Tow weight

[Ejraste]

Im new to the rv trailer world. I am currently in the market for my 1st travel trailer. The idea is to eventually find a full time/seasonal campground that has full amenities. I have small children and thought it would be a good time to start the process. I currently drive a 2018 f150 xlt supercrew 4x4. The max towing capacity is 7400 lbs and max payload is 1990 lbs. I do want a nice size trailer that we won’t put outgrow anytime soon, so my question it’s what is my max trailer weight? Would it be the 7400 lbs? So ideally, I would want my dry weight to be around 5000 to 6000 lbs? Thanks

[Jebby14]

what are its numbers?

[Ejraste]

GrandpaKip wrote:

Ejraste wrote:
Does anyone have any experience with the 2019 RAM 3.0 eco diesel?? I’m kinda curious about this engine

I considered a diesel before I got the Silverado. All of the ones I looked at had relatively low payloads compared to 1500 gassers. In addition, the cost of diesel fuel, the DEF, and the cost of maintenance kinda put me off.
Don’t get me wrong, I love diesels. Got one in my tractor and had one in my sailboat..
Also, I am only pulling 5000 pounds.
My Silverado is a plain Jane and cost a lot less than the diesels I looked at.
MotorTrend loved the 2020 Ram Ecodiesel.

Yeah there’s a dealership unloading the 2019 diesels they have in stock for under 31k. That’s why I was considering it and wanted feedback.

[GrandpaKip]

Ejraste wrote:
Does anyone have any experience with the 2019 RAM 3.0 eco diesel?? I’m kinda curious about this engine

I considered a diesel before I got the Silverado. All of the ones I looked at had relatively low payloads compared to 1500 gassers. In addition, the cost of diesel fuel, the DEF, and the cost of maintenance kinda put me off.
Don’t get me wrong, I love diesels. Got one in my tractor and had one in my sailboat..
Also, I am only pulling 5000 pounds.
My Silverado is a plain Jane and cost a lot less than the diesels I looked at.
MotorTrend loved the 2020 Ram Ecodiesel.

[wing_zealot]

Ford 3.5 Ecoboost with the 10 sp transmission is a tremendous towing platform. My F150 has a GCVWR of 17,000 lbs., max trailer of 11,500 lbs, payload of 2500 lbs and will get 10 - 11 mpg towing, 22± highway (empty - probably even better if I'd drive the speed limit), and 18.5 mpg as a daily driver.

[Ejraste]

ken56 wrote:
Ejraste, any "hobby" is never an inexpensive undertaking. RVing and towing is a constant learning process. The numbers truck manufacturers and traile manufacturers give you, while accurate, is mostly directed at sales. My truck can pull a 747.....ok, impressive but likely blew the engine doing it. Your truck will pull what you are looking at BUT, as others have said it will be a stressful workout keeping things under control. Short pulls 8 to 10 hours away on mostly flat terrain will be OK. Longer cross country getting into mountains will be a struggle for you and the truck. No matter what engine you have you'll get 9 to 13 MPG every time you tow. More truck to handle the trailer is always a good thing.

Yeah I hear you. I already told the wife that I’ll need a new truck to pull trailer. I’m still looking at half tons but with engines with more torque. I would be fine with the 5.7 hemi in the RAM and the 5.3 in the gmc/Chevy truck’s. I was curious about the 3.0 eco diesel in the 2019 ram 1500 which has 420 lbs -ft of torque.

[ken56]

Ejraste, any "hobby" is never an inexpensive undertaking. RVing and towing is a constant learning process. The numbers truck manufacturers and traile manufacturers give you, while accurate, is mostly directed at sales. My truck can pull a 747.....ok, impressive but likely blew the engine doing it. Your truck will pull what you are looking at BUT, as others have said it will be a stressful workout keeping things under control. Short pulls 8 to 10 hours away on mostly flat terrain will be OK. Longer cross country getting into mountains will be a struggle for you and the truck. No matter what engine you have you'll get 9 to 13 MPG every time you tow. More truck to handle the trailer is always a good thing.

