RV Problems

[hohenwald48]

I see a lot of posts on this site and others about problems that folks have with their "new" campers (of all classes).

I wonder how much of this is unrealistic expectations on the part of new RV buyers. As much as it would be nice for RVs to come out of the factory with a failure rate similar to that of automobile manufacturers, is that a realistic hope? Would that make the most basic travel trailer cost in the same realm as a high end motor coach today?

It seems the RV owners with the least number of problems are those who "came up thru the ranks" from tent camping to more complex RVs. The ones who seem to have all the problems are the buyers of large RVs as their first purchase. They are trying to get by without the benefit of the education and experience of working their way up to larger units.

I guess I don't really have a question or a point for that matter. Just rambling.

[deltabravo]

downtheroad wrote:
The best cure for this is being handy and creative and doing most of your own maintenance and repairs and your own, "warranty work."

I stopped running back to the dealer for every fix and adjustment

That's been my mode of operation as well. With a truck camper, it's far more convenient to do my own stuff since it's a hassle to load/unload each time I would have wanted to go to the dealer.

My previous RV was a toy hauler, bought in 2003. There was a problem with the roof, which I found prior to my first trip. I called and made an appointment, but was annoyed that my appointment really meant nothing in regard to when the work would be accomplished, unlike at an auto dealer when I take a truck in for repair/service. The dealer had the unit for about 2 weeks.

That's the last time I ever went in for dealer fixes.
A short time later, I discovered the fuel gauge for the onboard fuel tank wasn't working. I worked with the factory to get parts and fix it myself. A new sending unit needed to be installed in the tank.


Part of the low quality / problems, are likely a result of the low pay at the RV factories, which leads to quick turnover as well as somewhat unskilled people, instead of craftsman doing the work.

I read a recent thread about someone having various plumbing leaks in their unit. Do you think the RV manufactures hire Journeymen plumbing to do the entire plumbing work in a rig? No. The guy doing the plumbing also does cabinet installation, wiring, and whatever else is required in the area of the assembly line where he works.

I've seen some pretty shoddy electrical connections too - 10 gauge wire stripped with 12 awg strippers, so multiple strands of wires got shaved off during the stripping process.

One of my part time jobs is doing RV transport. I do a quick walk through on every rig I haul to make sure all drawers and cabinets are closed. Even though I spend very little time in a unit, I still see obvious lack of care/inattention to detail in some units.

One case in point - the last two units I hauled, the positive battery cable had the wrong sized terminal end on it - the hole was too small, so I couldn't properly hook up the battery.

Both RVs I've owned, I pulled the electrical panel out and fixed a lot of poor wire strip jobs and cleaned things up.
I go through the cabinets and check all the plumbing fittings for tightness too. Should we have to do that? No.
But for the mass produced RVs, isn't not a bad idea to do it.

Back in the 90s I worked for a large inverter manufacturer, which is now part of Xantrex.
I travelled around to FMCA conventions and did field service on our inverters. Even the $250,000 plus coaches have various issues.

[hohenwald48]

It seems that the RV industry and the boat industry are such that if the owner can't take care of things they are destined to be disappointed. Both are hobbies that are best suited for handy folks willing to do-it-yourself. If you are dependent on dealer service your boat or RV will be in the shop more than you like.

Nothing wrong with that. A lot of hobbies are that way. That's why they are hobbies. It's just that some folks get into the hobby without proper preparation and find out it's more like a Robin Williams movie than they thought.

[owenssailor]

As a comparison to quality expectations, yesterday i was talking with a boat owner who has ha new 400 000 dollar power cruiser. Last week wiring caught on fire while he was on the lake. One screw in the wiring system had not been tightened and caused the problem. Marine and RV are both small niche industries compared to the auto industry. It actually is amazing that the RV companies can build a rolling house that works as well as most do for the price that is charged.

[rbpru]

I suspect many buyers would go an extra 10 % for a brand with significant improvements in quality. However, based on what I see from the custom TT market 10 % would not come close to solving the problem.

Other than the obvious incidents when a window falls out, a water tank drops, dead electrical shorts happen and other such catastrophic instances that no one can justify. It seems one person’s crisis is another’s major annoyance.

I doubt that the readers of this post could even agree on the top 10 most important improvements they think the TT industry should make; which they would be willing to pay an extra 10 % for.

[qtla9111]

Right, we wouldn't want to expect a quality product from the U.S.? What?

