Hitch weight

[Capeteacher]

I was talking with a friend about some of the TT I am interested in. I told him the Xterra has a 500lb hitch limit and I was looking for TT with a low weight so that when the WD hitch is attached and battery and propane are added the weight is still under the limit.
He said the hitch weight listed already adds in battery and propane. Agree or disagree.

[beemerphile1]

Capeteacher wrote:

Ok so I've done the math as suggested for hitch weight/GVWR
Lance 1575, 6%
Vintage, 17RWD 7.3%
Geo-pro 19FSB, 10%
Escape Mini M181SS, 8%
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, 11.2
Think I did it right. Now the question still, is the hitch weight before or after propane and batteries. Obviously this is before the WD hitch and anything else loaded into the trailer. As the manufactures say these are average weights depending on what's in the trailer.

Those numbers are meaningless.

The real tongue weight which will be on the tow vehicle is 12 to 15 percent of the trailer's GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating).

What is included in the phony dry weight specifications are meaningless, you will only tow it empty once and that is the day you buy it.

You need to absolutely ignore the dry weight numbers, they are only for the sales person to use in convincing you to buy.

[Capeteacher]

TomG2 wrote:

Capeteacher wrote:

Thanks for the boost of confidence. I am trying to digest the information 1 piece at a time until I understand it then try putting it all together. I still don't plan on buying till next year. I may be able to get to the Hersey RV show in PA in Sept, which is a big show, to see the trailers in person..I've narrowed my search down to so far.

Lance 1575, length 20', GVWR 3700, hitch 225
Gulf Stream Vintage, length 20', GVWR 3900, hitch 290
Rock wood Geo-Pro 19FSB, length 20', GVWR 3800, hitch 378
K-Z Escape Mini M181SS, length 20'11", GVWR 3500, hitch 310
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, length 20'4", GVWR 3942, hitch 442

Any comments or suggestions?

One comment: If you read the previous comments you will notice that most people insist on a tongue weight in excess of 10% of the GVWR. Throw those out that don't meet this criteria. I only see one remaining. The manufacturers are either understating their tongue weight or don't care about how they tow. I would eliminate them for either reason.

Ok so I've done the math as suggested for hitch weight/GVWR
Lance 1575, 6%
Vintage, 17RWD 7.3%
Geo-pro 19FSB, 10%
Escape Mini M181SS, 8%
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, 11.2
Think I did it right. Now the question still, is the hitch weight before or after propane and batteries. Obviously this is before the WD hitch and anything else loaded into the trailer. As the manufactures say these are average weights depending on what's in the trailer.

[Capeteacher]

OldShu wrote:
TW of our 1475 (Dry TW 250) with similar storage configuration as the 1575 is 440 camp ready with a full 6 gal WH which is at the back of the TT lightening the tongue. Empty the WH and it would be at 450+. Those #s with a GRP 24 Batt.

If their was any issues with tongue weight on a 1575 the members of Lance Owners of America forum would be all over it. They are a feisty bunch I assure you.

OP: If you like the 1575 it would make a great choice. Owners on LOA seem very pleased with it. We almost went with a 1575 but I didn't want a slide and the DW LOVES the chairs instead of a dinette.

Check'em out. http://www.lanceowners.org

I just looked at the 1475. I like the big windows but there is no sleeping area for a third person. My nephew and his girlfriend will join me once in a while so I need the sleeping space and the room to move around a bit. For the record I am a single retired female who has very little camping/RV experience. So this is a new adventure all around. I will continue to ask questions and research until I feel I can make a good safe decision for me. Thanks all for your input.

[_1nobby]

RedRocket204 wrote:

Ask away until it really sinks in. You might get a salty response or two but the important thing is you won't have made a costly mistake on a TT purchase.

You are doing the right thing by turning to those who have experience and nothing to gain. But as always, take the responses and obtain an 'average' as some responses might be somewhat off-base. You'll generally see a trend towards reality... as confusing as it might seem at first. Also consider that some might have experience in a slightly different respect from the next.

Just remember that no one, not a single person on this forum was born with RV towing knowledge, they too had to learn it.

Great post.