[Grit_dog]

"When’s a pickup a good choice? When it’s subject to IRS rules, and not otherwise. It’s a heavily-compromised vehicle. Least-capable when it matters, as it is MORE likely than the trailer to initiate a loss-of-control incident. ."

Okay buddy. I want to live in your world just for a day to see what it's like.
There's some theoretical validity to your scenario of solid axle vs IFS, however I'm not certain you're right and virtually EVERY vehicle mfg is wrong. Light to heavy duty.

[Ejraste]

Does anyone have any experience with the 2019 RAM 3.0 eco diesel?? I’m kinda curious about this engine

[Slowmover]

Thanks. Yes, I’m looking to buy something we won’t easily outgrow with a nice floor plan. We would def be open to pulling out for Trips in the future. That’s why I’m looking at trailers in 27 to 30 feet range. There’s a lot of trailers in that range with a gvwr under the towing capacity of my truck which is 7400 lbs. that’s for a fully loaded trailer.



There isn’t ANY reason to continually buy travel trailers. My folks bought but one and kept it thirty years. From when I was in high school until my son graduated college.

The five of us traveled the USA, Canada & Mexico for weeks on end, every year.

In retirement my folks were full-timing six months or more at a stretch. Had two tow vehicles over that entire period. (By choice, not necessity).

The TV spec is Solo duty first. A typical RV’er travels but 5k miles per year. The other two-thirds of miles drives the decision. Towing a TT isn’t difficult.

TT weight has little to do with TV spec. What matters is on-road stability. Steering control, braking & handling. Serious accidents are about driver loss-of-control (over-correction), NOT about “weight”.

The new & 20-year stil new-and-clueless imagine that trailer tongue weight is a payload problem, and it isn’t. TW is a placeholder number as TW is NOT a constant. It’s changes continually once underway. It’s the force exerted by a lever. Which extends forward from the trailer axles to the hitch ball.

TW was a problem solved more than fifty years ago by correct use of a weight-distribution hitch. . Change the name of the device to Lever Force Control Unit for a better description.

The hitch ball location — relative to the road — can’t move UP or DOWN or SIDEWAYS without that force being resisted by tires & springs ALL ACROSS the combined rig.

RV’ers who think they have it right (hitch rigging), don’t. Have only set things to counter that force in maybe one direction.

What is at stake is that the TV rear axle NOT lose contact with the road, AND that it resists side-sway without breaking loose.

A live axle (solid axle) TV — the pickup truck — is LIKELIEST to fail in these. 4WD with even limited off-road tire treads make this worse yet.

Too much spring capacity (unused) only exacerbates the problem.

A WDH spreads over ALL THREE axle [sets] the levers attempts to disengage the rear axle tires from their job versus concentration of force at a single point.

A 1,000-lb TW is EASILY handled by car, SUV or minivan. As the axles on the TV see 350-400/lbs after lash-up. (Axle/Tire Capacity chart is what matters).

What’s best TV spec? Family duty. The short version there is fully independent suspension & shortest rear overhang b (distance from rear axle to hitch ball).
Low center-of-gravity, is the other.

When’s a pickup a good choice? When it’s subject to IRS rules, and not otherwise. It’s a heavily-compromised vehicle. Least-capable when it matters, as it is MORE likely than the trailer to initiate a loss-of-control incident. .

Where when solo it’s weight ratio FF/RR is 48-50% equal AS USED DAILY is when it comes into its own. Not otherwise.

Want to be laughed out of the room, tell us about what a good driver you are. Risk-avoidance is statistically ordered.

The worst pair of vehicles in combination is a 4WD pickup with a box-shape travel trailer (including 5’ers) raised for slide-outs and riding on leaf spring suspension.

The opposite end is a high-end European sedan or SUV pulling a truly-aero TT on fully independent suspension.

“Skill” can’t overcome physics. Mario Andretti couldn’t correct from loss of rear axle tire patch contact. There’s not time enough at highway speed. And there’s not an adequate training regimen to introduce familiarity.

