Looking for LOWEST BTU Roof A/C available-

[bobinyelm]

I am looking for a power-miser roof A/C to replace my 13,500 BTU roof air the PO of my well-insulated BigFoot truck camper installed (throwing out the perfectly good OEM 7700 BTU unit).

He did it for "instant cooling" with hook-up campgrounds, but I want a unit that my little Honda 2000i genset can easily handle boondocking.

The smallest I can currently find is a Coleman 9200 BTU unit, so I'm hoping someone here may have an alternative.

Bob

[otrfun]

NinerBikes wrote:

otrfun wrote:

coolmom42 wrote:

NinerBikes wrote:
Might just be easier/cheaper to pair another Honda Eu2000i with cables to run the A/C, both of them in Eco mode. Or a Yamaha EF2400Is model, solo.

This is a very good point. You could sell the Champion to subsidize another Honda.

I tried just what you both suggested. Had a Champion 3100 (paid $750) that ran/started my 13.5k BTU a/c just fine with the ECO mode on. Wanted something a bit quieter and purchased two, new EU2000i's for $1900 figuring these two puppies would be the end-all solution--tons of power, quiet--woo-hoo! Well, as it turned out, the two EU2000i's paralleled would not start this same 13.5k BTU a/c with the ECO mode on---discovered the Champion 3100 produces more inrush current than two EU2000i's paralleled (with the ECO mode on and off).

The Champion 3100 with the ECO mode on (which results in a reduction in sound level when the a/c compressor turns off) ended up being quieter, less irritating, overall (IMO), than the two EU2000i's running full-throttle continuously with the ECO mode off.

Interesting... because I run a Dometic 13.5k, nothing special on my 2 Honda Eu2000i's in Eco mode off, only to start the AC the first time, then once the AC is running, eco mode goes on for both units, and both my gennies loaf along then... the big grunt is starting up the AC, the surge, but once running, it draws 10 to 11 amps, tops, easy for a pair of Eu2000i's to handle that in eco mode on.

Next step for you, if you already still have the Honda's is to get an easy start capacitor for your model AC. I would also look into getting some heavier wiring... Is one of your Eu2000i's a Honda Companion model with the 30 amp jack plug in, or are they both standard Eu2000i's with 15 amp normal wall sockets?

NinerBikes, I'm glad your EU2000i's work for you (with the ECO mode on); however, I get the impression they're right "on the edge" of doing so.

Good point about the start cap. My Dometic 13.5k BTU a/c is an OEM unit that came without a start capacitor. I tried installing a couple of Supco/Dometic PTCR's, and even tried the more expensive Dometic 3102903.006 start kit (originally for the Onan 2.8) with the outboard coil relay. Although there was a reduction in inrush/startup current, it wasn't enough to allow the two EU2000i's to start the Dometic with the ECO mode on. And yes, I was using the L5 30 amp outlet on the companion model along with a short, 10 ft. 10 gauge power cable. I'm confident I had very little internal wiring loss because there were minimal differences in inrush current readings at the a/c unit itself vs. the generator output.

Have to admit going through the aforementioned process was pretty frustrating. Already had the $750 Champion 3100 (although a tad louder than I preferred) which powered my Dometic 13.5k BTU a/c effortlessly with the ECO mode on. Then to spend $1900 only to discover a pair of EU2000i's could not. In any case, it all worked out because I got my $1900 back via Craiglist in less than an hour. There's no disputing the reputation, demand, and resale value of a Honda generator!

FWIW, I mentioned this in a post several months ago, but was bit surprised that it received very little fanfare. Although paralleling two EU2000i's doubles the "continuous" current output, there is only a 10-15% increase in inrush current output (vs. one EU2000i). Gotta wonder why.

IMO, the continuous (and "surge") rating always advertised by manufacturers is really moot for the average RV'r. As I've said before, one EU2000i is capable of "running" the vast majority of RV a/c units . . . IF it could start 'em. The realworld limiting factor is inrush current capability.

[otrfun]

Oops, double post.

[NinerBikes]

otrfun wrote:

coolmom42 wrote:

NinerBikes wrote:
Might just be easier/cheaper to pair another Honda Eu2000i with cables to run the A/C, both of them in Eco mode. Or a Yamaha EF2400Is model, solo.

This is a very good point. You could sell the Champion to subsidize another Honda.

