Multiple Tire Blowouts

[ItsMeCarlos]

Hi all!

Noobie to the forum but have been lurking for a while.

Thanks for all the info you all share in this forum. It helps a lot more people that you know.

So I have an issue....

We own a 2017 Forest River Salem 30KQBSS TT. This is our first RV and we love it.

We usually just go up the road to Orlando maybe 2-3 times a year. This is just shy of 400 miles round trip.

During the summer of 2018, we make our 4th trip to Orlando and we get our first blowout on the passenger side. These were the original factory tires (I do not have the tire info on hand). The tires probably had around 1400 miles on them.

A little bit of background, I am very meticulous when it come to towing safety. I have towed in the past. I check all air pressures, inspect all tires, grease, lube, etc, etc... The tires looked in good shape.

Back to the blowout, I change the tire and I see the tire behind it (non blowout) has some of the steel threads embedded in it from the blowout tire.

I decided to change it out also as a safety precaution. Luckily I carry two spares.

It caused a lot of undercarriage damage as well as fender damage but I was able to duct tape and tie wrap everything so I can get back on the road. It was a mess.

We get to our destination and had roadside come and replace one of the tires since I now had no spare.

So now I had one spare tire on (can't remember the make), one new tire that roadside installed and the two original tires that came with the TT.

Made it home with no issues.

Before our next trip I installed two new tires. This time I purchased Load Range E tires. Originally all the tires before were Load Range D tires so I figured I would go with a higher range tire.

All my tires up to that point were Load Range D as per the manufactures recommendations.

I install my 2 new E tires (1 on front passenger, 1 on front driver) and I install my newer tire (roadside assistance replacement) as well as my newest spare tire.

Fast forward to this July 2019 (6th trip). This would be our second trip since our last blowout (about 500 miles on the new tires). One hour into our trip we get a blowout on the drivers side, rear tire. This was a load D tire. I replace it with one of my spares (Load D). It was another mess but got back on the road and finally made it to Orlando from Ft. Lauderdale.

Same trip driving back home (remember, this is a 200 mile trip one way), I get a low air pressure reading from my new wireless TMPS system I had purchased before our trip. On a side note I highly recommend one of these. It gave me peace of mind.

I pull over and sure enough as the TMPS said my passenger side rear wheel was way low on air and it was (air leak). This tire was also a Load D tire. Down to my 2nd and last spare, I change it out. This tire is also Load D.

Get back on the road.

About an hour later BOOM! Tire I just replaced blows out! @!%#%

Luckily it happened next to the rest area.

With no spare tires left, I call a local, mobile tire repair shop.

While I was waiting for him I'm trying to figure, 1. What the heck is going on. 2. I still will not have a spare if it happens again.

I called the tire guy before he got there and I told him to bring me two tires.

Gentleman comes out and replaces the blowout and the last remaining Load D tire with a Load E as per his recommendations.

A couple of hours later we (wife, our two kids and our dog) get back on the road. We made it home with no more issues.

Any ideas what can be happening?

I'm thinking of weight issues, so I looked at the manufactures weight and tire info on the trailer.

The GVWR is 9699 lbs.

On the tire and loading information sticker, it says " The combination weight of Cargo should Never Exceed 2731 lbs."

There is another yellow sticker that is labeled Recreational Vehicle Trailer Cargo Carrying Capacity that states the same thing. "The weight of the cargo should never exceeded 2731 lbs."

So am I missing something?

There is no way I am carrying more that 2,700 lbs of stuff in my trailer. Clothes and food for 7 days, games and the kids scooters, etc should be no where near that. I know, I should take the trailer to a local scale to know for sure.

So if by the manufactures numbers, GVWR 9699 lbs. plus Cargo 2731 lbs. totaling 12.430 lbs. can be safely towed.

Now here is the kicker, the tires that came with the trailer and the tires that are recommended from factory are Load Range D tires. Load range D tires have a max load 2540 lbs. per tire. My trailer is a dual axle (4 tires), so the total of the max weight for the tires should be 10,160 lbs. This is almost the weight of the TT without anything in it!!!

