Underground 250ft run

[Red_man]

I need to put a 30 amp 125 volt outlet 250 feet away from main panel I need to know what size wires to get or romex and material needed, outlet is going to be for travel trailer and will be occupied.

[Alan_Hepburn]

I remember, back in the late '60s I was working as part of a cable TV construction crew in Foster City, California. That was when Foster City was just being built. All utilities were underground and our cable lines were required to be between 12" and 18" down, while gas lines were required to be between 24" and 30" deep. We set our trencher for a depth of 15" to be pretty much within our depth requirements and I lost count of how many times we had to halt our trenching because we hit a gas line! It always meant we got an hour or more break waiting for the gas guys to come out and fix the break, and then rebury their line at the correct depth!

[StirCrazy]

2oldman wrote:

wapiticountry wrote:
The fact that transmission lines may cross your property is a good reason to call for location services before trenching even if your personal utilities are far from the excavation site.

Ok. It's just quite a surprise to call 811 but then when they come out.. "oh, sorry, we don't do private property." Gee, that's helpful.

I was installing an irrigation system which was only maybe a foot deep at most. Knowing that utilities are deeper, I went ahead and took my chances. Fortunately a natural gas line was already marked from years ago at the property edge.

wow, I almost feel lucky with our services.

We call the location service they come out and mark the location of all the services they have on record. use blue spray paint for water lines, yellow for gas.

Our sewer though is over 8 feet down and no records for it, so I had to pay a company to come mark it out with a probe, and my power is overhead.

[ktmrfs]

wapiticountry wrote:

2oldman wrote:

wapiticountry wrote:
past wthose points it was on my dime to contract with a locate service to mark any underground lines since those are technically my responsibility.

Understood. My question remains.

It may be as simple as saying their definition of public right of ways and yours differ. The utility providers have easements to allow access to their lines that cross your property. This not only includes the lines to your meters but any other line that may transit your property. Transmission lines often do not follow roads and often bisect private property. It’s possible In utility company jargon an easement may be referred to as public access.
The fact that transmission lines may cross your property is a good reason to call for location services before trenching even if your personal utilities are far from the excavation site.

at least around here when you call 811 they will locate lines to your meters etc. AND they are required to also locate any lines within the easement to your property. But they also require that before they come that you mark with flags WHERE you intend to dig. So they will locate anything that is in the "dig" zone you outline, not necessarily mark ALL utility lines on the property.

When I installed our sprinkler system explaining what we intended to do, they then did locate on the entire lot including easements.

[Grit_dog]

wapiticountry wrote:

2oldman wrote:

wapiticountry wrote:
past wthose points it was on my dime to contract with a locate service to mark any underground lines since those are technically my responsibility.

Understood. My question remains.

It may be as simple as saying their definition of public right of ways and yours differ. The utility providers have easements to allow access to their lines that cross your property. This not only includes the lines to your meters but any other line that may transit your property. Transmission lines often do not follow roads and often bisect private property. It’s possible In utility company jargon an easement may be referred to as public access.
The fact that transmission lines may cross your property is a good reason to call for location services before trenching even if your personal utilities are far from the excavation site.

True, but any critical franchise utilities crossing private land are required to be permanently marked. Although those markers also get destroyed and the responsibility for locates is the same.
There is also a virtually zero chance that something like a high pressure gas main or underground power or fiber transmission is crossing his residential lot.
And there’s virtually no danger of hitting a water or sewer main unless digging far deeper than needed to put in a little power wire.
But dumber things have happened.

[Grit_dog]

Dusty R wrote:
May not work for everyone.
If I need to find an underground line, I take 2 stiff wires and bend them to "L" shape then hold one in each hand so the long ends are parallel and sticking straight out in front of me. Then walk slowly over the area, and the wires will cross when passing over buried lines.

Witching sticks are fun!
Have located a lot of lines that the locate services didn’t mark with ‘em.

Worth mentioning, in recent years, locate services have gotten much less reliable. (I use/rely on utility locates daily on some projects.). And when the locate outfits screw up or don’t show up, even with due diligence having been performed by the digger or contractor, it is virtually if not wholly impossible to hold the locate companies to any liability following an unmarked utility strike that was appropriately called in.

