Ram questions

[Flashman]

Well with almost 200,000 miles on my 2006 2500. I started thinking about a new truck. My current Dodge has the 6 speed manual and I thought I was done with manuals but I noticed that Ram still offers the manual. Does anyone know the horsepower torque and towing of the 2017 Rams equipped with a manual.

[Bedlam]

If you're driving for the experience of driving, performance may well be behind driving input offered by the vehicle. I know when I hop into my my '57 VW with manual steering, brakes and transmission with non-synchro first gear, I can have a great day driving it. But, there are times when I just need to get from point A to B and the experience of getting there is the last thing on my mind.

[ShinerBock]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:
LOL, I'm not trying to change your opinion. I do take stock in what test drivers say about what they drive. Unlike most people they get a chance to drive a lot of different things and can compare many different cars and trucks at once.

Have you driven a new Vett with an 8 speed auto? If not, how do you know you won't enjoy it more? You might? You might not?

Most of my cars were standard. They were fine and worked well. I have no idea if I would like the auto better or not?

I have driven my friends BMW M with paddle shift. I also works well because it's like driving a standard with the advantage of an auto. But I have never driven a new C6 Vett with 8 speed so I don't if I would like it better or not?

Yes, you are. All IdaD and I said is that we like manuals in sports cars for the fun factor and you posted articles about other people disagreeing with our preference. Are we not allowed to prefer sports cars with manual transmission? No, I haven't driven an new Corvette with paddle shifters. I may like it, I may not, but until then I will still say that I prefer a sports car with a manual transmission. I don't see why there is anything wrong with that.

Although my wife owned three paddle shifting cars(BMW,Infiniti, and Mercedes). They were fun and shifted quicker than I could with manual. Even with that, I would still get a manual if it were my secondary sports car.

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

LOL, I'm not trying to change your opinion. I do take stock in what test drivers say about what they drive. Unlike most people they get a chance to drive a lot of different things and can compare many different cars and trucks at once.

Have you driven a new Vett with an 8 speed auto? If not, how do you know you won't enjoy it more? You might? You might not?

Most of my cars were standard. They were fine and worked well. I have no idea if I would like the auto better or not?

I have driven my friends BMW M with paddle shift. I also works well because it's like driving a standard with the advantage of an auto. But I have never driven a new C6 Vett with 8 speed so I don't if I would like it better or not?

[ShinerBock]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:


These guys disagree with you.
I haven't driven a Vett with the new 8 speed and likely never will so I can't speak of which one I would like better. All of my sudo sports cars and most of my cars were standards. All of the big trucks (Class 6)I drove were standards.

All of my pickups were autos and will be autos from now on.

It doesn't really matter anyway. It's like me saying I like tuning carburetors instead of FI. Anybody that says they can out drive a computer is out to lunch and is living in a dreamland. A person might "think" they know which gear is better but it's not so. Modern transmissions can be programed to shift at anytime. The engineers know exactly where they need to be shifted to get the best performance and to meet smog requirements. Not so with a standard.

I predict GPS shift points will be coming on line soon. I say within the next 10 years. Smog requirement are also tightening. With a take rate around 5% and getting less every year the manual is dead or will be soon.

Sorry gear jammers, but your daughters daughter will see your pickups in a museum and ask, "mom, what's that 3rd peddle on the left there for?" :B

I really don't care what they or anyone else thinks about it. How is bringing up someone else's opinion going to change mine? I think a sports car is more fun with a stick shift. I don't care if an auto is quicker, if I am buying a sports car then it is for the enjoyment of the drive. Am I not allowed to have that opinion or are you going to come up with more articles telling me I am wrong for having that opinion?

When it comes to trucks, then that is a different story. However, I am not going to bash the manual truck owners and try to make them feel wrong for liking what they like with articles on other people's opinions.

[rhagfo]

blofgren wrote:

Turtle n Peeps wrote:

I think a lot of the trend towards autos is pure laziness. People nowadays (especially the younger generations) do as little as possible with as little effort as possible. Drinking lattes, texting, putting on makeup, etc. has become much more important than putting effort into anything including driving, learning a new skill, and paying attention.

You would be wrong. I'll give you a hint:

The reason you don't see standard transmissions anymore is the same reason you don't see 7.3 diesel or the 5.9 diesel or any big blocks.

I'll give you another hint: In California in 1969 you could buy a Camaro with a auto and no smog pump. The same year with the same engine with a standard it had to have a smog pump on it.