As per the TT label I should be able to load another 2700 lbs but there is no way these factory tires are manufactured to hold this.

So, am I missing something?
Am I reading the label wrong?
Did the manufacture mess something up?

Six tires on a two and a half year old TT with around 2700 miles.

I am in the process of contacting Forest River but I wanted to get some advice before I do.

Sorry for the long read.

I look forward to hearing your replies.

Thank you in advance!
Carlos

[kedanie]

Huntindog wrote:

CALandLIN wrote:

kedanie wrote:
Hate to tell you this Calvin, but your established way ain’t workin. If it was there wouldn’t be all these threads complaining about ST tire problems.

Keith

Well that's quite true. The published way establishes minimum standards which can always be improved with a little help from vehicle manufacturers and their options or recommendations for added protection with replacement tires.

Complaints are, in a large part, from disgruntled consumers and highly antidotal in nature.

The motto, "the right tool for the job" can be shifted to the "right tire for the application". Problem is, most -new- RV trailer owners have a problem when they have to make that decision.

This coming from a guy who had SEVEN oem tire failures. ( That should make anyone a disgruntled consumer)
CALandLINs seven failures
And from what you have also posted (staying with STs, and just increasing the LR) are still having troubles, though at a slower rate.

Yea, keep right on drinking the kool aid and putting up with failures... At least you can take comfort in the fact that you are doing what you are supposed to do.

Actually the number is over 20. He even admitted it back when he was posting as FastEagle. If I recall, think it was around 23 tires at the time.

Keith

[CALandLIN]

JIMNLIN wrote:

I have 6000# GAWR vehicle certified axles. I use ST235/80R16 LRE tires inflated to 80 PSI which provides 520# in load capacity reserves per tire. I replace them every three years.

Ouch...thats gotta' hurt. This is the biggest reason I don't use ST tires on my RV trailers. Hell I couldn't afford them.
I've used LT235/85-16 E tires on several trailers with 6k axles and replace them when they reach 50k-55k miles or 7-8 years which ever comes first.

Anywayz the legalistic sounding opinions were hearing from Cal can be read over and over ad nauseam by searching FastEagle on this website (and other rv websites). Don't feed the troll.

I came back to this post because you know very well that my message isn't personal, yet, as in the past, you chose to make it so and I bit. Sorry to others that I now have to bow out of this discussion as others start clouding my message. I've been doing this for more than 15 years and should have recognized the bait.

[Huntindog]

CALandLIN wrote:

kedanie wrote:
Hate to tell you this Calvin, but your established way ain’t workin. If it was there wouldn’t be all these threads complaining about ST tire problems.

Keith

Well that's quite true. The published way establishes minimum standards which can always be improved with a little help from vehicle manufacturers and their options or recommendations for added protection with replacement tires.

Complaints are, in a large part, from disgruntled consumers and highly antidotal in nature.

The motto, "the right tool for the job" can be shifted to the "right tire for the application". Problem is, most -new- RV trailer owners have a problem when they have to make that decision.

This coming from a guy who had SEVEN oem tire failures. ( That should make anyone a disgruntled consumer)


CALandLINs seven failures


And from what you have also posted (staying with STs, and just increasing the LR) are still having troubles, though at a slower rate.

Yea, keep right on drinking the kool aid and putting up with failures... At least you can take comfort in the fact that you are doing what you are supposed to do.

[CALandLIN]

kedanie wrote:
Hate to tell you this Calvin, but your established way ain’t workin. If it was there wouldn’t be all these threads complaining about ST tire problems.

Keith

Well that's quite true. The published way establishes minimum standards which can always be improved with a little help from vehicle manufacturers and their options or recommendations for added protection with replacement tires. RIVA has helped with their 10% in load capacity reserve recommendation for OEM tires.

Complaints are, in a large part, from disgruntled consumers and highly anecdotal in nature.

The motto, "the right tool for the job" can be shifted to the "right tire for the application". Problem is, most -new- RV trailer owners have a problem when they have to make that decision.