[OldShu]

TW of our 1475 (Dry TW 250) with similar storage configuration as the 1575 is 440 camp ready with a full 6 gal WH which is at the back of the TT lightening the tongue. Empty the WH and it would be at 450+. Those #s with a GRP 24 Batt.

If their was any issues with tongue weight on a 1575 the members of Lance Owners of America forum would be all over it. They are a feisty bunch I assure you.

OP: If you like the 1575 it would make a great choice. Owners on LOA seem very pleased with it. We almost went with a 1575 but I didn't want a slide and the DW LOVES the chairs instead of a dinette.

Check'em out. http://www.lanceowners.org

[Lwiddis]

"Lance 1575, length 20', GVWR 3700, hitch 225
Gulf Stream Vintage, length 20', GVWR 3900, hitch 290
Rock wood Geo-Pro 19FSB, length 20', GVWR 3800, hitch 378
K-Z Escape Mini M181SS, length 20'11", GVWR 3500, hitch 310
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, length 20'4", GVWR 3942, hitch 442"

Those are all too heavy for the Xterra IMO. Tongue weight on the light one, Lance, needs to be at least 10%. At 10% it will be 370 pounds and then you add water, stuff and a WDH. 130 "left over" isn't enough. You are going to tell your son/daughter they can't bring their bike? No BBQ? No wood to level the trailer? No lawn chairs? etc.

[TomG2]

troubledwaters wrote:
That's nonsense! The hitch weight he/she is quoting is UVW. The only thing that matters is you have 10% or preferably 12% - 13% tongue weight when it's loaded and ready for camping. Once you fill that pass through storage area up front, a TT with a 10% tongue weight (UVW) will change to 12% tongue weight (loaded and ready to go camping).

Talk about nonsense, you just threw around enough numbers, abbreviations, and percentages to confuse almost all first time buyers. If they understood the relationships you mentioned, they would not be on here asking for help. I would much rather send a first timer out on the highway with twelve percent of his GVWR as tongue weight than one who "Assumes" that ten percent will become twelve percent when loaded.

How about that Lance with six percent brochure tongue weight. Are you sure that will double when ready to go camping? I want your calculator.

[beemerphile1]

Capeteacher wrote:

Lance 1575, length 20', GVWR 3700, hitch 225
Gulf Stream Vintage, length 20', GVWR 3900, hitch 290
Rock wood Geo-Pro 19FSB, length 20', GVWR 3800, hitch 378
K-Z Escape Mini M181SS, length 20'11", GVWR 3500, hitch 310
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, length 20'4", GVWR 3942, hitch 442

Any comments or suggestions?

I will use the first one as an example, you can figure the rest.
Lance 1575 GVWR of 3700 which means a real tongue weight when loaded between 444 and 555 pounds (12 to 15 percent).

[troubledwaters]

TomG2 wrote:

Capeteacher wrote:

Thanks for the boost of confidence. I am trying to digest the information 1 piece at a time until I understand it then try putting it all together. I still don't plan on buying till next year. I may be able to get to the Hersey RV show in PA in Sept, which is a big show, to see the trailers in person..I've narrowed my search down to so far.

Lance 1575, length 20', GVWR 3700, hitch 225
Gulf Stream Vintage, length 20', GVWR 3900, hitch 290
Rock wood Geo-Pro 19FSB, length 20', GVWR 3800, hitch 378
K-Z Escape Mini M181SS, length 20'11", GVWR 3500, hitch 310
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, length 20'4", GVWR 3942, hitch 442

Any comments or suggestions?

One comment: If you read the previous comments you will notice that most people insist on a tongue weight in excess of 10% of the GVWR. Throw those out that don't meet this criteria. I only see one remaining. The manufacturers are either understating their tongue weight or don't care about how they tow. I would eliminate them for either reason.

That's nonsense! The hitch weight he/she is quoting is UVW. The only thing that matters is you have 10% or preferably 12% - 13% tongue weight when it's loaded and ready for camping. Once you fill that pass through storage area up front, a TT with a 10% tongue weight (UVW) will change to 12% tongue weight (loaded and ready to go camping).

[TomG2]

Capeteacher wrote:

Thanks for the boost of confidence. I am trying to digest the information 1 piece at a time until I understand it then try putting it all together. I still don't plan on buying till next year. I may be able to get to the Hersey RV show in PA in Sept, which is a big show, to see the trailers in person..I've narrowed my search down to so far.

