Buying first TC, want the "perfect" used rig (cold weather)

[rob990]

Hi everyone. After reading many posts, I want to take the plunge. I figure value drops significantly once you drive off the lot, so I'm looking to buy used, maybe 2-5 years?

I'm a skier, looking for something I can boondock in ski resort parking lots (also summers, but if it works in winter, summer is easy). Cold weather package, LOTS of solar (I like it REALLY warm inside, also need juice for lots of internet time), 1 or 2 slides so I can stretch out -- but prefer ability to use the TC with slides in! Probably wet bath near the door is handy.

For a long time I thought I had to avoid Lance: I thought Lance is for the average Joe who just walks to the dealer and buys the first thing. BUT it looks like Lance actually puts resources into advancing the technology of their TCs. Can the other companies keep up?

That's to say, I salvated over things like Arctic Fox for a while but thinking maybe a Lance 992 is a good choice. I like the massive size of its water tanks (compared to 995, whose design I like better but tanks are significantly smaller). Longer I can boondock the better and I'm a bit of a water user.

Nervous about insurance costs, but doing the research now. Will also be buying a truck to match.

I know there is no selling allowed here, but there so many places on the internet and craigslist is hard to search nation-wide. Are people here allowed to help others search for and find a really quality TC at a good price?

[rob990]

2BLAZERS wrote:
And don't be afraid of going brand new if you can get a decent deal on closeout years or you can just negotiate well.

We paid $26K for our 2011 camper brand new. Looking over craigslist looks like we could get over 22-23k for it. While a brand new 2017 one looks to be about $38K at the local dealer....msrp is about 55k.

Yes I like brand new, but we shop carefully and you should be able to get 30% off the MSRP. Did the same on our toyhauler.

If new ones were similar price when you bought yours, you negotiated down to almost 50% of MSRP. That's amazing. I'd sure buy new for that price. I'm a decent negotiator, but I can't imagine any sane dealer giving 50% off MSRP or roughly another 30% of their price on the lot.

Reality check? Are there better dealers for that? Better states?

[Vinsil]

rob990 wrote:
That's fascinating. Presumably the other problems with wood outweigh the heat transfer problem (rot? what else?).

Not in my opinion. While the above poster is correct about wood being a better insulator, there is not enough wood in the frame to make enough difference to outweigh the downsides (weight, wood is held together with staples and weakens in the joints over time, rot, mold retention, 1x1's are not as strong, etc) so you can always add heat, insulation, ect you can't fix the main structure.

I've had both and really if a person is saying they can measure the difference heat retention between 1x1 aluminum framing and wood, I'd be very leery....

[rob990]

That's fascinating. Presumably the other problems with wood outweigh the heat transfer problem (rot? what else?).

[mkasner]

We have a 2008 Lance 861 which has the dual fan heater (kicks on a higher BTU when needed) and like every has said, propane will last a couple of days however without solar, generator or plug in the batteries will go pretty quick since the furnace pulls lots of amps. We love our 861. Huge holding tanks for a short bed camper with a slide out. 36 fresh, 30 grey, 33 black!

[whizbang]

What nobody so far has mentioned is construction. Modern campers are mostly aluminum framing. Over the years, we have had three truck campers. By far the warmest and most comfortable is our current camper --- and its a pop-up! But it has wood framing, not aluminum.

An aluminum frame sucks in the cold and dissipates the heat to the outside. The aluminum also contributes to condensation both inside and out. Aluminum transfers heat really well. That's why it's used for heat sinks. Wood is a vastly better thermal insulator and makes for a warmer dryer camper.

I never thought I would be a fan of wood framed campers. But I am. They are simply marvelous in cold weather.

[Grit_dog]

Per the new thread on this site, just buy a Swedish camper, lol!

[Bedlam]

Even with LPG generator usage in the winter, each of my 30# propane cylinders lasts about two nights. We carry water in the tanks, don't pull in the slide and the heat stays on around 55 degrees to prevent frozen pipes while we are out.

[cooldavidt]

The Arctic Fox model called Silver Fox is the insulated dual pane windows model.

Good unit but expensive.

[2BLAZERS]

We've had our 2011 Arctic Fox 1150 in single digits several times. It does great keeping things warm inside. Some of my favorite camping is snow camping. And yes we keep the slide out open the entire time.

AF does include a remote, a backup plugin remote. And the jacks can also be raised with a 3/8 ratchet wrench. The slideout also has a backup system. A long ''wrench'' is included too.

And don't be afraid of going brand new if you can get a decent deal on closeout years or you can just negotiate well.

We paid $26K for our 2011 camper brand new. Looking over craigslist looks like we could get over 22-23k for it. While a brand new 2017 one looks to be about $38K at the local dealer....msrp is about 55k.

Yes I like brand new, but we shop carefully and you should be able to get 30% off the MSRP. Did the same on our toyhauler.

[Tizi]

We have a Northern Lite. They don't have slides, but stay very warm with a small space heater if you have electric available. We upgraded our thermostat to electronic and the propane furnace works much better at keeping us warm. We use electric where possible, but propane works just as well for us.

[Grit_dog]

Wet bath would make great coat closet for wet gear. But you'd have to remove the gear to do AnYtHING else in there.
Looking newer like you said, AF has a decent circulation system to keep warm air going into the basement. Our 05 didn't freeze up at night, well below freezing. Low of 10 deg maybe. Plus there's several write ups about improving the circulation with another little fan/vent into the cabin and also tips on additional insulation.
Just as a quick reference. Our 1 cold trip, April in the AK interior. Above freezing during the afternoon, below freezing for probably 18 hours. 3 days, 2 nights used a full 30lb propane. We weren't conserving heat though and hadn't made any improvements from the factory. Slide out all the time too.

[cooldavidt]

I have an older (2003) Citation Supreme. 10' 4". Single slide.
Fully insulated with double pane windows. Used it in below freezing weather. If we have a plug in we have a small 1200W electric heater. (Home Depot $20) Otherwise the propane furnace works well. I upgraded the thermostat for better control.
The insulation also 'works' in the summer to keep the heat out.
The interior volume is so small it take very little energy to keep it warm inside.
Citations were a casualty of the last recession but there are a lot of them for sale. I use Auto Trader, and of course craigslist and kijiji. General Coach also made many similar TCs under different names.

[Bedlam]

deltabravo wrote:

rob990 wrote:
Great tips, thanks! Thermal windows - meaning dual pane?

Yes, they are dual pane, but the RV industry refers to them as Thermal Panes

Some companies use storm windows while others use dual pane glass. Both work, but each style has pros and cons.

[Bedlam]

Yes. It comes with wired and wireless remote plus a manual crank backup.

[rob990]

Vinsil wrote:
I.ve always thought of Lance as being a good rv manufacturer. Recently a member here has a brand new Lance and it has slide outs. He had issues with it not retracting the slide. Now...Lance didn't include a second or backup remote that was wireless (or even wired) OR a manual system to back up the powered system to work the slide out.

That right there..changed my outlook on Lance as a company. Just think if you had no way to retract your slide out when your ready to leave. No thanks....

Does Arctic Fox?