Writing about tires in this format is often difficult because we cannot directly confront those making serious errors. We have to obfuscate.

[kedanie]

Hate to tell you this Calvin, but your established way ain’t workin. If it was there wouldn’t be all these threads complaining about ST tire problems.

Keith

[CALandLIN]

gmw photos wrote:
Ouch indeed. If I replaced tires that often, I'd be buying 16 tires every three years for my trailers alone. No thanks.

This is why I try not to get into personal discussions. My messages are from how it's supposed to be done. Not how well something different from the established way works for others.

[CALandLIN]

gmw photos wrote:
Ouch indeed. If I replaced tires that often, I'd be buying 16 tires every three years for my trailers alone. No thanks.

Ok, I've added all to this one I can think of. I'm happy with my choices and satisfied with my interpretation of the dexter and trailer owners manuals.

My long time friend/owner of the local Good Year store, which is also a independent tire dealer ( multi brand ) is more than happy to sell and mount LT tires to me on all my trailers. I'm good to go here.

Didn't you already say your trailer documentation from the manufacturer authorizes LT tire use?

[CALandLIN]

JIMNLIN wrote:

I have 6000# GAWR vehicle certified axles. I use ST235/80R16 LRE tires inflated to 80 PSI which provides 520# in load capacity reserves per tire. I replace them every three years.

Ouch...thats gotta' hurt. This is the biggest reason I don't use ST tires on my RV trailers. Hell I couldn't afford them.
I've used LT235/85-16 E tires on several trailers with 6k axles and replace them when they reach 50k-55k miles or 7-8 years which ever comes first.

Anywayz the legalistic sounding opinions were hearing from Cal can be read over and over ad nauseam by searching FastEagle on this website (and other rv websites). Don't feed the troll.

As you well know my original trailer tires were ST235/80R16 LRD and made in the USA . The number of failures in the first couple of years forced me into trailer tire researching. Numerous trips to the scales and an increase in load range from D to E solved most of our failure problems. Because of our trailer's 32" axle spacing, center to center, taller tires than what we already use wont work. Sometimes we changed sooner than 3 years because of mileage. The newer higher speed rated tires with better compounding should go 5 years depending on mileage. We now have the option to go up to LRF but the LRE have been successful. But we would have to change wheels because ours are pressure rated at 80 PSI.

To be fair about tires I'll point out that we do not skimp. In the first 200K on our dually it had 5 sets of tires. No matter what they look like, when they start breaking out with a little extra torque I change them.

[kedanie]

JIMNLIN wrote:

I have 6000# GAWR vehicle certified axles. I use ST235/80R16 LRE tires inflated to 80 PSI which provides 520# in load capacity reserves per tire. I replace them every three years.

Ouch...thats gotta' hurt. This is the biggest reason I don't use ST tires on my RV trailers. Hell I couldn't afford them.
I've used LT235/85-16 E tires on several trailers with 6k axles and replace them when they reach 50k-55k miles or 7-8 years which ever comes first.

Anywayz the legalistic sounding opinions were hearing from Cal can be read over and over ad nauseam by searching FastEagle on this website (and other rv websites). Don't feed the troll.

It doesn’t hurt so bad when the offshore ST tire companies are providing compensation for ones undying support. How many people has he intimidated (bullied) into making the mistake of continuing putting on ST tires? This has been going on for at least 10 years now.

Keith

[gmw_photos]

Ouch indeed. If I replaced tires that often, I'd be buying 16 tires every three years for my trailers alone. No thanks.

Ok, I've added all to this one I can think of. I'm happy with my choices and satisfied with my interpretation of the dexter and trailer owners manuals.

My long time friend/owner of the local Good Year store, which is also a independent tire dealer ( multi brand ) is more than happy to sell and mount LT tires to me on all my trailers. I'm good to go here.

[JIMNLIN]

I have 6000# GAWR vehicle certified axles. I use ST235/80R16 LRE tires inflated to 80 PSI which provides 520# in load capacity reserves per tire. I replace them every three years.