Lance 1575, length 20', GVWR 3700, hitch 225
Gulf Stream Vintage, length 20', GVWR 3900, hitch 290
Rock wood Geo-Pro 19FSB, length 20', GVWR 3800, hitch 378
K-Z Escape Mini M181SS, length 20'11", GVWR 3500, hitch 310
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, length 20'4", GVWR 3942, hitch 442

Any comments or suggestions?

One comment: If you read the previous comments you will notice that most people insist on a tongue weight in excess of 10% of the GVWR. Throw those out that don't meet this criteria. I only see one remaining. The manufacturers are either understating their tongue weight or don't care about how they tow. I would eliminate them for either reason.

[Capeteacher]

RedRocket204 wrote:

Capeteacher wrote:
I am being as cautious as I can, asking a lot of questions which sometimes confuses things more. Thanks

Ask away until it really sinks in. You might get a salty response or two but the important thing is you won't have made a costly mistake on a TT purchase.

You are doing the right thing by turning to those who have experience and nothing to gain. But as always, take the responses and obtain an 'average' as some responses might be somewhat off-base. You'll generally see a trend towards reality... as confusing as it might seem at first. Also consider that some might have experience in a slightly different respect from the next.

Just remember that no one, not a single person on this forum was born with RV towing knowledge, they too had to learn it.

Thanks for the boost of confidence. I am trying to digest the information 1 piece at a time until I understand it then try putting it all together. I still don't plan on buying till next year. I may be able to get to the Hersey RV show in PA in Sept, which is a big show, to see the trailers in person..I've narrowed my search down to so far.

Lance 1575, length 20', GVWR 3700, hitch 225
Gulf Stream Vintage, length 20', GVWR 3900, hitch 290
Rock wood Geo-Pro 19FSB, length 20', GVWR 3800, hitch 378
K-Z Escape Mini M181SS, length 20'11", GVWR 3500, hitch 310
Flagstaff Micro-lite 19FSB, length 20'4", GVWR 3942, hitch 442

Any comments or suggestions?

[BarneyS]

Capeteacher wrote:

So the weight on he hitch varies depending on where the cargo is stored and the WD hitch weight. Ok got that, thanks. How do I use this info to determine what TT to buy?

See the reply just above your question by Beemerphile1 for the answer.
Barney

[Capeteacher]

handye9 wrote:

Capeteacher wrote:
I was talking with a friend about some of the TT I am interested in. I told him the Xterra has a 500lb hitch limit and I was looking for TT with a low weight so that when the WD hitch is attached and battery and propane are added the weight is still under the limit.
He said the hitch weight listed already adds in battery and propane. Agree or disagree.

As you can see, your results are about 50/50. Some manufacturers include that weight, some don't. You really can't count on dry hitch weight being accurate, or, even close when loaded for camping.

As for true hitch weights, there are other factors (in addition to propane and batteries) that need to be considered.

1. The weight of the weight distribution hitch itself, adds 80 to 100 lbs of dead weight on the vehicle's hitch receiver, and counts as cargo weight against the vehicle's available payload. If the receiver is stamped 500 / 5000 lbs max, part of that is used up by the weight distributing hitch itself.

2. True hitch weight is not a constant number. It goes up and down during every trip. Different things get loaded in different places, groceries get loaded and used up, and holding tanks, depending on their location (in relation to the trailer axles) and fluid levels, can add or subtract considerable hitch weight.

My travel trailer had an advertised "dry" hitch weight of 880 lbs. My fresh tank is behind the axles, black and grey tanks are directly above the axles, and I have a galley tank in front of the axles. Water in the fresh tank takes hitch weight away. Water in the galley tank adds hitch weight. During any given trip, my actual hitch weight can fluctuate between 975 and 1200 lbs. With the weight of the WD hitch, my receiver is actually carrying 1075 to 1300 lbs.

So the weight on he hitch varies depending on where the cargo is stored and the WD hitch weight. Ok got that, thanks. How do I use this info to determine what TT to buy?

[beemerphile1]

Ignore all the dry weight numbers. Figure that the trailer will have 12 to 15 percent of the trailers GVWR on the tongue when loaded for camping.