Tow Rig question SRW or DRW for 5th RAM

[RokNDmax]

I'm sure this has been debated millions of times, but here is a new spin.

At what weight would you consider a DRW to be mandatory whilst towing a fifth wheel ?

10k
11k
12k
13k
14k
15k
16k
17k
18k
19k
20k


or other.

For background, looking at new Ram 3500's, the SRW payload is @ 4400, and the DRW is 5600. Lots has changed in the last few years, but I realize a # is only a # and a DRW may feel more safe and secure even though the SRW isn't technically overloaded. Will be buying both a new truck and fiver in the next few months, so everything is still wide open.

PS - Could not find a good thread discussing by weight, if you know of one, feel free to post.
PSS - Sorry this has been done, feel free to ignore if you don't wish to discuss again...

Thanks !

[IdaD]

goducks10 wrote:

Bobandshawn wrote:
One issue, which I consider a big issue, with the Ram trucks is the only gear ratio available unless you get the DRW option is 3.42. I know that diesel is a torque monster, but 3.42?
I really wanted a Mega Cab DRW rig but the price and difficulties living with it when I don't tow that much just wasn't in the cards. I ended up with a 2500 Mega Cab short bed with the 6.4 Hemi and 4.10 gears. $45K sticker ($10K off) and fully loaded. I have the air suspension which I probably would of never ordered, but now that I have it I really like it. I still just have a pull trailer with a hitch weight of about 850 lbs. Drop the hitch on the ball and the truck makes some RD D2 noises and boom-it raises right back up. My payload on the 6.4 is about 2900 lbs and tow weight is 15.5K lbs so I'll be looking at a 12-12.5 max weight rig with a dry hitch weight of 1700-1800 lbs.

The difference is the TQ of the Cummins. Most reviews of guys towing upwards of 8-9000lbs with the 6.4 and even 4.10 gears complain about the 1-2 spacing when in certain situations. It won't shift up to 3rd and if it does it bogs when under certain speeds. Never hear that with guys towing 9,10,11,12,000lbs or more and 3.42s with the Cummins. Same tranny too.

As to the OP get the DRW if you're pushing 3000lb on the pin. That doesn't leave much left for passengers or other gear in the truck. If you can handle the up cost of the DRW and the driving then get the DRW. Never heard anyone complain when towing with a DRW.

Same tranny ratios but the 6.4 uses the 66RFE versus the 68RFE for the CTD.

[goducks10]

Bobandshawn wrote:
One issue, which I consider a big issue, with the Ram trucks is the only gear ratio available unless you get the DRW option is 3.42. I know that diesel is a torque monster, but 3.42?
I really wanted a Mega Cab DRW rig but the price and difficulties living with it when I don't tow that much just wasn't in the cards. I ended up with a 2500 Mega Cab short bed with the 6.4 Hemi and 4.10 gears. $45K sticker ($10K off) and fully loaded. I have the air suspension which I probably would of never ordered, but now that I have it I really like it. I still just have a pull trailer with a hitch weight of about 850 lbs. Drop the hitch on the ball and the truck makes some RD D2 noises and boom-it raises right back up. My payload on the 6.4 is about 2900 lbs and tow weight is 15.5K lbs so I'll be looking at a 12-12.5 max weight rig with a dry hitch weight of 1700-1800 lbs.

The difference is the TQ of the Cummins. Most reviews of guys towing upwards of 8-9000lbs with the 6.4 and even 4.10 gears complain about the 1-2 spacing when in certain situations. It won't shift up to 3rd and if it does it bogs when under certain speeds. Never hear that with guys towing 9,10,11,12,000lbs or more and 3.42s with the Cummins. Same tranny too.

As to the OP get the DRW if you're pushing 3000lb on the pin. That doesn't leave much left for passengers or other gear in the truck. If you can handle the up cost of the DRW and the driving then get the DRW. Never heard anyone complain when towing with a DRW.

[lawnspecialties]

I have a Ford. I know Ram and Ford are two different animals: similar yet different. But for me, 16,000-17,000 lbs. is a plenty for an SRW but hitch weight is my biggest factor. Around 3500 lbs. on the pin and then I'd go with a dually.

Coming from a former F450 owner, I'd rather cut my choices of camper down versus buy another dually. Just my .02.

[IdaD]

Bobandshawn wrote:

rhagfo wrote:


Ho you gassers that don't understand the power of TORQUE! :S


Should have got the diesel with 3.42's :B

That said, you got a very good engine and gear ratio, and it will server you, very well.

To the OP's question: I would consider the break point around 15K, although if I were to replace our 2500, likely get a 3500 DRW.

