Chinese generator fuel pump

[mkirsch]

A few weeks back, I posted about my Chinese generator not running off the built-in fuel tank, but running fine off an external test tank I rigged up during the power outage.



I have had some time to do some experimenting. The generator starts easily and runs perfectly off this external tank for hours. It is hard to start, surges, stalls, and won't restart after 20-30 minutes on the built-in tank.

I've done all the troubleshooting, and I've determined that the engine simply is not providing adequate impulse to the fuel pump to pump enough fuel to the carburetor. The tank is clean. The lines are fine. The pump is fine.

I'm giving up any hope of running it on the built-in tank going forward.

Does anyone have any ideas for an extended-run style setup for this generator that bypasses the factory tank?

[johnm1]

Or, since you're in Rochester, take it to Supergen (they're in Newark). I've done that and they were super helpful.

[MrWizard]

Then there is a vacuum leak somewhere, or major design flaw
If it was mine, I would cap the port, remove the pump, and try a gravity flow from main tank to carb
Then try the SuperGen add-on

[mkirsch]

MrWizard wrote:
Sounds like a blockage in that port
The SuperGen kit, will not use the original port, since it is an add-on for engines that did not have the fuel pump and port
I believe it has an adapter plate/port that goes in between the carb and intake, an easy bolt in place type of thing
And I think it's less than $99

Already went there too.

I stuck a snug-fitting drill bit into the impulse port and it's clean and open straight into the intake port on the engine.

[mkirsch]

PaulJ2 wrote:
Shutting down after running a while with on board tank usually means improper venting of fuel tank cap. I assume you have checked this out already?

Yes, I have checked that.

It does not run any better when I remove the cap completely.

[MrWizard]

mkirsch wrote:

K Charles wrote:
A pulse fuel pump is less the $20, I would just get a new one. Make sure the pulse line isn't cracked.

Already did that. Pump is brand new. Lines are fine.

I can suck and blow on the impulse line and fuel SHOOTS out. When connected to the impulse port on the engine intake, it barely dribbles and doesn't have enough "head" to get the fuel up into the carburetor.

Sounds like a blockage in that port
The SuperGen kit, will not use the original port, since it is an add-on for engines that did not have the fuel pump and port
I believe it has an adapter plate/port that goes in between the carb and intake, an easy bolt in place type of thing
And I think it's less than $99

[wnjj]

hbillsmith wrote:

PaulJ2 wrote:
Shutting down after running a while with on board tank usually means improper venting of fuel tank cap. I assume you have checked this out already?

Not sure what you mean?

If I'm running with the on board tank, the system bypasses and does not use the external tank at all. Whatever venting of the fuel tank cap is unchanged. The method for adding Extended Run using an External Tank DOES NOT alter the fuel tank cap at all.

Perhaps you are thinking about the method used to add extended run to Yamaha and/or Honda inverters. There are extended run options for those brands that include a modified fuel cap. They can work that way because both Yamaha and Honda have built-in fuel pumps.

When using the Champion's on board tank, it operates as if unmodified and utilizes the default fuel gravity feed from onboard tank to carb. The Extended Run option inserts a vacuum fuel pump and a why connection ahead of the carb. The Champions Fuel Selector knob whose default function is "On" and "Off" assumes a different role and what was pre-modified "On" becomes "On Onboard Tank" and what was pre-modified "Off" becomes "Off for External Tank Use".

If I'm missing something here, I'd to know more.

He's answering the OP, not yours and suggesting that improper venting of the original tank could cause his issue.

OP, I assume you tried running with the cap off?

[hbillsmith]

PaulJ2 wrote:
Shutting down after running a while with on board tank usually means improper venting of fuel tank cap. I assume you have checked this out already?

Not sure what you mean?

If I'm running with the on board tank, the system bypasses and does not use the external tank at all. Whatever venting of the fuel tank cap is unchanged. The method for adding Extended Run using an External Tank DOES NOT alter the fuel tank cap at all.

Perhaps you are thinking about the method used to add extended run to Yamaha and/or Honda inverters. There are extended run options for those brands that include a modified fuel cap. They can work that way because both Yamaha and Honda have built-in fuel pumps.

When using the Champion's on board tank, it operates as if unmodified and utilizes the default fuel gravity feed from onboard tank to carb. The Extended Run option inserts a vacuum fuel pump and a why connection ahead of the carb. The Champions Fuel Selector knob whose default function is "On" and "Off" assumes a different role and what was pre-modified "On" becomes "On Onboard Tank" and what was pre-modified "Off" becomes "Off for External Tank Use".

If I'm missing something here, I'd to know more.

[PaulJ2]

Shutting down after running a while with on board tank usually means improper venting of fuel tank cap. I assume you have checked this out already?

[hbillsmith]

Take a look at this thread all about adding Extended Run to a Champion Inverter/Generator
Champion Extended Run Fuel Option RV.NET thread

- Basically, you will watch the youtube video by Pinellas that explains adding the option. Link is here:
Pinellas How To for Champion Extended Run kit

Then you can do one of the following:

1) Order the kit from either Bottom Line Trading Company in Austin TX or from Supergen (cost roughly $200) or;

2) See the attachment in that thread which has the entire parts list if you want to order the pieces from Amazon and just do it your self (total cost about $75)

This option lets you use a standard portable marine tank like you would find being used on small outboard motors. I did the conversion and use my already owned Yamaha 6 gal. tank and bulb-type fuel hose. You can get as big a tank as your want. If you don't have a marine tank, just get one with a Yamaha connector from places like Amazon, Walmart or Academy. A 6-gal and hose should be about $70 or so.

A couple of final notes:
- You can't do this on the Dual-Fuel type Inverters because your added external tank will become active when you turn the fuel switch to the off position. In the propane enabled units, the off position switches to propane.
- You can choose to always just use the external tank and this leaves the onboard tank completely dry. Makes storage and winterize much easier. Or you can choose to use both tanks and switch to onboard while you take the external tank to the gas station for a refill.
- Note that the external option DOES NOT pump fuel into the onboard tank, the design uses a lawn-mower type vacuum pump that sends fuel to the carb. The onboard fuel tank is just a gravity feed type.

[mkirsch]

K Charles wrote:
A pulse fuel pump is less the $20, I would just get a new one. Make sure the pulse line isn't cracked.

Already did that. Pump is brand new. Lines are fine.

I can suck and blow on the impulse line and fuel SHOOTS out. When connected to the impulse port on the engine intake, it barely dribbles and doesn't have enough "head" to get the fuel up into the carburetor.

[johnm1]

MrWizard wrote:
SuperGen Products
Has an extended run fuel pump kit, for the champion inverter generators
It is vacuum operated, it might fit
How well this would work as a replacement or work around I don't know
But it would not hurt to call them, Paul Cole senior, would be the guy to talk too
He knows a lot about these Chinese engines

Boy I wish I knew that a few weeks ago when the Champions were running my house from the wind storm! The care and feeding of the 2 2kw inverters was a pain ... especially at night when they ran out of fuel. I've been to SuperGen a few times as they're "only" a 40 min drive from my house.

[K_Charles]

A pulse fuel pump is less the $20, I would just get a new one. Make sure the pulse line isn't cracked.

[MrWizard]

SuperGen Products
Has an extended run fuel pump kit, for the champion inverter generators
It is vacuum operated, it might fit
How well this would work as a replacement or work around I don't know
But it would not hurt to call them, Paul Cole senior, would be the guy to talk too
He knows a lot about these Chinese engines

[mkirsch]

It does not have 12V.

Yes, it is gravity feed now but I would rather have something a little more convenient and portable.