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Again, Admin Opening Tongass National Forest...

Yosemite_Sam1
Explorer
Explorer
To loggers, oil companies, miners...

Tell me fellow RVers that you are not ok with this.
45 REPLIES 45

2oldman
Explorer II
Explorer II
Bert Ackerman wrote:
. Your threads/posts, which are nothing more than baiting political hogwash, would be the first on the chopping block.
Hey.. I like baiting political hogwash!!
"If I'm wearing long pants, I'm too far north" - 2oldman

Bert_Ackerman
Explorer
Explorer
Yosemite Sam1 wrote:
Is there a rule here somewhere about stupid posts?

What if children happened to come by this forum and read this?



If not they should draft one up immediatly. Your threads/posts, which are nothing more than baiting political hogwash, would be the first on the chopping block.

avoidcrowds
Explorer
Explorer
Be careful, pigman. You will get flamed for having an opinion based on experience. You should be forming opinions based on emotion. Same with you, Tom/Barb - living close and seeing/reading about the fires is a perspective you are not supposed to share. It may support the Administration's actions.

From what I have read, so far, less than 3.5% of Tongass will be opened for logging. I have not found out how much, or where, the oil development or mining may take place. That is not much of a footprint, when one is trying to balance our lifestyle with protecting the environment, in my opinion. But, I live in Colorado, where much of our forest is dead due to pine beetle infestation, which is due to suppressing fires for too long. Humans know the best way to manage forests - just ask the Forest Service or tree-huggers! (sarcasm)

YosemiteSam, I am not saying you should not be bringing attention to potential impact on a beautiful area. Had you not mentioned it here, I would not have heard about it, or looked into it. However, I do believe in a balanced approach, and understand there are trade-offs. When hiking at Philmont Scout Ranch, they told us to use the existing trail, even where it was worn 6" or a foot into the ground. They called it the "sacrificial zone". This kept the rest of the meadows and forests untracked. I think this is what has to be done to support our lifestyle - some areas are sacrificed for the benefit of the population, while the rest can be preserved. It is a balancing act, that's for sure. But, if we protected everywhere from human impact, we would have much less opportunity for camping, hiking, and enjoying the outdoors. It is almost like you are saying "I have my area for my benefit, but no one else is allowed to create their area of benefit". Or, "I am here, and there are too many people, so ban anyone else from moving in".

Tradeoffs. We live with them every day.
2017.5 Lance 1995
2017 F150 EcoBoost, Max Tow
Most camping off-road

2oldman
Explorer II
Explorer II
RedRollingRoadblock wrote:
He knows much about forest management. Got a rake?
LOL. Forest management? Not this administration.
"If I'm wearing long pants, I'm too far north" - 2oldman

Yosemite_Sam1
Explorer
Explorer
RedRollingRoadblock wrote:
Tom/Barb wrote:
Tongass national forest is plagued each year by numerous wild fires, Better forest management will prevent this.
The president's actions are a good for the forest.


He knows much about forest management. Got a rake?


LOL!

And the answer to lumber oversupply is more lumber?

For lower local and global demand for oil is more oil?

No wonder the multiple bankruptcies.

RedRollingRoadb
Explorer
Explorer
Tom/Barb wrote:
Tongass national forest is plagued each year by numerous wild fires, Better forest management will prevent this.
The president's actions are a good for the forest.


He knows much about forest management. Got a rake?

ppine
Explorer II
Explorer II
I am a retired forester, and worked on a contract on the Tongass for two years. There are no mills left in Alaska. There is not going to be a big timber rush because the area is so remote and hard to get to. There are millions of acres of old growth Sitka spruce and western hemlock forests with some red and yellow cedar. Fires are almost nonexistent because it is so wet. Fuel just keeps building. It is a National Forest subject to the Multiple Use Sustained Yield Act of 1964.

Trust the environmental review process. Not all proposed projects get approved. One of the sensitive issues in SE is the salmon fishery, also plenty of protected wildlife species.

I am with pigman.

Tom_Barb
Explorer
Explorer
Tongass national forest is plagued each year by numerous wild fires, Better forest management will prevent this.
The president's actions are a good for the forest.
2000 Newmar mountain aire 4081 DP, ISC/350 Allison 6 speed, Wrangler JL toad.

pigman1
Explorer
Explorer
Another green joke? This is a National Forrest we're talking about. Remember...The Land Of Many Uses. Not a National Park, Not a Wildlife Preserve, Not a National Monument. Anyone out there ever actually camped (RV'd) in a logged over national forest? I have in a logged over area (the Tongas)in Alaska and it was wonderful. The logging companies maintained the roads, put in campsites (they were free), and furnished free firewood. We watched a bald eagle nest hatch 3 eggs while we were there. The slope was so great we looked DOWN into the nest. But there was NO erosion.

Until the tree huggers started trying to protect every tree, the logging industry in Alaska thrived. Yes, there were abuses, but those have ceased and the current management practices work well. It's a balance, trees grow and die, streams erode with or without logging, wildlife locate to the best area for them, be it virgin forest or cut over land renewing itself with planted trees.

Lets start to get real folks. Go camp there, THEN start to see what's really happening. Watch a grizzly use the Alaska Pipeline as a super highway for travel because it's easier than traveling the tundra, watch Musk Oxen using a 1 acre field surrounded by oil pipes at Prudhoe Bay as a refuge while their calves nursed and cavorted, and watch the horses and cattle grazing within 50' of producing oil wells in the Texas Permian Basin.

The vast majority of the **** you read is some die hard tree hugger who was never there, feeding stories to gullible news writers who are looking for a headline about anything. Wake Up and SEE IT then start a reasonable conversation.
Pigman & Piglady
2013 Tiffin Allegro Bus 43' QGP
2011 Chevy Silverado 1500
SMI Air Force One toad brake
Street Atlas USA Plus

NRALIFR
Explorer
Explorer
Trigger warning to children: Humor at the expense of environmentalism follows!

What else are we going to make all those paper straws from? :W

:):)
2001 Lance 1121 on a 2016 F450 โ€˜Scuse me while I whinge.
And for all you Scooby-Doo and Yosemite Sam typesโ€ฆโ€ฆโ€ฆ..Letโ€™s Go Brandon!!!

DutchmenSport
Explorer
Explorer
No clue what this discussion is about. My head is already in the sand ... um... or how about ... in the corn field! I'm from Indiana you know, dodging combines on the road.

pasusan
Explorer
Explorer
^ You are right - personally I want to put my head firmly in the sand for the next year and a half.

Susan & Ben [2004 Roadtrek 170]
href="https://sites.google.com/view/pasusan-trips/home" target="_blank">Trip Pics

JRscooby
Explorer II
Explorer II
Very few pay attention to what is going on...

Yosemite_Sam1
Explorer
Explorer
Is there a rule here somewhere about stupid posts?

What if children happened to come by this forum and read this?

Yosemite_Sam1
Explorer
Explorer
2oldman wrote:
No, I'm not. I don't know he keeps doing this without any pushback, let alone why he's doing it.


When even people who are adversely affected like us wonโ€™t pushback, who else would we expect?

Or maybe like farmers only did when their pocketbooks and livelihood were threatened โ€” hopefully not too late.