Lippert frames

[LVJJJ]

Been towing for 30 years, but never heard of a Lippert frame. Seems like most of the comments are negative.

So, what is a Lippert frame?

[SoundGuy]

SoundGuy wrote:
My 2014 Coachmen Freedom Express has a pressed together Lippert frame that has cracked near the rear tires on each side. :M

As to the OP's question, my understanding is that newer models now use a different frame that shouldn't exhibit this frame cracking problem that have plagued so many Freedom Express owners.

GrandpaKip wrote:
If you truly believe this, then why in the world do you keep recommending this trailer?

SoundGuy wrote:
Surely this is self explanatory! :S

GrandpaKip wrote:
My apologies. However, your understanding is just that (an opinion). If you had stated when, where and what Coachmen had done, that would be fine for all the trailers that have been constructed since then. But the fact still remains that you have touted this trailer many times without caveat.
As I see it, the main concern would be with new members of this forum looking at used trailers. With your recommendation, they might be led to believe this is a great camper. A problem with cracked frames should eliminate this trailer from any consideration.

I don't believe I've ever "touted this trailer many times without caveat" but if asked, sure I'd suggest others consider it. Why not? - it's a great floor plan for an adult couple, offers pretty well all the amenities one would want in a travel trailer, it's easy to tow and easy to park on pretty well any campsite. Is it perfect? ... surely not, never have claimed it was, no more than any other trailer. It's a mass produced product built for the masses, just as most other trailers are. Yes, my particular 2014 has a cracked frame but it is NOT on any NHSTA recall list and if you had actually read the content of that recall you'd know that only ~ 1000 units of other models built during a specific time period are subject to that recall. Is my 192RBS which is not part of this recall a fluke? ... don't know, but I'm not aware of any other 192RBS models exhibiting this problem. Regardless, it is my "understanding" that newer models from 2016 onward use a different frame which shouldn't exhibit this same issue anyway. FWIW, my wife & I recently discussed the idea of actually trading our 2014 for a new 2018 192RBS as it offers a number of improvements such as a full length queen bed and vent over the main cabin but the hit in depreciation really doesn't make this practical, especially when our 2014 serves the purpose just fine. :B

[GrandpaKip]

SoundGuy wrote:

SoundGuy wrote:
My 2014 Coachmen Freedom Express has a pressed together Lippert frame that has cracked near the rear tires on each side. :M

As to the OP's question, my understanding is that newer models now use a different frame that shouldn't exhibit this frame cracking problem that have plagued so many Freedom Express owners.

GrandpaKip wrote:
If you truly believe this, then why in the world do you keep recommending this trailer?

Surely this is self explanatory! :S

My apologies. However, your understanding is just that (an opinion). If you had stated when, where and what Coachmen had done, that would be fine for all the trailers that have been constructed since then. But the fact still remains that you have touted this trailer many times without caveat.
As I see it, the main concern would be with new members of this forum looking at used trailers. With your recommendation, they might be led to believe this is a great camper. A problem with cracked frames should eliminate this trailer from any consideration.

[sgfrye]

SoundGuy wrote:

SidecarFlip wrote:
Build them cheap, stack them deep and build them with unskilled welders. Recipe for disaster.

Why would you expect anything else, after all YOU asked for it - "you" meaning you and I and all the rest of us who want as much trailer as we can get for as little cost as possible. That's the recipe for disaster. :W

X2 on this. in general the public who buy these products want cheaper prices on everything . in the manufacturing industry no matter what it is. appliances, autos, rv's the factors going into the retail price involve are complex but material cost, labor,advertising, warranty coverages are what sets the prices.

[gmw_photos]

Just a guess here, I will admit, but the idea of lippert manufacturing their own steel is almost zero. Structural metals comes from mills that cost hundreds of millions of dollars to build.

I just looked online and found 12" rolled beams for sale, and the spec of the material thickness is .232", so yes, 'dogs measurement of 1/4" ( .250" ) would be within twenty thousandths. Sounds right to me.

As I stated earlier, the 6" beam under this 19' trailer I am in right now has a material thickness of approx 1/8" ( .125" ). Seems reasonable to me.

[SoundGuy]

drsteve wrote:
The 2018 Coachmen in my sig has plenty of shoddy workmanship, the most serious being a floor that flexes and makes loud cracking sounds when walked on in front of the stove.