Laziness has nothing to do with it.

If Trump doesn't kill off more emission restrictions in the future for sure the demise of the standard will even be more quicker.

Emissions is definitely part of it; the rest we will have to agree to disagree. Ford discontinued the ZF6 because of lack of sales of them; that has nothing to do with emissions and much to do with laziness! FCA has stated that they will continue to offer the manual transmission with the Cummins as long as they continue to sell and remain profitable. And a manual transmission is still available in many other vehicles on the market today.

LOL!
If you travel to Europe it cost more and the quantities are limited for auto transmission rentals cars.
.
I get the biggest kick out of renting a car when going to see my DD, SIL and GD in Ireland!!

Yes the typical warning to an American that you need to drive on the other side of the road. Then there is the statement you know you have a manual transmission, yep no problem, even with the shift lever on your left side. 🙂
Lastly many are diesel, the warning that you have a diesel, :h , is there any other type of engine??

Yes, I also have the best anti theft device currently available, a manual transmission.

[blofgren]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:

I think a lot of the trend towards autos is pure laziness. People nowadays (especially the younger generations) do as little as possible with as little effort as possible. Drinking lattes, texting, putting on makeup, etc. has become much more important than putting effort into anything including driving, learning a new skill, and paying attention.

You would be wrong. I'll give you a hint:

The reason you don't see standard transmissions anymore is the same reason you don't see 7.3 diesel or the 5.9 diesel or any big blocks.

I'll give you another hint: In California in 1969 you could buy a Camaro with a auto and no smog pump. The same year with the same engine with a standard it had to have a smog pump on it.

Laziness has nothing to do with it.

If Trump doesn't kill off more emission restrictions in the future for sure the demise of the standard will even be more quicker.

Emissions is definitely part of it; the rest we will have to agree to disagree. Ford discontinued the ZF6 because of lack of sales of them; that has nothing to do with emissions and much to do with laziness! FCA has stated that they will continue to offer the manual transmission with the Cummins as long as they continue to sell and remain profitable. And a manual transmission is still available in many other vehicles on the market today.

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

I think a lot of the trend towards autos is pure laziness. People nowadays (especially the younger generations) do as little as possible with as little effort as possible. Drinking lattes, texting, putting on makeup, etc. has become much more important than putting effort into anything including driving, learning a new skill, and paying attention.

You would be wrong. I'll give you a hint:

The reason you don't see standard transmissions anymore is the same reason you don't see 7.3 diesel or the 5.9 diesel or any big blocks.

I'll give you another hint: In California in 1969 you could buy a Camaro with a auto and no smog pump. The same year with the same engine with a standard it had to have a smog pump on it.

Laziness has nothing to do with it.

If Trump doesn't kill off more emission restrictions in the future for sure the demise of the standard will even be more quicker.

[Bionic_Man]

The new Porsche 911 Turbo hasn't been offered with a manual since about 2012.

My 07 Cayman has a manual, but that was the last year before PDK. If buying today, I'd get the auto all day long.

[blofgren]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:

IdaD wrote:


In a pickup I don't disagree. In a sporty car a stick is still the way to go by a huge margin - a stick and clutch really enhances the driving experience.

I agree, in a sports car you gotta get a standard just for the fun factor alone.

These guys disagree with you.
I haven't driven a Vett with the new 8 speed and likely never will so I can't speak of which one I would like better. All of my sudo sports cars and most of my cars were standards. All of the big trucks (Class 6)I drove were standards.

All of my pickups were autos and will be autos from now on.

It doesn't really matter anyway. It's like me saying I like tuning carburetors instead of FI. Anybody that says they can out drive a computer is out to lunch and is living in a dreamland. A person might "think" they know which gear is better but it's not so. Modern transmissions can be programed to shift at anytime. The engineers know exactly where they need to be shifted to get the best performance and to meet smog requirements. Not so with a standard.

I predict GPS shift points will be coming on line soon. I say within the next 10 years. Smog requirement are also tightening. With a take rate around 5% and getting less every year the manual is dead or will be soon.