In the 2500 flavor the 6.4 has about 1000 lbs more cargo capacity than the 3.42 geared CTD and the tow capacity of the Hemi is a nominal 50 lbs higher. That 1,900 cargo capacity wasn't cutting it for me on the CTD. I didn't want a 3500 and couldn't justify the $6,000 extra cost for a CTD and I certainly didn't find a CTD $10K off sticker so I'd of paid at least $15K more! I get worse mileage, but once you figure the added cost of diesel and that stupid DEF stuff I'd have to drive a lot of miles to make ends meet. My current mileage is averaging about 11.5 city and 17-18 highway. Towing my 8,500 lb trailer I am pushing it to get 10 mpg. Of course the power is such I am towing faster. And I love that Hemi sound.

Regarding capacity, true on paper but meaningless in the real world. The 6.4 and CTD weigh almost exactly the same at the rear axle empty, and both have identical rear axle/suspension setups with the same RAWR of 6500 lbs - there is no difference at all in how they would physically carry a load or pin weight. Not to rub salt in an open wound but I got just a hair under $12k off on my CTD - sticker was $51k and I paid just over $39k. It's a well optioned Tradesman.

As far as OP's question goes, I would start thinking about DRW in the 14-15k range. I don't ever see myself wanting a trailer that big, though, cause at that size I would be pretty limited in terms of where I could take it.

[Bobandshawn]

rhagfo wrote:


Ho you gassers that don't understand the power of TORQUE! :S


Should have got the diesel with 3.42's :B

That said, you got a very good engine and gear ratio, and it will server you, very well.

To the OP's question: I would consider the break point around 15K, although if I were to replace our 2500, likely get a 3500 DRW.

In the 2500 flavor the 6.4 has about 1000 lbs more cargo capacity than the 3.42 geared CTD and the tow capacity of the Hemi is a nominal 50 lbs higher. That 1,900 cargo capacity wasn't cutting it for me on the CTD. I didn't want a 3500 and couldn't justify the $6,000 extra cost for a CTD and I certainly didn't find a CTD $10K off sticker so I'd of paid at least $15K more! I get worse mileage, but once you figure the added cost of diesel and that stupid DEF stuff I'd have to drive a lot of miles to make ends meet. My current mileage is averaging about 11.5 city and 17-18 highway. Towing my 8,500 lb trailer I am pushing it to get 10 mpg. Of course the power is such I am towing faster. And I love that Hemi sound.

[Golden_HVAC]

Glendale RV used to make a bunch of fifth wheels that where easy to pull with a 3/4 ton truck, and therefore a 1 ton SRW would work fine with those. They placed the fresh water tanks near the trailer axles, so that helped keep the pin weight down pretty low. A Glendale Titanium could be 36' long and 16,000 GVWR with a 2,200 pound pin weight. But most fifth wheels are heavier pin weights than that manufacture produced.

So by 15,000 I would be looking for dual rear wheels for more capacity. More because the heavy fifth wheel nose can push the back of the truck sideways into the curves on a downgrade.

Yes they are making single rear wheel 3500 and F-350's much stronger than in years past. I can recall the 1980 F-350 and GM 3500 dually having a 10,000 GVWR. While in 2005, the crewcab F-250 SRW had a 10,000 GVWR and the F-350 SRW's had 11,500 pound GVWR.

With a 4,400 pound cargo rating, it seems like the RAM has a high enough cargo rating to tow a very large fifth wheel, without needing to upgrade to DRW.

I wish they would build a F-450 with super single rear tires. You can buy 19.5" rims with a 5,500 pound capacity, leading to a 11,000 pound rear axle weight rating without anything special, and combine that with a 6,000 pound front axle rating, you would have a 16,000GVWR with SRW skinniness.

Good luck,

Fred.

[cummins2014]

Bobandshawn wrote:
One issue, which I consider a big issue, with the Ram trucks is the only gear ratio available unless you get the DRW option is 3.42. I know that diesel is a torque monster, but 3.42?
I really wanted a Mega Cab DRW rig but the price and difficulties living with it when I don't tow that much just wasn't in the cards. I ended up with a 2500 Mega Cab short bed with the 6.4 Hemi and 4.10 gears. $45K sticker ($10K off) and fully loaded. I have the air suspension which I probably would of never ordered, but now that I have it I really like it. I still just have a pull trailer with a hitch weight of about 850 lbs. Drop the hitch on the ball and the truck makes some RD D2 noises and boom-it raises right back up. My payload on the 6.4 is about 2900 lbs and tow weight is 15.5K lbs so I'll be looking at a 12-12.5 max weight rig with a dry hitch weight of 1700-1800 lbs.

Totally disagree . You might consider it a big issue, but its no issue with the 3:42 gears and 6.7 Cummins. I tow with a 2014 Ram 3500 Megacab 6.7. Fifth wheel is over 13K, you can rest assured those 3:42 gears work just fine . It is a torque monster, and no question marks on the 3:42 gears .

