Ford 2022 Super Duty

[4x4ord]

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[4x4ord]

wowens79 wrote:

4x4ord wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:
That link was a waste of time, I even looked at the videos of a truck making dust and found nothing worthwhile. If folks use that fluff to make a purchase decision it is no wonder there are so many financed trucks,

Do you think if people didn’t care about fluff they would pay cash for their vehicles? Seems most people borrow money to buy vehicles but I’m gonna guess that those who pay cash might be more likely to buy the top of the line models.

I bet it is the opposite. When you pay cash the check goes from $50k to $80 when you go from an XLT to a Platinum. That is more painful than the payment going up a little When they stretch the payment out to 72-84 months. They quote you a payment on $900 on the XLT at 60 months, or $1000 for a Platinum for 84 months.

What you’re saying sounds reasonable. I never do the payment thing but I don’t look at the $85k price tag either. Rather than look at what the truck is costing me today I make make an estimate as to how much it will depreciate each year. If an opportunity comes along to sell it for an amount that makes sense or if an opportunity to buy a new one at a reasonable price comes along I get a new one again. The difference isn’t that bad if you do it often enough.:)

[cummins2014]

Grit dog wrote:

cummins2014 wrote:

Edd505 wrote:

Grit dog wrote:
Took a little cure from Ram eh?
“Black Appearance Package”

They are sharp looking trucks though! Super Duty’s always have been.

Rams with the dead foot sticking out each side? Oh wait that's a mirror.

Worst mirrors I have ever had , and they continue with them . Wouldn't be the end of the world if they would copy the ford mirrors .

Maybe I'm just easier to please, but I've driven all of the big 3, pulling trailers since the 80s and starting in the 2000s with the SuperDutys, Dodge moose antlers and GMs in 06 when they got the "Ford Style" extendable mirrors and have found them all to be just fine. I'll give the nod a bit to the Ford/GM styles, but the fact that the Ram mirrors fold in and become become less obtrusive when performing soccer dad duties is also a convenience.
Basically all of them since they finally did away with the old tripod, bolt to the door, towing mirrors are great.

Although I'd guess if the Ram mirrors were as bad or unpopular as a few folks like to profess, Ram would have changed them up rather than continuing with the same concept from 20 years ago. But they're probably trying to please the majority, not the minority. Sell more trucks that way....

Let me rephrase that , between the Superduty ,and the Laramie ,the Ford IMO is the better mirror. Is it the deciding factor on a purchase ,certainly not. Just an observation going from the Ford to the Ram. I have gotten used to the Ram mirrors in the tow position they are great , my complaint is when they are not. The spot mirror in the tow position is at the bottom , but to me its distracting otherwise. The Ford regardless of what position the mirror is at the spot mirror is always at the bottom .

I agree , they are hands down better now then the old tripod mirrors.

[Grit_dog]

wowens79 wrote:

4x4ord wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:
That link was a waste of time, I even looked at the videos of a truck making dust and found nothing worthwhile. If folks use that fluff to make a purchase decision it is no wonder there are so many financed trucks,

Do you think if people didn’t care about fluff they would pay cash for their vehicles? Seems most people borrow money to buy vehicles but I’m gonna guess that those who pay cash might be more likely to buy the top of the line models.

I bet it is the opposite. When you pay cash the check goes from $50k to $80 when you go from an XLT to a Platinum. That is more painful than the payment going up a little When they stretch the payment out to 72-84 months. They quote you a payment on $900 on the XLT at 60 months, or $1000 for a Platinum for 84 months.

I bet that betting that cash buyers bet on buying a loaded truck or a less equipped truck is pure speculation. Although somewhere the internet may have that useless information stored if it actually matters to y'all.

[wowens79]

4x4ord wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:
That link was a waste of time, I even looked at the videos of a truck making dust and found nothing worthwhile. If folks use that fluff to make a purchase decision it is no wonder there are so many financed trucks,

Do you think if people didn’t care about fluff they would pay cash for their vehicles? Seems most people borrow money to buy vehicles but I’m gonna guess that those who pay cash might be more likely to buy the top of the line models.

I bet it is the opposite. When you pay cash the check goes from $50k to $80 when you go from an XLT to a Platinum. That is more painful than the payment going up a little When they stretch the payment out to 72-84 months. They quote you a payment on $900 on the XLT at 60 months, or $1000 for a Platinum for 84 months.

[4x4ord]

^^^^ You’re right but .... Pulling a 16000 lb RV down the highway at 65 mph takes about 150 hp. If you hit a 3% hill the power required will increase to about 285 hp.
At 65 mph with 34 inch tires and 3.31 gears the driveshaft is turning 2127 rpm.
So:
On level ground towing down the highway with 3.31 gears the torque on the driveshaft would be about 370 lb ft .... 4.30 gears would make that 285 lbft.
climbing a 3% grade at highway speed will put about 704 lbft of torque on the driveshaft with 3.31 gears or 542 lbft with 4.30 gears.

Mashing your foot to the floor in third gear at 1600 engine rpm will put 2200 lbft to the driveshaft regardless of your final drive ratio.
Or having a loaded equipment trailer sink into the ground to the point you need to be pulled can give the Powerstroke opportunity to put well over 5000 lbft of torque through the driveshaft and again it makes no difference whether you have 4.30 gears or 3.31 when you’re stuck. So bottom line is that the drive line needs to be designed to handle some serious torque but pulling an RV down the highway is pretty light work even with 3.31 gears.