In essence, even if you do what you’re suppose to before digging (not talking hitting a private service line beyond the scope of Locates responsibility) and tag an unmarked utility, 99.99% of the time it’s on you in the end.
Best I’ve been able to accomplish is proof that a utility mis located (and better have proper and detailed documentation of your locate calls and refreshes If you miss even one refresh deadline before digging, the utility Co washes their hands of it and you pay the repair bill if it involves the utility Co having to make the repair) is not paying the bill. (Gas, power, fiber etc are non negotiable even if you could repair yourself, you’re not allowed to by law with virtually any Franchise utility).
Never have recouped any personal (company ) cost for direct or consequential costs incurred.

And if you do have all your locates and refresh calls 100% within regulations, they generally “can’t verify” and require your proof. Even though if you do miss a refresh date, they have that data or proof of wrongdoing at the ready, to deny your claim.

Considering that the OP has exhibited a sincere lack of knowledge over just proper materials, the risk of additional cost here if self performing is greater….or none at all if there’s no other utilities in the way.

[Grit_dog]

2oldman wrote:

wapiticountry wrote:
past wthose points it was on my dime to contract with a locate service to mark any underground lines since those are technically my responsibility.

Understood. My question remains.

What was the question again?

[2oldman]

wapiticountry wrote:
The fact that transmission lines may cross your property is a good reason to call for location services before trenching even if your personal utilities are far from the excavation site.

Ok. It's just quite a surprise to call 811 but then when they come out.. "oh, sorry, we don't do private property." Gee, that's helpful.

I was installing an irrigation system which was only maybe a foot deep at most. Knowing that utilities are deeper, I went ahead and took my chances. Fortunately a natural gas line was already marked from years ago at the property edge.

[wapiticountry]

2oldman wrote:

wapiticountry wrote:
past wthose points it was on my dime to contract with a locate service to mark any underground lines since those are technically my responsibility.

Understood. My question remains.

It may be as simple as saying their definition of public right of ways and yours differ. The utility providers have easements to allow access to their lines that cross your property. This not only includes the lines to your meters but any other line that may transit your property. Transmission lines often do not follow roads and often bisect private property. It’s possible In utility company jargon an easement may be referred to as public access.
The fact that transmission lines may cross your property is a good reason to call for location services before trenching even if your personal utilities are far from the excavation site.

[Bobbo]

Dusty R wrote:
May not work for everyone.
If I need to find an underground line, I take 2 stiff wires and bend them to "L" shape then hold one in each hand so the long ends are parallel and sticking straight out in front of me. Then walk slowly over the area, and the wires will cross when passing over buried lines.

Known as dowsing. Also used to find underground water for the purpose of digging a well.

[Dusty_R]

May not work for everyone.
If I need to find an underground line, I take 2 stiff wires and bend them to "L" shape then hold one in each hand so the long ends are parallel and sticking straight out in front of me. Then walk slowly over the area, and the wires will cross when passing over buried lines.

[opnspaces]

In San Diego they mark from the street to the meter. For my gas and electric they spray lines across the front lawn to the gas and elect meters on the side of the garage. Same for Cable and telephone. If I want to dig a hole in my back yard it's up to me to know where anything is underground.

Now take the original topic of a 250 ft trench. If the Electric meter is somewhere near the beginning of the trench they will mark to the meter and no farther. It the meter is at the far end of the trench they will mark all the way to that far end.

[2oldman]

wapiticountry wrote:
past wthose points it was on my dime to contract with a locate service to mark any underground lines since those are technically my responsibility.

Understood. My question remains.

[2oldman]

MFL wrote:
Locating service may be different by region, but in my area, they mark whatever area you plan to dig. Front yard/back yard, public right of way, they cover it all,

That makes sense to me.

[wapiticountry]

2oldman wrote:

Grit dog wrote:
Lol. You’re upset that a public utility company won’t go above and beyond to do favors for every private landowner with their own private utilities that are of no responsibility to nor any control of by the utility company?

And you're upset that I'm upset. I can always count on you for a smart-aleck answer.

What I don't get is that they post these signs "Call before you dig", but, if they only locate up to private property, that would indicate they only locate in the public right-of-way. Why would I be digging up the public right-of-way?

What am I missing here?

Anytime I had locates they marked to the service entry points. That would be to the meter for water electric and gas and to the junction box on the house for cable and phone. Past wthose points it was on my dime to contract with a locate service to mark any underground lines since those are technically my responsibility.