Personally after towing with what weight I have, I wouldn't want any lower gears, now that could change if I went up in weight, but then I would start to get into dually range, and that will never happen. So perfectly happy with the 3:42

I could see lower gears with gas or more weight .

[Arcamper]

Halmfamily wrote:
I've towed my fifth wheel at 14600 lbs with both a SRW 3500 and now a DRW 3500. The DRW feels much more stable with no side to side wiggle I had in the SRW. As for weight I think it's a matter of what you're comfortable with and within your trucks specs. As for me I'll always have a DRW.

Makes a lot of sense. I pulled my Laredo with my last 2500 and my 3500 DRW and with the same weight that is within spec for the 2500, you could tell a big difference. If you have 4k lbs in the bed of a SRW you can be fine going down the road but when that car pulls out or something makes you have to make a hard maneuver the DRW will always be more stable and give you a better chance at recovery. At 3400 lbs on the pin I could get by with a 3500 SRW but for my own and my family's safety I went with the DRW and have never looked back.

[rhagfo]

Bobandshawn wrote:
One issue, which I consider a big issue, with the Ram trucks is the only gear ratio available unless you get the DRW option is 3.42. I know that diesel is a torque monster, but 3.42?
I really wanted a Mega Cab DRW rig but the price and difficulties living with it when I don't tow that much just wasn't in the cards. I ended up with a 2500 Mega Cab short bed with the 6.4 Hemi and 4.10 gears. $45K sticker ($10K off) and fully loaded. I have the air suspension which I probably would of never ordered, but now that I have it I really like it. I still just have a pull trailer with a hitch weight of about 850 lbs. Drop the hitch on the ball and the truck makes some RD D2 noises and boom-it raises right back up. My payload on the 6.4 is about 2900 lbs and tow weight is 15.5K lbs so I'll be looking at a 12-12.5 max weight rig with a dry hitch weight of 1700-1800 lbs.

Ho you gassers that don't understand the power of TORQUE! :S

My 2001 with less than 280 HP, and about maybe 600 lb. ft. of torque tows 11,000# (19,500# GCVW) easy with 3.55's, that includes up hills, with 290,000 miles on the clock!!
Should have got the diesel with 3.42's :B

That said, you got a very good engine and gear ratio, and it will server you, very well.

To the OP's question: I would consider the break point around 15K, although if I were to replace our 2500, likely get a 3500 DRW.

[Bobandshawn]

One issue, which I consider a big issue, with the Ram trucks is the only gear ratio available unless you get the DRW option is 3.42. I know that diesel is a torque monster, but 3.42?
I really wanted a Mega Cab DRW rig but the price and difficulties living with it when I don't tow that much just wasn't in the cards. I ended up with a 2500 Mega Cab short bed with the 6.4 Hemi and 4.10 gears. $45K sticker ($10K off) and fully loaded. I have the air suspension which I probably would of never ordered, but now that I have it I really like it. I still just have a pull trailer with a hitch weight of about 850 lbs. Drop the hitch on the ball and the truck makes some RD D2 noises and boom-it raises right back up. My payload on the 6.4 is about 2900 lbs and tow weight is 15.5K lbs so I'll be looking at a 12-12.5 max weight rig with a dry hitch weight of 1700-1800 lbs.

[dwayneb236]

Every time I read a post like this it makes me more and more happy I went ahead and got a dually. The wife tried to talk me out of it, but talked with some rodeo guys who informed her dually was the way to go. Now just waiting on my new trailer..

Loaded max for our trailer will be 16800

[Bionic_Man]

jmtandem wrote:

At what weight would you consider a DRW to be mandatory whilst towing a fifth wheel ?

Mandatory? Not sure. But at around 16,000 pounds I would want a dually. At around 12-13,000 the diesel. At 16,000 pounds pin weight will be at or around 3200 pounds, plus the hitch, plus all the people and stuff in the truck. You will likely be close to payload gross on a SRW.

With the new trucks, I am mostly in agreement, although I would probably push it up to 17k. Still plenty of payload there for everything else that goes with the trailer.

[Halmfamily]

I've towed my fifth wheel at 14600 lbs with both a SRW 3500 and now a DRW 3500. The DRW feels much more stable with no side to side wiggle I had in the SRW. As for weight I think it's a matter of what you're comfortable with and within your trucks specs. As for me I'll always have a DRW.

[RokNDmax]

1 - 13.5k
4 - 16k
1 - 15k

🙂

[dave17352]

15k absolute limit. I base that on how my truck handles my 12k wet 5th wheel. Which is great. This of course is a pure guess. I have nearly a 4k payload. But I don't think I would want anymore than 3k on the pin. I base this on how my truck handles with my truck camper fully loaded. Which gets right at my payload capacity. I am fine with the TC. But I wouldn't like the ride if I had a huge trailer behind me also. JMHO