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Lithium Battery Charging System

CYCLEPATH
Explorer
Explorer
It is time for a new battery in my '04 Lance 921. I am looking at an Interstate battery they sell up the road. But through my research into charging systems/problems, I got to thinking about Lithium batteries. Being a retired cargo pilot, my knowledge about lithium batteries is that if they catch fire, they become quite the spectacle. I was actually surprised they were using them in campers.

My question is, are they worth the price? What do you have to change/do to your charging system to be able to charge one, and is that added expense worth it? I have a PD charger/inverter, and charge wizard now. Is this what you have to change out to be able to charge the lithium battery? And what would take their place? Will the truck alternator charge the Lithium battery? Will the current battery separator need to be changed? It seems a lot easier to just install a new Interstate. I don't do a lot of boondocking, but that could always change in the future. Thank you.
48 REPLIES 48

covered_wagon
Explorer
Explorer
I am not the one to rely on for info but, I do know without a properly working solar charge controller that the solar panels will reverse all the energy and loose all the charging back into the night sky. That is interesting to me but, I wonder if the reversed polarity damaged the controller. Hope you find what it is and is simple to fix.

RBLance820
Explorer
Explorer
Hello, hoping I could jump onto this thread to ask a topic related question.
I added a lithium LifePOE 100ah battery a little over a week ago to my 2000 Lance 820. I charged it before use for several days using a lithium charger as instructions recommend. The day before leaving for boondocking I hooked it up. Unfortunately, I reversed the positive/negative wires. After discovering my mistake, I hooked it up properly and appeared that everything worker ok.
The first night the new battery died.
I was able to jump start the onboard propane generator and it appeared to charge the lithium battery. After the sun set the battery died again.

After a several hours of sunlight (I have two wired roof top solar panels) the battery was charged enough to start up the generator without a jump.

Thinking the battery was bad I purchased a deep cycle interstate wet battery. After the first night of use it also drained dead. Again, after several hours of sunlight the battery was charged enough to start the generator.

In the evening I ran the generator before dark to charge up the battery for the night and the generator died apparently from the lack of electrical energy due to the sun now being unavailable.

So, everything works on shore power and when the battery is fully charged and when on the generator. But when using the generator alone without sunlight the generator dies and there is no electricity available.
I checked for any tripped or broken fused with negative results. It feels like the generator is draining the batteries.

Would anyone out there have any ideas what damage I might have done to the camper or where to begin trouble shooting?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I have the camper on a 2015 GMC 2500.

covered_wagon
Explorer
Explorer
time2roll wrote:
LFP battery actually takes quite an effort to make it burn.


I promise to look into it then. Right now I have a load of firewood to get in the woodshed before it gets hot today.

time2roll
Nomad
Nomad
LFP battery actually takes quite an effort to make it burn.

covered_wagon
Explorer
Explorer
CYCLEPATH wrote:
It’s good exercise hauling it back and forth to the camper:)


At 70 I still do it. I just don't like the idea of fires you hear so much about. Thank you for the schooling anyway.

CYCLEPATH
Explorer
Explorer
It’s good exercise hauling it back and forth to the camper:)

Microlite_Mike
Explorer
Explorer
covered wagon wrote:
Smart to stay with wet cell batteries. The more the other types are sold the less expensive wet cells become. Adjusting for inflation of course. A big plus for me is not worrying over my batteries and any potential hazard.


With LiFePo4 batteries there are actually fewer hazards than with "Wet Cell" batteries. No electrolyte to spill, no explosive gases to vent, no corrosion, freedom to mount in ANY position or ANY location.

As for price? Add the extended lifetime of a LiFePo4 battery, compared of a "wet cell" and the lifetime cost goes way down.


Going forward heavy lead acid chemistry batteries are going to be less and less desirable for all as fuel prices go up and the need for lighter RV's goes up as well. A 100 ah battery that weighs 25-30 lbs with up to 100% usable capacity or a 60+ lb battery with only 50% usable capacity recommended? Fuel consumption and load weight go hand in hand. As load weight goes up the need for more btu's to create horsepower will increase. That means more fuel burned. To think otherwise is just wishful thinking.


BTW, the resistance to change, accepting new technology is pretty much the "American Way". People were so resistant to changing to automobiles they even passed laws making it difficult for people to use those "newfangled devices" and figured horses were good enough.
"Knowledge is realizing that the street is one-way, wisdom is looking both directions anyway."


~ Albert Einstein

greenno
Explorer
Explorer
Yeah going with the LifePO4 battery cells has worked out really good.
I went with the EVITE 3.2v Grade A 280ahr cells and just connected up two cells parallel x 4 and it gave me a total air of 560ahr's. By connecting these up this way I was able to use a single 200a BMS to monitor and charge the cells, even bluetooth's to my phone so I can check state at a glance if needed.
.
Already had #1 wiring going from battery compartment to the generator compartment via a shut-off switch located there for future as I didn't order my camper with the Kohler genset for( 4k) but just the prep package which was no charge.
I then purchased my own 2200w dual fuel generator for $650 only drawback is I have to remove it from the compartment to run it.
Even had room in the rear of the compartment to install the 3kw inverter and I can switch to either source when I choose.
Actually saved about 40lbs in weight savings over the the original set. Also wanted to keep the battery's in the same location so that limited me to either Lead/Acid, Lithium, or the type I ended up going with.
Having all that reserve capacity is really nice to have.