I tried just what you both suggested. Had a Champion 3100 (paid $750) that ran/started my 13.5k BTU a/c just fine with the ECO mode on. Wanted something a bit quieter and purchased two, new EU2000i's for $1900 figuring these two puppies would be the end-all solution--tons of power, quiet--woo-hoo! Well, as it turned out, the two EU2000i's paralleled would not start this same 13.5k BTU a/c with the ECO mode on---discovered the Champion 3100 produces more inrush current than two EU2000i's paralleled (with the ECO mode on and off).

The Champion 3100 with the ECO mode on (which results in a reduction in sound level when the a/c compressor turns off) ended up being quieter, less irritating, overall (IMO), than the two EU2000i's running full-throttle continuously with the ECO mode off.

Interesting... because I run a Dometic 13.5k, nothing special on my 2 Honda Eu2000i's in Eco mode off, only to start the AC the first time, then once the AC is running, eco mode goes on for both units, and both my gennies loaf along then... the big grunt is starting up the AC, the surge, but once running, it draws 10 to 11 amps, tops, easy for a pair of Eu2000i's to handle that in eco mode on.

Next step for you, if you already still have the Honda's is to get an easy start capacitor for your model AC. I would also look into getting some heavier wiring... Is one of your Eu2000i's a Honda Companion model with the 30 amp jack plug in, or are they both standard Eu2000i's with 15 amp normal wall sockets?

[otrfun]

coolmom42 wrote:

NinerBikes wrote:
Might just be easier/cheaper to pair another Honda Eu2000i with cables to run the A/C, both of them in Eco mode. Or a Yamaha EF2400Is model, solo.

This is a very good point. You could sell the Champion to subsidize another Honda.

I tried just what you both suggested. Had a Champion 3100 (paid $750) that ran/started my 13.5k BTU a/c just fine with the ECO mode on. Wanted something a bit quieter and purchased two, new EU2000i's for $1900 figuring these two puppies would be the end-all solution--tons of power, quiet--woo-hoo! Well, as it turned out, the two EU2000i's paralleled would not start this same 13.5k BTU a/c with the ECO mode on---discovered the Champion 3100 produces more inrush current than two EU2000i's paralleled (with the ECO mode on and off).

The Champion 3100 with the ECO mode on (which results in a reduction in sound level when the a/c compressor turns off) ended up being quieter, less irritating, overall (IMO), than the two EU2000i's running full-throttle continuously with the ECO mode off.

[CJW8]

Here is an option, although designed to be portable, with some ingenuity, I'll bet it could be made to be semi permanent.CruseAir CarryOn

Designed for boat hatches. They came as large as 7000 btu's. I have a 5000 btu and my 2k Kipor runs it just fine. It list 6A running and 18A starting.

[bobinyelm]

To the OP, looks like your question was answered here.

I guess that's my cue to close the thread, then, and unsubscribe.

[bobinyelm]

coolmom42 wrote:

NinerBikes wrote:
Might just be easier/cheaper to pair another Honda Eu2000i with cables to run the A/C, both of them in Eco mode. Or a Yamaha EF2400Is model, solo.

This is a very good point. You could sell the Champion to subsidize another Honda.

It's not a good point at all IMHO, but thanks.

I have no interest whatsoever running two Hondas, and I don't believe I expressed interest in selling the Champion, though I guess I must have somehow given that impression.

I bought the Champion to sit in my P/U to run the 13.5 in my 5th wheel.

I want an A/C I can run w/ the Honda for the truck, and I guess unless I find a used 7700 or 8300 Cub, or a 7100 DuoTherm (I found was once popular), I'll probably go with a Mach 1 PS 11,000.

[bobinyelm]

-

[mena661]

otrfun wrote:

To my knowledge these two, latest generation 9xx series Coleman Mach Power Saver a/c units have the lowest LRA ratings of any 11,000 or 13,500 BTU a/c units on the market:

Coleman 11,000 BTU

Coleman 13,500 BTU

A Honda EU2000i will easily start and run the 11,000 BTU 482x7-9xx (LRA 41.5 amps), and has very, very good chance of starting and running the 13,500 BTU 482x8-9xx (LRA 50.5 amps) . . . with the ECO mode on.

Do not confuse the 9xx series with the previous generation Coleman Power Saver 8xx series. The 8xx series have a much migher LRA.

My two cents . . .

To the OP, looks like your question was answered here.