Sorry gear jammers, but your daughters daughter will see your pickups in a museum and ask, "mom, what's that 3rd peddle on the left there for?" :B

I don't disagree with you that they will be extinct; look at Ford and GM who discontinued them several years ago. I disagree that an automatic knows which gear to be in at all times. As an example, climbing a grade in the city in my 2012 F-150 will cause the truck to be in 3rd gear. Come up to a traffic light on that grade that turns yellow causing the driver to let off the throttle in preparation for stopping. The truck will instantly shift up to 5th gear even though the driver is looking to stop. A very unnecessary set of shifts and one I see often. Another scenario is when coasting up to a light in about 4th gear, light turns green before stopping and so the driver gives the truck some throttle. The transmission instantly downshifts to 2nd or sometimes 1st depending on speed causing harshness and sudden RPM increase to 3k. These are both scenarios of completely unnecessary shifting that I see often. Why? Because the transmission cannot see the road! There are plenty of other scenarios but those are two that come to top of mind. I would also hate to see what these fancy autos will cost to repair in the future because with them being so complex, expensive trouble is inevitable.

I think a lot of the trend towards autos is pure laziness. People nowadays (especially the younger generations) do as little as possible with as little effort as possible. Drinking lattes, texting, putting on makeup, etc. has become much more important than putting effort into anything including driving, learning a new skill, and paying attention.

Many other parts of the world are still primarily manual transmissions; it seems North America is the exception to this.

In any case, off my soapbox now!:B

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

ShinerBock wrote:

IdaD wrote:


In a pickup I don't disagree. In a sporty car a stick is still the way to go by a huge margin - a stick and clutch really enhances the driving experience.

I agree, in a sports car you gotta get a standard just for the fun factor alone.

These guys disagree with you.
I haven't driven a Vett with the new 8 speed and likely never will so I can't speak of which one I would like better. All of my sudo sports cars and most of my cars were standards. All of the big trucks (Class 6)I drove were standards.

All of my pickups were autos and will be autos from now on.

It doesn't really matter anyway. It's like me saying I like tuning carburetors instead of FI. Anybody that says they can out drive a computer is out to lunch and is living in a dreamland. A person might "think" they know which gear is better but it's not so. Modern transmissions can be programed to shift at anytime. The engineers know exactly where they need to be shifted to get the best performance and to meet smog requirements. Not so with a standard.

I predict GPS shift points will be coming on line soon. I say within the next 10 years. Smog requirement are also tightening. With a take rate around 5% and getting less every year the manual is dead or will be soon.

Sorry gear jammers, but your daughters daughter will see your pickups in a museum and ask, "mom, what's that 3rd peddle on the left there for?" :B

[ShinerBock]

IdaD wrote:


In a pickup I don't disagree. In a sporty car a stick is still the way to go by a huge margin - a stick and clutch really enhances the driving experience.

I agree, in a sports car you gotta get a standard just for the fun factor alone.

[ShinerBock]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:


Your forgetting about the torque multiplication factor of the torque converter. This will be around 2.0 to 2.5 depending. The auto will kill a row boat tranny off of the line because of the torque multiplication factor.

I don't think many truck owners here ricer racers and are concerned about getting off the line quicker.

My data logging shows that the TC does not stay unlocked very long in tow/haul mode with either the 68RFE or AS69RC. It doesn't lock in first, but it quickly locks within a few seconds after the shift in every other gear leaving you locked for a good while in every gear especially with heavy loads.

Now if you want to just mash the pedal down and leave your TC unlocked on every stop just to get to 60 the quickest, then by all means. However, I don't think that transmission and TC will last long doing so.

[IdaD]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:
It may be that's the way it is up north but it's not in the US.

In fact, the last figures I have seen said that somewhere around only 1 in 10 in the US can even drive a standard tranny anymore.

As people get older and die off, less and less people can even drive a standard tranny. Then you have the older people that have knee or hip problems that know how to drive them but don't want them.

Hard times for standard tranny's.

The bottom line is this. A modern automatic tranny has the same or more gears, puts out more power, puts out more torque, gets the same or better mileage than it's standard counterpart. The standard tranny has 0 advantage over a modern automatic tranny.

My prediction is by 2020 to 2023 the standard tranny in LD pickup trucks will go the way of carburetors on engines.

In a pickup I don't disagree. In a sporty car a stick is still the way to go by a huge margin - a stick and clutch really enhances the driving experience.

[drittal]

One advantage to a manual would be shifting when you want it to shift. Modern transmission shift logic seems to be a universal gripe from brand to brand, especially when towing. Manual selection helps, but I have encountered delays on shifts when trying to force downshift etc...