StirCrazy
Navigator
Navigator
Lwiddis wrote:
"I don't do a lot of boondocking, but that could always change in the future."

I boondocked with wet batteries and now with a Lithium battery. With an adequate solar system recharging either type of battery is not an issue. Sure, my Lithium has more usable power and it recharges faster but those are the only differences I've noticed.


didn't notice the weight and size savings?
2014 F350 6.7 Platinum
2016 Cougar 330RBK
1991 Slumberqueen WS100

Camper_Jeff___K
Nomad II
Nomad II
greenno wrote:
I ended up building my own LifePO4 set-up myself.
Went from 98ahr's to 560ahr's.
Already had 510w of solar on roof and a 30a charge controller that was compatible. Changed out my 120v on-board charger ( have yet to even use ). Also added a Victron DC/DC 18a isolated charger to top off when driving down the road and never have to worry.
Also added a 3000w inverter that we use for the coffee maker in the AM and occasional microwave use and haven't used my generator since going this route.
Probably set me back 2.5k total but should last quite a while.
With the storage capacity I have now I don't even charge everyday.



Not a cheap way to go but I know it will last and it's installed correctly.
Retired IBEW Contractor here in SD so I gots the skills.
Good luck.


I'm close to the same solar and battery system as you with a couple differences.. Four solar panels on the roof, 180, 190, 190, and 115 watts respectively for 675 watts total power. Two 202 AH LIFEPO batteries for a total of 404 watts. I oversized the solar because we live in the Pacific Northwest and are subject to low winter sun and lots of cloudy, rainy days. Victron 150|70 MPPT Converter and for driving and backup, a Victron Orion DC to DC 30 amp 12 volt charger. I have a Xantrex 600 watt Pure Sinewave Inverter that we're happy with for now, don't know if I'll ever upgrade to the Victron 3000 watt inverter. My system cost $ 6200.00 for everything at Discount Solar in Quartzite. I shopped around at the time and several stores simply didn't have stock or were running out of stock. I'm sure I got the bend over special but I am happy with the performance of the system. Highly recommend LIFEPO to anyone looking to change batteries.

covered_wagon
Explorer
Explorer
Smart to stay with wet cell batteries. The more the other types are sold the less expensive wet cells become. Adjusting for inflation of course. A big plus for me is not worrying over my batteries and any potential hazard.

CYCLEPATH
Explorer
Explorer
Thank you guys for the replies. I went with the Interstate SRM31 battery. We're thinking of getting a fifth wheel here in the not too distant future (and of course keep the Lance). If we do that, I will go the Lithium route with fifth wheel. I need a whole lot of YouTube time before I consider tackling a job like this. Safe camping.

3_tons
Explorer
Explorer
greenno wrote:
I ended up building my own LifePO4 set-up myself.
Went from 98ahr's to 560ahr's.
Already had 510w of solar on roof and a 30a charge controller that was compatible. Changed out my 120v on-board charger ( have yet to even use ). Also added a Victron DC/DC 18a isolated charger to top off when driving down the road and never have to worry.
Also added a 3000w inverter that we use for the coffee maker in the AM and occasional microwave use and haven't used my generator since going this route.
Probably set me back 2.5k total but should last quite a while.
With the storage capacity I have now I don't even charge everyday.



Not a cheap way to go but I know it will last and it's installed correctly.
Retired IBEW Contractor here in SD so I gots the skills.
Good luck.


Sounds like a very sweet set-up you’ve got Sir 🙂 !!

(FWIW, very similar to my 400a/h LFP supported by 660w rooftop truck camper solar…)

3 tons

greenno
Explorer
Explorer
I ended up building my own LifePO4 set-up myself.
Went from 98ahr's to 560ahr's.
Already had 510w of solar on roof and a 30a charge controller that was compatible. Changed out my 120v on-board charger ( have yet to even use ). Also added a Victron DC/DC 18a isolated charger to top off when driving down the road and never have to worry.
Also added a 3000w inverter that we use for the coffee maker in the AM and occasional microwave use and haven't used my generator since going this route.
Probably set me back 2.5k total but should last quite a while.
With the storage capacity I have now I don't even charge everyday.



Not a cheap way to go but I know it will last and it's installed correctly.
Retired IBEW Contractor here in SD so I gots the skills.
Good luck.

Lwiddis
Explorer II
Explorer II
"I don't do a lot of boondocking, but that could always change in the future."

I boondocked with wet batteries and now with a Lithium battery. With an adequate solar system recharging either type of battery is not an issue. Sure, my Lithium has more usable power and it recharges faster but those are the only differences I've noticed.
Winnebago 2101DS TT & 2022 Chevy Silverado 1500 LTZ Z71, WindyNation 300 watt solar-Lossigy 200 AH Lithium battery. Prefer boondocking, USFS, COE, BLM, NPS, TVA, state camps. Bicyclist. 14 yr. Army -11B40 then 11A - (MOS 1542 & 1560) IOBC & IOAC grad