and coil 1 white and put them together. When metering across the two I get 20 volts.

I have been testing at the terminal block figuring if I can get it to 120 volts there then I will worry about the rest of the plugs and things down stream.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks all..

Message me above. I know what you're talking about. You're on the right track and have done this before. I need model number of HF generator.

[DPGBG]

Hello all. First time posting and impressed with the help on this forum.

Also I started a new topic, This one is so huge it's hard to find anything in the tons of knowledge listed. However I thought better put on here also as my other might get overlooked. new topic is also in test issues.

I'm trying to re-wire a HF generator to parallel. I have tried many things I found on this site as well as others and I just cant seem to get it to work. I have the wiring diagram but not sure how to get it on this forum. If anyone can help I can e-mail it to you.

What I have tried was to switch the wires as explained in the 3000W Chinese Gensets Info. topic on this site. I do that and I get 20 volts across the two outputs. I also read that if you get 0 to 50ish volts to switch a set of leads. I didn't try this and I'm not 100% clear on which two leads to switch??

To try and explain without the diagram, I have 4 wires coming out of gen head. Coil 1 has Red and White. Coil 2 has white and black. Red and black are power and whites are neutrals. Coil 2 is the only coil that the AVR monitors.

So at the terminal block, I take coil 1 red and coil 2 white and put them together, and coil 2 black and coil 1 white and put them together. When metering across the two I get 20 volts.

I have been testing at the terminal block figuring if I can get it to 120 volts there then I will worry about the rest of the plugs and things down stream.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks all..

[Trimsters]

Actually I have not selected a location. I'm open for suggestions.
Oh, typo in my message. We have a 36' Toyhauler.
Some thinking out loud...
If I put it below the genset, then I need a fuel pump of some kind, and the flow back line, etc. I have the room to do that under the frame.
But, just wondering what other had done when they decided to install the genset into the rig instead of keeping it mobile outside of the rig.
Thoughts, suggestions and cautions welcome.

Bob

[Dtank]

Was going to reply, but saw the date of your post

A new thread (with the Q) would have been a better choice - -
and by now -no doubt- you selected a location..:C

.

[Trimsters]

What have others done for carrying GASoline after taking off the stock tank on the generator? I'm going to convert to dual fuel an want to carry 5-10 gals of gasoline. I can put it in the nose of the rig or under the frame in the rear where the optional (but not purchased) fuel station was to go. I have a 26' toy hauler .

[Teeton]

Check ebay for engine oil/transmission oil cooler fans. You may find a good fit/size. For only 15 bucks.

[MrWizard]

Yes electric radiator fan should work..

[Trimsters]

Big thanks.

[MrRchitty]

Trimsters wrote:
Quick question about something that was covered somewhere in the 498 pages of this wonderful thread....and I can't find it.

I am mounting my Champion in the nose compartment of my 5er. I need airflow to pull off the heat. There was a nice series of install pics here about putting a fan through the floor of the compartment. If someone remembers where the posts are (pages), that would be helpful. But what I'm planning on doing is installing a car radiator fan. Will that work?

Thanks all.

Page 360 and 362 starts some conversation about it. Take it from there.