[Lynnmor]

4x4ord wrote:


Yes the new Powerstroke with 3.31 gears and the 10 speed is capable of putting more torque to the rear axle in low gear than the 2019 Powerstroke did with 4.30 gears.

There is a reason to use the rear end for gear reduction. That much increased torque from the new transmission will load the driveshaft considerably more.

[4x4ord]

philh wrote:

4x4ord wrote:
^^^^ It makes sense if you view the F450 as Ford's "Tow Master"... larger wheels; bigger brakes; 4.30 gears; wide track suspension; diesel engine ... it's an all in package. If I was ever going to go duals I would consider the F450 but would have a hard time with the 4.30 axle ratio. For towing an RV I would want 3.31, I would be ok with 3.55s but 4.30 would probably be a deal breaker.

Even with the new 10 spd trans?

Yes the new Powerstroke with 3.31 gears and the 10 speed is capable of putting more torque to the rear axle in low gear than the 2019 Powerstroke did with 4.30 gears.

At 1600 rpm the Powerstroke is capable of making 320 HP so you certainly don't need high rpm to cruise down the highway with a 16k RV in tow.

[NRALIFR]

The F450 pickup also makes a good “Haul Master” if you ignore the 14K GVWR, which I do.

I don’t see the 4.30 axle as much of a negative. I’d prefer a 4.10, but my mileage still averages 10.6, and I can cruise at 65-70 all day, and pass everything uphill on the steepest grades.

BTW, the rear axle ratio is another thing I don’t like (or DIDN’T like) about the chassis cabs. If you wanted the gas engine, 4.88 was your only rear axle option. I haven’t looked at them in a few years so things could have changed, but as long as Ford is building an F450 pickup, that’s what I want.

:):)

[philh]

4x4ord wrote:
^^^^ It makes sense if you view the F450 as Ford's "Tow Master"... larger wheels; bigger brakes; 4.30 gears; wide track suspension; diesel engine ... it's an all in package. If I was ever going to go duals I would consider the F450 but would have a hard time with the 4.30 axle ratio. For towing an RV I would want 3.31, I would be ok with 3.55s but 4.30 would probably be a deal breaker.

Even with the new 10 spd trans?

[4x4ord]

^^^^ It makes sense if you view the F450 as Ford's "Tow Master"... larger wheels; bigger brakes; 4.30 gears; wide track suspension; diesel engine ... it's an all in package. If I was ever going to go duals I would consider the F450 but would have a hard time with the 4.30 axle ratio. For towing an RV I would want 3.31, I would be ok with 3.55s but 4.30 would probably be a deal breaker.

[Grit_dog]

NRALIFR wrote:
Thanks, but I don’t want a chassis cab. I want a pickup. Putting a pickup bed on a chassis cab is neither easy nor cheap. You can’t get any trim level above XLT in the chassis cab trucks. The engine and transmission tune would be more appropriate for vocational use, rather than the typical pickup usage.

The F450 pickup suits me to a “T”, and as long as it has higher rated axles, bigger brakes, a tighter turning radius, and 19.5’s that aren’t available on the F350, that’s the truck I want.

:):)

While I'm sure it's not a popular choice (biggest truck you can get with a pickup bed and a gasser), it would seem to be easy to offer, since both engines are available in literally every other configuration of F series Super Duty. I'm surprised the 450 pickup doesn't offer it. (They didn't in 2021 models anyway).

[Grit_dog]

cummins2014 wrote:

Edd505 wrote:

Grit dog wrote:
Took a little cure from Ram eh?
“Black Appearance Package”

They are sharp looking trucks though! Super Duty’s always have been.

Rams with the dead foot sticking out each side? Oh wait that's a mirror.

Worst mirrors I have ever had , and they continue with them . Wouldn't be the end of the world if they would copy the ford mirrors .

Maybe I'm just easier to please, but I've driven all of the big 3, pulling trailers since the 80s and starting in the 2000s with the SuperDutys, Dodge moose antlers and GMs in 06 when they got the "Ford Style" extendable mirrors and have found them all to be just fine. I'll give the nod a bit to the Ford/GM styles, but the fact that the Ram mirrors fold in and become become less obtrusive when performing soccer dad duties is also a convenience.
Basically all of them since they finally did away with the old tripod, bolt to the door, towing mirrors are great.

Although I'd guess if the Ram mirrors were as bad or unpopular as a few folks like to profess, Ram would have changed them up rather than continuing with the same concept from 20 years ago. But they're probably trying to please the majority, not the minority. Sell more trucks that way....

[NRALIFR]

Thanks, but I don’t want a chassis cab. I want a pickup. Putting a pickup bed on a chassis cab is neither easy nor cheap. You can’t get any trim level above XLT in the chassis cab trucks. The engine and transmission tune would be more appropriate for vocational use, rather than the typical pickup usage.

The F450 pickup suits me to a “T”, and as long as it has higher rated axles, bigger brakes, a tighter turning radius, and 19.5’s that aren’t available on the F350, that’s the truck I want.

:):)

[4x4ord]

Cummins12V98 wrote:
" I just got my '21 but I think I'm going to be saying, "Hmmm... should I change the oil, or the whole truck?" "

Just go to the dark side.

I got close enough to grab a Ram by the horns and take it for a spin and a quote this time.