I seem to recall already suggesting a solution for this ... the cause isn't so much the floor itself but the fact that as you walk near the galley the galley frame moves ever so slightly against the floor, sometimes a bit more noticeable than other times depending on exterior ambient temperatures. The solution is to simply secure the galley frame to the floor with more screws, in my case coarse thread deck screws - stop the movement and you'll stop the "cracking" sounds. Worked for me. :B

[Wild_Card]

Ralph Cramden wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:
My present TT has a Lippert frame. It is by far the best frame I have had under any of my TTs.
10" tall real I beam (not welded) 1/4" thick.
The welds are top notch, and the frame is powder coated.

Lippert gets a bad rap here, but my frame is proof that they can put a good frame under a TT, if the manufacturer is willing to pay for it.

I had a out of warranty problem with the Lippert sealed bearing axles my TT came with. Lippert had discontinued those axles, but made me a very fair offer to get both axles replaced.

They could have easily weaseled on me, but they stood up and did the right thing.

I know I may be a rare bird here.... But I am a Lippert fan

I highly doubt the web is 1/4" thick. If so that TT would weigh way too much.
The flanges would be 1/4" where they meet the web.
Just curious what TT do you have?

2010 Palomino Sabre. 30BHDS

The web and flanges measure 1/4 thick.
I am not set up to post pics. I do have pics of my frame on the factory floor. from when I toured the factory after picking it up.

Jbarca has seen them.

I don't BS about this sort of thing.

Well thats impressive.

I don't doubt the 10" with 1/4" inch flange and web thickness. I do however doubt it's rolled and not a machine welded / fabricated shape. The only 10" rolled shapes I am aware of that could be used in a trailer frame application would be an S10x25.4 or S10x35. Neither of those have a 1/4" thickness anywhere. The lighter 25.4 has roughly a 1/2" flange and a 3/8" web.

I know there are some 3 piece welded frames. The one that a picture was posted of last page and every trailer I have owned are rolled steel I beam. No weld is smooth and a machine weld looks like a perfect stack of dimes. These I beams are perfectly smooth/tooled not welded at the web/flange.

You say the only beams you know of are such and such. You ever think Lippert a chassis mfg might have their own tooling machine to make I beam out of thinner steel...just by chance?

[Huntindog]

[img] Click For Full-Size Image. width=300[/img]

I have lots of pics. This one clearly shows it is NOT a welded beam.
I did not take any that will "prove" how thick it is. That was not the purpose of these pics taken 8-9 years ago. I have however measured them with a dial caliper a year or so ago, when Jbarca and I were discussing frames, and how they work.

[Huntindog]

Ralph Cramden wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:
My present TT has a Lippert frame. It is by far the best frame I have had under any of my TTs.
10" tall real I beam (not welded) 1/4" thick.
The welds are top notch, and the frame is powder coated.

Lippert gets a bad rap here, but my frame is proof that they can put a good frame under a TT, if the manufacturer is willing to pay for it.

I had a out of warranty problem with the Lippert sealed bearing axles my TT came with. Lippert had discontinued those axles, but made me a very fair offer to get both axles replaced.

They could have easily weaseled on me, but they stood up and did the right thing.

I know I may be a rare bird here.... But I am a Lippert fan

I highly doubt the web is 1/4" thick. If so that TT would weigh way too much.
The flanges would be 1/4" where they meet the web.
Just curious what TT do you have?

2010 Palomino Sabre. 30BHDS

The web and flanges measure 1/4 thick.
I am not set up to post pics. I do have pics of my frame on the factory floor. from when I toured the factory after picking it up.

Jbarca has seen them.

I don't BS about this sort of thing.

Well thats impressive.

I don't doubt the 10" with 1/4" inch flange and web thickness. I do however doubt it's rolled and not a machine welded / fabricated shape. The only 10" rolled shapes I am aware of that could be used in a trailer frame application would be an S10x25.4 or S10x35. Neither of those have a 1/4" thickness anywhere. The lighter 25.4 has roughly a 1/2" flange and a 3/8" web.

I do not know what "rolled" means. I DO know what welded looks like. I have seen that on many TTs.
I DO NOT have a welded frame rail frame.
It is what I consider to be a "normal" I beam.

[Ralph_Cramden]

goducks10 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:
My present TT has a Lippert frame. It is by far the best frame I have had under any of my TTs.
10" tall real I beam (not welded) 1/4" thick.
The welds are top notch, and the frame is powder coated.