Good habits are second to “best” combination rig. Assembling that rig (on RV forums) tries to use the wrong assumptions to correct problems which don’t exist. Usually makes bad into worse. (Where words like Payload and Tow Rating occur. Which don’t exist in the real world of commercial trucking; thus, liability).

Liability is on the operator. “Too fast for conditions”, if a citation is required.

Were these discussions truly about what is safe, physics would play its role. It’s shut out. The other end we’d expect to see discussed. It isn’t: Torsion-Flex axles on the trailer, and anti-lock disc brakes.

Instead we listen to children happy they can GO FASTER on an upgrade (bigger pickup!!) instead of understanding that worsens everything which actually matters.

OP, your family’s miles SOLO miles demand best stability, steering & braking. Towing a trailer is second place. That’s cart & horse In proper order. The two vehicles go together EASILY with minimal changes to TV spec to enhance vacation travel.

It’s not rocket science. And it’s not in TV ads. It’s especially not in an RV crowd where 95% get it wrong (to be generous).

There are Engineering formulas which predict, and there are tests by which you can verify & confirm. Both are missing without a long search, here.

Second to what’s missing (trailer upgrades needed was first), are the tests. Where Joe Smith dialed in his hitch rigging (after Three Pass Scale Method; also corrected tire pressure) to get best braking. His rig — and yours — should stop SOONER once hitched. (Both vehicles loaded for camping with passengers aboard).

The echo chamber of bad advice is king in RV forums. Any site or brand.
It’s subject to a numerical baseline of performance testing. This is always missing. Numbers, not anecdote. Those who don’t understand what’s possible aren’t reliable.

What actually works an eighth grader can parse.

Take your time. (Read).

Good luck!

.

[Jebby14]

if i were you id be after an F250 with the 7.3 gasses because im too cheap to get the 6.7 diesle that i want. could be done with a well equipped half ton but would be much happier with the 3/4 ton. Also loving that godzilla 7.3

[Ejraste]

JIMNLIN wrote:
Don't give up on the F150 'cause yours had the weakest numbers....if your a Ford fan.
Fords F150 has over a dozen different GVWR ratings....4 different RAWR packages.
Of course you know what your F150 numbers are.
But from the top;
#1. 7850 gvwr...4800 rawr....2500 lb in the bed payloads.

#2. 7600 gvwr...4550 rawr... 2200 lb in the bed payloads

#3. 7050 gvwr...4050 rawr... 1800 lb in the bed payloads

#4. 6800 gvwr...3800 rawr...1500 lb in the bed payloads.

#5 . yours
And you can get any of them with the 3.5 ecoboost engine that has 375 hp and a butz kicking 470 lbs torque. And those that own them say they get 20s mpg out on the road not towing.

Ram
Of course the Ram with the 5.7 hemi 4wd crew cab 3.92 gears 8 speed tranny at 395 hp and 410 torque. The 2020 1500 has a 7100 gvwr and 4100 rawr with a 11k tow rating. No problems with the size trailer your looking at.

Chevy/GMC...
1500 crew cab 4wd NHT tow package has the 6.2 engine at 420 hp and 460 torque with the 10 speed tranny 7300 gvwr and 4150 rawr. GM says up to 13400 lb tow rating. The same truck with the 5.3 v8 at 355hp and 383 torque 10 speed tranny won't have any issue with that size trailer.

And of course the 3/4 ton....or one ton SRW and I'm surprised some one hasn't said you gotta' have a one ton DRW.
Go shopping and drive all of them. LOL...we would love to spend your money :B.

1500 GM specs
chevy ordering guide

Fleet ford specs
clicky link

Ram body builders guide specs
ram clicky link

Thanks for the info. Yeah, I’m not a die hard ford fan so I’m open to whatever. But def looks like I’m leaning either to the ram or Sierra/Silverado.

[Grit_dog]

Ejraste wrote:


Yeah, but if so many experienced people on this forum are stating that my little engine will have problems, it’s prob better to just go for a different truck/engine. I’m assuming that most V8’s and the turbo diesel v6’s should be able to pull what I’m looking for which would be a 30 foot 7000 lb trailer. I was looking at a 2018 Sierra with the 5.3L and then potentially looking at the RAMS.