[itguy08]

TucsonJim wrote:

Your foreign import comment is spot on.

Not really. If you all put away the rose colored glasses, the Hondas, Toyotas, and Nissans of the 70's were unreliable rust buckets too. Even modern Hondas an Toyotas have plenty of issues. But we are told they are "better" so we brush those issues aside.

One of the biggest issues in the RV industry is the limited number of suppliers to the manufacturers. When you only have a couple of primary manufacturers for items such as frames, refrigerators, ACs, etc, the builders are kind of stuck. Maybe some of the foreign imports could be an alternative to the parts that go into these rigs.

No different than the auto industry. There are very few makers of most auto parts. Which is why recalls such as the Takata airbag recall affect so many vehicles. There has been a LOT of consolidation in the industry and there are very few suppliers of parts to all the OEM's in the auto industry.

[GMandJM]

rbpru wrote:
How much more would you pay for more quality in your TT? 10%, 20% or more?

Given the comments on the board about finding the best deal and those greedy sales people, do not look for any changes soon.

To get a better build quality? I'd be willing to go 10 percent more as long as it went into the workers' pockets and not the manufacturer's. Or to hire more/better QC workers, perhaps.

I'm not sure how much incentive that would really be though.

[rbpru]

How much more would you pay for more quality in your TT? 10%, 20% or more?

Given the comments on the board about finding the best deal and those greedy sales people, do not look for any changes soon.

[GMandJM]

seaeagle2 wrote:
I understand that some manufacturers pay on a piecework basis with a quota for the day, finish your quota early, you're done, maybe quantity before quality ?

I've wondered if that's such a good idea. We went on a couple factory tours in Indiana with daily quotas. Those guys really hustled! But does that sacrifice quality?

Your guesses are as good as mine. (Likely better)

[seaeagle2]

I understand that some manufacturers pay on a piecework basis with a quota for the day, finish your quota early, you're done, maybe quantity before quality ?

[GMandJM]

Ahhh...got it. Same thing. Brilliant minds thinking alike again. 😉

[hohenwald48]

GMandJM wrote:

hohenwald48 wrote:
It seems the RV owners with the least number of problems are those who "came up thru the ranks" from tent camping to more complex RVs. The ones who seem to have all the problems are the buyers of large RVs as their first purchase.

I don't think it's necessarily that those of us who "started out on the ground" and worked out way up off of it have fewer issues. (We've had our share at each step Tent-TC-TT-MH.)

More like those who start out farther up the ladder (so to speak) might be more inclined to PANIC about stuff that goes wrong and/or have higher expectations of things being perfect right off the assembly line.

I think that's kind of my point. Those of us who have "come up thru the ranks" have more realistic expectations. Plus we are able to simply fix the small stuff. I've seen new owners have to haul their unit back to the dealer because a fuse blows.

[hohenwald48]

Of course it's possible for RV manufacturers to turn out a quality product on par with automobiles. However, I suspect the cost would be horrendous. I don't know any production numbers but I got to believe that the quantity of RVs manufactured is almost zero compared to the number of autos built. RV manufacturers don't have the economies of scale like auto manufacturers.

Building high quality and keeping the price reasonable is difficult to do. I don't think any of us would be willing to pay $75,000 for an 18' TT even if you could count on having zero problems out the door.

[GMandJM]

hohenwald48 wrote:
It seems the RV owners with the least number of problems are those who "came up thru the ranks" from tent camping to more complex RVs. The ones who seem to have all the problems are the buyers of large RVs as their first purchase.

I don't think it's necessarily that those of us who "started out on the ground" and worked out way up off of it have fewer issues. (We've had our share at each step Tent-TC-TT-MH.)

More like those who start out farther up the ladder (so to speak) might be more inclined to PANIC about stuff that goes wrong and/or have higher expectations of things being perfect right off the assembly line.

[westend]

Cars are built (for the most part) by robots, the parts are smaller and more durable, and most models on the assembly line are a mirror of the one preceding and the next one after. It is a totally different assembly procedure. It would be nice if RV's approached closely to that level but it really can't happen.

What should happen, IMO, is that individual parts of the RV are tested on the factory floor and there should be a QC procedure after delivery at the dealer lot. Between those points, any failures that are redundant should be reengineered so that the component in question has almost a "Zero" fail rate. All of this takes $$$$ and no one is willing to fork it over.