Lippert gets a bad rap here, but my frame is proof that they can put a good frame under a TT, if the manufacturer is willing to pay for it.

I had a out of warranty problem with the Lippert sealed bearing axles my TT came with. Lippert had discontinued those axles, but made me a very fair offer to get both axles replaced.

They could have easily weaseled on me, but they stood up and did the right thing.

I know I may be a rare bird here.... But I am a Lippert fan

I highly doubt the web is 1/4" thick. If so that TT would weigh way too much.
The flanges would be 1/4" where they meet the web.
Just curious what TT do you have?

2010 Palomino Sabre. 30BHDS

The web and flanges measure 1/4 thick.
I am not set up to post pics. I do have pics of my frame on the factory floor. from when I toured the factory after picking it up.

Jbarca has seen them.

I don't BS about this sort of thing.

Well thats impressive.

I don't doubt the 10" with 1/4" inch flange and web thickness. I do however doubt it's rolled and not a machine welded / fabricated shape. The only 10" rolled shapes I am aware of that could be used in a trailer frame application would be an S10x25.4 or S10x35. Neither of those have a 1/4" thickness anywhere. The lighter 25.4 has roughly a 1/2" flange and a 3/8" web.

[LVJJJ]

Whoa, I started a landslide, 'preciate the comments though. So, I have an '05 TrailCruiser, would that have a Lippert Frame? Seems pretty skoocum. How do you tell, do they put there name on it?

[mountainkowboy]

gmw photos wrote:

GrandpaKip wrote:


....snip...

If you truly believe this, then why in the world do you keep recommending this trailer?

Because some people have to try to convince others they are never wrong ?

"Listen to me, I am the truth, the light, and others will lead you astray"

Kip, a certain poster here has stated that yours truly is trying to lead others astray into dangerous territory. Oh my.

HAHAHAHAHA.........NAILED IT!!!

[mountainkowboy]

SoundGuy wrote:

mountainkowboy wrote:
Lippert has been building garbage for many, many years now, and there failures are well documented. I wouldn't buy anything they build, I've seen better welds from teenagers.

Then I guess you won't be buying anything as Lippert is all over the RV industry with a wide range of products. 😉

There's PLENTY of units out there that don't have any Lippert parts, just gotta do your research. So don't you worry.....I'll be just fine trollio.

[goducks10]

drsteve wrote:
The 2018 Coachmen in my sig has plenty of shoddy workmanship, the most serious being a floor that flexes and makes loud cracking sounds when walked on in front of the stove. Coachmen customer service rep says this is normal and that they all do it, even though I was unable to find another one on the dealer's lot that did. The dealer is useless--they proved unable to even properly install a slide awning--and so is Forest River.

Thats not a Lippert issue. Thats a Coachman issue. Guessing they didn't glue the wood or at least not well enough to the wood floor joists before they stapled it. If they would've glued and screwed you probably wouldn't have a squeak.

[goducks10]

Huntindog wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:
My present TT has a Lippert frame. It is by far the best frame I have had under any of my TTs.
10" tall real I beam (not welded) 1/4" thick.
The welds are top notch, and the frame is powder coated.

Lippert gets a bad rap here, but my frame is proof that they can put a good frame under a TT, if the manufacturer is willing to pay for it.

I had a out of warranty problem with the Lippert sealed bearing axles my TT came with. Lippert had discontinued those axles, but made me a very fair offer to get both axles replaced.

They could have easily weaseled on me, but they stood up and did the right thing.

I know I may be a rare bird here.... But I am a Lippert fan

I highly doubt the web is 1/4" thick. If so that TT would weigh way too much.
The flanges would be 1/4" where they meet the web.
Just curious what TT do you have?

2010 Palomino Sabre. 30BHDS

The web and flanges measure 1/4 thick.
I am not set up to post pics. I do have pics of my frame on the factory floor. from when I toured the factory after picking it up.

Jbarca has seen them.

I don't BS about this sort of thing.

Well thats impressive.

[drsteve]

The 2018 Coachmen in my sig has plenty of shoddy workmanship, the most serious being a floor that flexes and makes loud cracking sounds when walked on in front of the stove. Coachmen customer service rep says this is normal and that they all do it, even though I was unable to find another one on the dealer's lot that did. The dealer is useless--they proved unable to even properly install a slide awning--and so is Forest River.