For the record I didn't say your little engine will have problems, I said you may not like how fast it pulls hills. You will not hurt it running it hard a couple days a year. It's a truck not a Faberge egg.

If you upsize the truck, you are definitely getting more power, but you're not getting much in the way of chassis improvements.

I predicted the over analyzing this. Once you get the trailer, literally the only person or object that will care that it's the V6 model is YOU and even then you'll only care going UP hill.
Summer is half over, get to campin! Have fun! Your truck might actually thank you for having a little faith in it!

Remember, just because you don't work your truck doesn't mean there aren't a million of them out there every day pulling trailers and plenty of base model trucks doing it because those are the cheaper work trucks that companies who use trucks buy!

[Grit_dog]

Ejraste wrote:

Very true and i would not max out the trailer with cargo. I would take a separate vehicle to help with cargo as we only want it for a seasonal type campground to go to each year. So I would def keep the numbers low.

Now you're literally only going to tow it to a seasonal campground, so once there, once home? No side trips, summer trips, etc that you mentioned earlier before you "get" a seasonal campsite?
In that case I would 100% NOT consider getting a bigger/badder/worse fuel mileage truck for 2 days a year with a trailer. (I'm assuming your seasonal campsite won't be in Colorado or Nova Scotia or something like that. I'm picturing a couple hundred mile radius of home?
Buy the trailer, hook it up, tow it there, second vehicle, or not, who cares, it's once a year deal.
If you tow it there and don't like how it drives, you can go rent a 3/4 ton for a day to pull it home for like $150.

[JIMNLIN]

Don't give up on the F150 'cause yours had the weakest numbers....if your a Ford fan.
Fords F150 has over a dozen different GVWR ratings....4 different RAWR packages.
Of course you know what your F150 numbers are.
But from the top;
#1. 7850 gvwr...4800 rawr....2500 lb in the bed payloads.

#2. 7600 gvwr...4550 rawr... 2200 lb in the bed payloads

#3. 7050 gvwr...4050 rawr... 1800 lb in the bed payloads

#4. 6800 gvwr...3800 rawr...1500 lb in the bed payloads.

#5 . yours
And you can get any of them with the 3.5 ecoboost engine that has 375 hp and a butz kicking 470 lbs torque. And those that own them say they get 20s mpg out on the road not towing.

Ram
Of course the Ram with the 5.7 hemi 4wd crew cab 3.92 gears 8 speed tranny at 395 hp and 410 torque. The 2020 1500 has a 7100 gvwr and 4100 rawr with a 11k tow rating. No problems with the size trailer your looking at.

Chevy/GMC...
1500 crew cab 4wd NHT tow package has the 6.2 engine at 420 hp and 460 torque with the 10 speed tranny 7300 gvwr and 4150 rawr. GM says up to 13400 lb tow rating. The same truck with the 5.3 v8 at 355hp and 383 torque 10 speed tranny won't have any issue with that size trailer.

And of course the 3/4 ton....or one ton SRW and I'm surprised some one hasn't said you gotta' have a one ton DRW.
Go shopping and drive all of them. LOL...we would love to spend your money :B.

1500 GM specs
chevy ordering guide

Fleet ford specs
clicky link

Ram body builders guide specs
ram clicky link

[Ejraste]

Sjm9911 wrote:
I have an idea for you , rent one to tow, then see how it is before you buy it. A bit more money spent but you will have satisfaction knowing that what you buy will tow similar. Yes i would update the truck. But i like easy, and confterble.

Yeah, but if so many experienced people on this forum are stating that my little engine will have problems, it’s prob better to just go for a different truck/engine. I’m assuming that most V8’s and the turbo diesel v6’s should be able to pull what I’m looking for which would be a 30 foot 7000 lb trailer. I was looking at a 2018 Sierra with the 5.3L and then potentially looking at the RAMS.