[coolmom42]

NinerBikes wrote:
Might just be easier/cheaper to pair another Honda Eu2000i with cables to run the A/C, both of them in Eco mode. Or a Yamaha EF2400Is model, solo.

This is a very good point. You could sell the Champion to subsidize another Honda.

[bobinyelm]

NinerBikes wrote:
Might just be easier/cheaper to pair another Honda Eu2000i with cables to run the A/C, both of them in Eco mode. Or a Yamaha EF2400Is model, solo.

Might be, but carrying a pair of generators to run a grossly wasteful A/C doesn't appeal, and will a Yamaha fit in my truck's rear foot-well like a single Honda, and can I carry it with one had (despite my 4 back surgeries) like my Honda?

Not sure how buying another $1000 Honda, or a single $1400 Yamaha is cheaper, except I guess I could sell the Honda I have for $600, meaning I would break even vs. replacing my current A/C w/ a Honda compatible unit.

Beside, as I said one post above, I already have a Champion 3100i which is only 1" or so larger in each dimension, and under 10lb heavier than the Yamaha 2400 Yamaha vs. Champion Comparison

I don't mean to sound stubborn, or argumentative, but the generator solution doesn't sound preferable to me.

[NinerBikes]

Might just be easier/cheaper to pair another Honda Eu2000i with cables to run the A/C, both of them in Eco mode. Or a Yamaha EF2400Is model, solo.

[bobinyelm]

Thanks-

Nice to know the combination actually works before I go and drop over $600 anyway!

I can probably sell my 13.5 for something since it has about 10 hours total on it!

I have a 3100w Champion inverter genset that would run the 13.5, but when I use the truck camper, I can easily put the 46# Honda in the truck's rear foot-well, where as the 85# Champion is a bit less "heft-a-ble," and not as compact, but will sit fine in he BED of my P/U when towing the 5th wheel.

[otrfun]

bobinyelm wrote:
Yes-

That spec sheet is for the 3PS via the link from another poster.

The specs for the 11,000 BTU 9XX Series Mach 1 you mention is:

Mach 1 9XX Specs

This is lower then the 3 so-called "Power Saver" units.

It would SEEM that my Honda 2000i might run it based on the specs-

These are the specs for the new 9200BTU Polar Cub Casita installs:
Polar Cub 9201 9200 BTU Specs
but many Casita users say their Honda 2000i struggles to start that one (plus due to higher fan speeds for use with R410A it's objectionably noisier than the OLD R-22 Polar Cub Series).

Strange that it is 9200 BTU in the 9XX Series you mention (and makes me wonder why Casita doesn't install the Mach 1PS instead), but the LRA is HIGHER (45.6) vs. the 11,000 BTU Mach 1 LRA at (41.5).

Confusing!

But Click Here is a thread where someone with a truck camper tried using the Coleman Mach 1 PS 11,000 BTU unit you suggest, and it worked fine (at cold temperatures) with a Honda 2000i genset.

I mention that because I noticed that my 5th wheel A/C uses OVER 15a at hot temps (116 deg ambient, but more like 145 deg on asphalt) and tripped its 15a breaker running, yet when the inside air cooled to the 80's (after the A/C had been running a long time) the unit was only drawing around 12 amps. (I've learned carry a clamp ammeter w/ me at all times).

The only way I could keep the breaker in was by pointing a fan at the CB panel until the A/C had cooled the RV interior down a lot. The coolest I could get it it in my 5er was about 87 degrees at the hottest part of the day, but that was AZ parked on an asphalt RV campground lot, a pretty extreme condition which I mention only because A/Cs take a LOT more current in high ambient temps (The Coleman chart in the link shows 25% more in desert conditions, in fact) .

There are still older, 8xx Coleman Mach 1 Power Saver 11,000 BTU's being sold. It's very possible the individual in this Nov 2013 link had an 8xx series Coleman Mach 1 Power Saver 11,000 BTU with a higher LRA.

FWIW (and it may be worth little--lol!!), I've run my 13,500 Dometic a/c with an LRA of 63 amps with one EU2000i with the ECO mode off. I have also seen one EU2000i power a 9xx Coleman Mach 1 Power Saver 11,000 BTU in southern AZ heat (108 deg day temps; 90 deg night temps) for 48 hours straight with the ECO mode on.

Ref your comments about changing conditions, if you click on the links in my first post in this thread, you'll note Coleman gives some specs under extreme desert conditions.

In any case, there are no guarantees, only calculated risks. As always YMMV.

Good luck!