Ouch...thats gotta' hurt. This is the biggest reason I don't use ST tires on my RV trailers. Hell I couldn't afford them.
I've used LT235/85-16 E tires on several trailers with 6k axles and replace them when they reach 50k-55k miles or 7-8 years which ever comes first.

Anywayz the legalistic sounding opinions were hearing from Cal can be read over and over ad nauseam by searching FastEagle on this website (and other rv websites). Don't feed the troll.

[CALandLIN]

gmw photos wrote:
Cal,
I have two questions. First, out of curiosity, given all your research into this subject, what tires are you using on your trailers ? I'm always curious to hear other's experiences when they are based on a lot of research and experience. I have 6000# GAWR vehicle certified axles. I use ST235/80R16 LRE tires inflated to 80 PSI which provides 520# in load capacity reserves per tire. I replace them every three years.

Second question, and a posted photo here. This is a page of the dexter manual, and also a page out of one of my trailer manuals. I merged the two into one picture here. Dexter is an OEM provider.

My question is this: do you think it's fair to say the folks at Dexter, and also the folks at the trailer company ( Titan, in this case ) have also read all the related documentation that you have provided ? They really don't need to, they don't have anything to do with vehicle certification.

And if they have, is it fair to conclude that after they read it, they agreed ( likely in a committee ) it "would be ok to mention the use of LT or ST tires" in the printed manuals ? Dexter is not a tire provider. They have nothing to do with tire selections.

In other words, what I am saying here is that I, as a consumer, am NOT making an arbitrary decision out of my own limited "garage-mahal thinking".
I am, in fact, as a consumer, reading a manual, written by the folks that built the axles, and another manual written by the folks that built the trailer. And THAT point goes back to my much earlier post to this thread, "it's in the manual". The vehicle manufacturer has the sole responsibility for tire selection for all vehicles they build. All highway tires may be fitted to RV trailer axles once they have been approved by the trailer manufacturer. Others may be authorized as options. No others qualify.

See the dialog in blue above.

[CALandLIN]

Huntindog wrote:

CALANDLIN wrote:
However, they are minimal standards and when you are operating outside those standards you can be held accountable for your actions.

In what way?

When you make a statement like that, you should clarify it. Otherwise people will draw a conclusion based on what they think you may be insinuating.

In this case, I think you are reffering to legal problems that may arise in the event of an accident. Or you could be refferring to warranty issues, or perhaps both.

I agree that is a possibility for those (and there is always someone) that puts tires on that are less capable than the "certified" replacements. Those people can and should be held accountable.

But those that go above and beyond the "certified" choice should be fine...There is plenty of evidence out there that shows just how unreliable the "certified" choices have proven to be. Of course any one can be sued for any reason.... Even those participating in this discussion can be sued, just for talking about it. Winning such a lawsuit is an entirely different matter.

There is a link provided by NHTSA where anyone can request an interpretation. I did that and asked them to give me one for "industry Standards". Much like their regulations their answer was short and to the point....."Industry standards generally form the basis for demonstrating product safety and quality before courts, regulators, consumers and others".

[gmw_photos]

Cal,
I have two questions. First, out of curiosity, given all your research into this subject, what tires are you using on your trailers ? I'm always curious to hear other's experiences when they are based on a lot of research and experience.

Second question, and a posted photo here. This is a page of the dexter manual, and also a page out of one of my trailer manuals. I merged the two into one picture here.

My question is this: do you think it's fair to say the folks at Dexter, and also the folks at the trailer company ( Titan, in this case ) have also read all the related documentation that you have provided ?

And if they have, is it fair to conclude that after they read it, they agreed ( likely in a committee ) it "would be ok to mention the use of LT or ST tires" in the printed manuals ?

In other words, what I am saying here is that I, as a consumer, am NOT making an arbitrary decision out of my own limited "garage-mahal thinking".
I am, in fact, as a consumer, reading a manual, written by the folks that built the axles, and another manual written by the folks that built the trailer. And THAT point goes back to my much earlier post to this thread, "it's in the manual".